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Celtics may trade out of #1?
Posted on 6/16/17 at 4:11 pm
Posted on 6/16/17 at 4:11 pm
Several including Stein and Woj reporting that Celtics deep into discussion with Sixers to trade our of #1 for a package of picks from Sixers.
This post was edited on 6/16/17 at 4:12 pm
Posted on 6/16/17 at 4:18 pm to NOSHAU
If the Celtics pull that off, they are out-sixering the sixers.
Posted on 6/16/17 at 4:22 pm to Jester
More importantly, the Sixers would have much less reason to go after Holiday if they are trading up for Fultz.
Posted on 6/16/17 at 4:24 pm to TigerinATL
Fultz over Holiday no-brainer.
Posted on 6/16/17 at 4:32 pm to Jester
seems more like a play to, eventually, overwhelm Indiana or Chicago with picks for George or Butler. or swoop in for the next star available
#1 for #3, Lakers 2018 #1, and Kings 2019 #1? and they still have the Nets pick next year...
#1 for #3, Lakers 2018 #1, and Kings 2019 #1? and they still have the Nets pick next year...
Posted on 6/16/17 at 5:04 pm to NOSHAU
Not a bad deal for the Celtics, they don't need a PG, drop to #3 and get Jackson.
Posted on 6/16/17 at 5:10 pm to DudeK2
quote:
Not a bad deal for the Celtics, they don't need a PG, drop to #3 and get Jackson.
What if the Lakers take Jackson?
Posted on 6/16/17 at 5:17 pm to Broski
Then I still get to laugh at Ball so win win
Posted on 6/16/17 at 5:25 pm to DudeK2
If the Suns take Fox at #4, Bledsoe would be expendable. I am rooting for Fox to Pheonix.
Posted on 6/16/17 at 5:48 pm to corndeaux
quote:
seems more like a play to, eventually, overwhelm Indiana or Chicago with picks for George or Butler. or swoop in for the next star available
#1 for #3, Lakers 2018 #1, and Kings 2019 #1? and they still have the Nets pick next year...
The way it was looking initially made Boston look silly but the latest reports actually make this make sense. That's a freaking HAUL. If you're the Sixers, screw it. Simmons and Fultz is a combo that could be really really fricking good in a few years. If Embiid can stay healthy, lord. Not to mention they have ONE guy under contract past next year not including all the team options and qualifying offers. Bayless at 8.5m. Bird rights to Simmons/Fultz/Saric/Embiid/Luwawu.
Ping pong balls are always a gamble.
Posted on 6/16/17 at 6:17 pm to ShamelessPel
yeah. it's a no-brainer for the Sixers. a 3 man core like that was the entire point of The Process. send out the picks.
for Celtics, you're right; it is a gamble. though i do think the Lakers+Nets picks next year are both going to be top 5.
i've seen chatter about the salary difference between 1 and 3 helping them too. if they are keeping #3, maybe they think this helps them get Hayward AND Butler or George this summer? that would be a hell of an off-season.
for Celtics, you're right; it is a gamble. though i do think the Lakers+Nets picks next year are both going to be top 5.
i've seen chatter about the salary difference between 1 and 3 helping them too. if they are keeping #3, maybe they think this helps them get Hayward AND Butler or George this summer? that would be a hell of an off-season.
Posted on 6/16/17 at 6:32 pm to corndeaux
quote:
for Celtics, you're right; it is a gamble. though i do think the Lakers+Nets picks next year are both going to be top 5.
i've seen chatter about the salary difference between 1 and 3 helping them too. if they are keeping #3, maybe they think this helps them get Hayward AND Butler or George this summer? that would be a hell of an off-season
I phrased that poorly. I meant it's a gamble on the Philly side. You aren't guaranteed to get that top slot even if those teams suck, so go get your man. For Boston it's much less a gamble. They likely wouldn't even see where the picks fell. They are just a means to an end. I liked the possibilities Fultz gave them of moving past Thomas, but the scenario you presented is incredible for them if it happens. You land Hayward or Butler, the dreams of convincing PG13 to re-up next year become a possible reality.
Posted on 6/16/17 at 10:07 pm to NOSHAU
I think this would be a great deal. Trading down from #1 to #3 has worked out well before for the celtics, when it got them Parish and McHale In 1980.
I wouldn't necessarily be hell bent on trading the treasure trove of picks for Paul George. It's too much to gamble on a guy that could bolt in a year and if he doesn't he will hurt their financial flexibility. I think it's best if they don't trade their picks, since they could potentially add Gordon Hayward or Blake Griffin this off season and have the valuable rookie contracts.
I wouldn't necessarily be hell bent on trading the treasure trove of picks for Paul George. It's too much to gamble on a guy that could bolt in a year and if he doesn't he will hurt their financial flexibility. I think it's best if they don't trade their picks, since they could potentially add Gordon Hayward or Blake Griffin this off season and have the valuable rookie contracts.
Posted on 6/16/17 at 10:12 pm to NOSHAU
Also, I don't get the buzz with the celtics trading for an elite perimeter player. Their weakness was undoubtedly rebounding during the playoffs. I don't see PG13 or Butler fixing that.
Posted on 6/17/17 at 7:02 am to ShamelessPel
Isiah thomas must be thrilled.
With Jackson, the current Celtics, and either heyward or butler, celtics will compete and with two more high picks in near future, they will be in finals vs lebrons lakers in 2019.
With Jackson, the current Celtics, and either heyward or butler, celtics will compete and with two more high picks in near future, they will be in finals vs lebrons lakers in 2019.
Posted on 6/17/17 at 7:30 am to Pelicans8
we just saw the two best teams in the league overwhelm everyone else with perhaps the best perimeter play and shooting the league has ever seen. if you want to beat them, you need lots of guys who can at least compete defensively. Brown, Jackson, Crowder, Smart, Bradley, Rozier. even if they lose a couple of those guys to add Butler or George, there's a theme developing.
everyone goes small to turbo charge offense. and the Warriors have an unstoppable offense. but what makes the Warriors an all-time team is that their defense in the Death Lineup is so dominant (96 DRating in 50 minutes in the Finals w/ Livingston or Iguodala + their big 4)
rebounding is a flaw for Boston. a couple of things though:
if they see it as a fatal flaw, they could just go after Blake Griffin instead of Hayward in FA. i wouldnt trust his body and paying $60M annually for the next three years of Horford/Griffin seems unwise, but who knows.
it can be more about entire team rebounding than finding a dominant big. Steph Curry outrebounded Tristan Thompson in a series. you can overcome a size disadvantage with disciplined, dedicated play. will all 5 guys be willing and able to do the dirty work?
everyone goes small to turbo charge offense. and the Warriors have an unstoppable offense. but what makes the Warriors an all-time team is that their defense in the Death Lineup is so dominant (96 DRating in 50 minutes in the Finals w/ Livingston or Iguodala + their big 4)
rebounding is a flaw for Boston. a couple of things though:
if they see it as a fatal flaw, they could just go after Blake Griffin instead of Hayward in FA. i wouldnt trust his body and paying $60M annually for the next three years of Horford/Griffin seems unwise, but who knows.
it can be more about entire team rebounding than finding a dominant big. Steph Curry outrebounded Tristan Thompson in a series. you can overcome a size disadvantage with disciplined, dedicated play. will all 5 guys be willing and able to do the dirty work?
Posted on 6/17/17 at 8:25 am to corndeaux
Yes, I agree with you, elite perimeter players are needed to win a title. However, the celtics aren't an elite perimeter player away from actually beating the Cavaliers, much less the Warriors. It's better in the long run for them to keep the picks and build through the draft and retain financial flexibility.
Let's say you trade for Paul George, and he's gone in a year. You most likely give up two-three potential top five picks for one year of maybe bringing the cavaliers to six games instead of losing in five or four (that's IF they make it there, they could have easily lost in any round before the conference finals).
Even if Paul George stays, the cap situation would be awful (especially if they give the max to Thomas). You would essentially invest about 80-90 million on a core who probably has a 5% chance at winning the title.
They're better off in the long run if they trade down to #3 and keep all the players they draft. I don't see Thomas as the point guard who can win a championship, his defense is mediocre and the celtics' motion offense they ran when he was out looked more efficient than Thomas running isolation play after isolation play.
Let's say you trade for Paul George, and he's gone in a year. You most likely give up two-three potential top five picks for one year of maybe bringing the cavaliers to six games instead of losing in five or four (that's IF they make it there, they could have easily lost in any round before the conference finals).
Even if Paul George stays, the cap situation would be awful (especially if they give the max to Thomas). You would essentially invest about 80-90 million on a core who probably has a 5% chance at winning the title.
They're better off in the long run if they trade down to #3 and keep all the players they draft. I don't see Thomas as the point guard who can win a championship, his defense is mediocre and the celtics' motion offense they ran when he was out looked more efficient than Thomas running isolation play after isolation play.
Posted on 6/17/17 at 8:48 am to corndeaux
Danny Ainge is an absolute boss.
Posted on 6/17/17 at 8:58 am to Pelicans8
obviously you dont sell the farm for an expiring George unless you're very confident he wont bolt.
a core of Butler/George, Horford, Thomas, and Hayward/Griffin is a much more serious threat to the Cavs than you are insinuating. beating LeBron is tough for everyone, but that team would have a hell of a recipe and it would be fun to watch.
Boston's problem is that they really dont have much top end talent- and the talent they do have is, as you point out with Thomas, flawed in a serious way. it's to their credit that they win so many games, but when you're getting bailed out by Kelly Olynyk in a game 7, you're a paper tiger.
plus, if they land two marquee players this summer, that makes moving on from Thomas much easier to swallow
while i get the play, if they are going to hoard picks to be contenders 4-5 years from now, there is no reason to chase FA this summer (nor do i think a guy like Hayward is signing on to wait years for a bunch of rookies to probably not become as good as he is). and if that is the plan, might as well start selling other players off more assets.
maybe that's what Ainge wants to do. and that's fine. i'd rather see them go for it b/c i think they could be very good.
a core of Butler/George, Horford, Thomas, and Hayward/Griffin is a much more serious threat to the Cavs than you are insinuating. beating LeBron is tough for everyone, but that team would have a hell of a recipe and it would be fun to watch.
Boston's problem is that they really dont have much top end talent- and the talent they do have is, as you point out with Thomas, flawed in a serious way. it's to their credit that they win so many games, but when you're getting bailed out by Kelly Olynyk in a game 7, you're a paper tiger.
plus, if they land two marquee players this summer, that makes moving on from Thomas much easier to swallow
while i get the play, if they are going to hoard picks to be contenders 4-5 years from now, there is no reason to chase FA this summer (nor do i think a guy like Hayward is signing on to wait years for a bunch of rookies to probably not become as good as he is). and if that is the plan, might as well start selling other players off more assets.
maybe that's what Ainge wants to do. and that's fine. i'd rather see them go for it b/c i think they could be very good.
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