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re: The Herd: LeBron Most "Valuable" Player...numbers don't lie
Posted on 5/9/16 at 1:27 pm to imraged
Posted on 5/9/16 at 1:27 pm to imraged
quote:
He always gives high effort in situations where he's switched onto a bigger player and has a great feel and quick hands for coming away with steals.
And comparing to the VALUE to a team..Lebron can guard, PG, SG, SF, PF, and Center...
cmon now...
2
Posted on 5/9/16 at 1:27 pm to 13SaintTiger
quote:they absolutely are not better than cleveland
You replace LBJ with PG13 and whatever team LBJ falls on likely becomes the favorite sans GS.
and paul george was just an example. if you think steph curry is replaceable, then lebron sure as shite is when steph is literally the best player above replacement level in the NBA
Posted on 5/9/16 at 1:28 pm to 13SaintTiger
Posted on 5/9/16 at 1:28 pm to longhorn22
quote:
They days of working on your craft and post game or driving to the goal and taking someone 1 on 1 is disappearing.
Curry is one of the best iso scorers and finishers at the rim in the league. In fact his increased ability to get to and finish there has probably been the largest improvement in his game from all-star to (should be) unanimous MVP. Someone like Lillard, who shoots a full 10 percentage points less than Curry at the rim on similar volume, doesn't even begin to compare.
Posted on 5/9/16 at 1:29 pm to longhorn22
That was in comparison to Lillard. Obviously LeBron is more valuable defensively.
Posted on 5/9/16 at 1:29 pm to longhorn22
quote:
Lebron can guard, PG, SG, SF, PF, and Center...
Only ever guards maybe 2 or 3 of those positions in a given game
Posted on 5/9/16 at 1:29 pm to theunknownknight
quote:
The Cavs lost 75% of their roster (to FA, injury and retirement) and their coach in 2010. I've actually broken this down on this board to dispel the myth you are propagating in the OP.
I don't really care about the 2016 MVP one way or the other, but this take is a bit simplistic because you're looking at it in a vacuum. A large portion of the FA/retirement issue, and the eventual coaching change, was directly attributable to LeBron leaving.
LeBron is one of the few players in the league who brings value above and beyond his own numbers. When he is on a team, free agents are more apt to sign and veterans are more likely to take a pay cut in an attempt to win a ring. When he leaves, players leave with him. That shouldn't be taken into account within the context of the league MVP, but it definitely adds to his overall legacy. Within reason, players want to play on his teams.
Posted on 5/9/16 at 1:29 pm to RTR America
quote:
Steph breaks team's defenses. There is some value to that.
LeBron does that, AND MORE...
Posted on 5/9/16 at 1:30 pm to WestCoastAg
quote:
not really. boom is about to come in here and yell all day about VORP
Posted on 5/9/16 at 1:30 pm to longhorn22
quote:Yea, me too.
Yet again...talking VALUE
quote:Did you not see the ON/OFF numbers I posted?
His Value to GS isn't that great
Posted on 5/9/16 at 1:31 pm to longhorn22
quote:Why are you ignoring that there are metrics that measure VALUE????
Yet again...talking VALUE.
Guess who leads the league in those metrics?
Steph Curry!
Posted on 5/9/16 at 1:31 pm to WestCoastAg
quote:
then lebron sure as shite is when steph is literally the best player above replacement level in the NBA
refer to the opening post on this thread...the LeBron Value to a team is irreplaceable
Posted on 5/9/16 at 1:32 pm to shel311
if only we had a way to quantify players values. oh wait
Value Over Replacement Player
1. Stephen Curry ? GSW 9.8
2. Russell Westbrook ? OKC 8.3
3. LeBron James ? CLE 7.6
4. James Harden ? HOU 6.9
5. Kevin Durant ? OKC 6.4
6. Kyle Lowry ? TOR 6.3
7. Kawhi Leonard ? SAS 6.2
8. Chris Paul ? LAC 6.0
9. Draymond Green ? GSW 5.6
10. Paul Millsap ? ATL 4.9
Value Over Replacement Player
1. Stephen Curry ? GSW 9.8
2. Russell Westbrook ? OKC 8.3
3. LeBron James ? CLE 7.6
4. James Harden ? HOU 6.9
5. Kevin Durant ? OKC 6.4
6. Kyle Lowry ? TOR 6.3
7. Kawhi Leonard ? SAS 6.2
8. Chris Paul ? LAC 6.0
9. Draymond Green ? GSW 5.6
10. Paul Millsap ? ATL 4.9
Posted on 5/9/16 at 1:32 pm to longhorn22
quote:
LeBron does that, AND MORE...
Teams are sagging of Bron nowadays. Teams are having to defend Steph out to 40 feet.
Posted on 5/9/16 at 1:33 pm to longhorn22
quote:but hes not even the most valuable player in the league. steph is worth a full 2 points more per 100 possessions
.the LeBron Value to a team is irreplaceable
This post was edited on 5/9/16 at 1:33 pm
Posted on 5/9/16 at 1:33 pm to longhorn22
quote:
His Value to GS isn't that great..thats why there is no need to rush him back
What the good frick?
The numbers over the course of 82 games say otherwise.
This post was edited on 5/9/16 at 1:33 pm
Posted on 5/9/16 at 1:33 pm to WestCoastAg
Another metric:
GP MPG TS% AST TO USG ORR DRR REBR PER VA EWA
1 Stephen Curry, GS 79 34.2 .669 20.6 10.2 31.6 2.9 13.6 8.6 31.56 828.6 27.6
2 James Harden, HOU 82 38.1 .598 20.6 12.6 32.2 2.2 15.6 8.8 25.36 693.1 23.1
LeBron James, CLE 76 35.6 .588 21.5 10.4 31.1 4.7 18.8 11.8 27.64 692.9 23.1
4 Russell Westbrook, OKC 80 34.4 .554 29.0 11.9 33.3 6.1 18.1 12.4 27.64 683.0 22.8
Kevin Durant, OKC 72 35.8 .634 16.3 11.3 30.2 2.0 21.8 12.4 28.25 682.8 22.8
6 Kawhi Leonard, SA 72 33.1 .616 12.2 6.9 24.2 4.7 18.4 11.8 26.11 554.6 18.5
7 Chris Paul, LAC 74 32.7 .575 33.7 8.9 28.1 1.8 12.0 7.0 26.31 552.8 18.4
8 Hassan Whiteside, MIA 73 29.1 .629 2.9 13.8 18.8 13.1 32.4 23.1 25.69 478.5 16.0
9 Kyle Lowry, TOR 77 37.0 .578 23.2 10.5 26.0 2.2 12.3 7.3 22.20 476.5 15.9
10 Karl-Anthony Towns, MIN 82 32.0 .590 10.0 11.3 23.1
And if you standardize it for minutes (e.g., 36 per game), Steph's numbers really improve. (Harden's would go down)
GP MPG TS% AST TO USG ORR DRR REBR PER VA EWA
1 Stephen Curry, GS 79 34.2 .669 20.6 10.2 31.6 2.9 13.6 8.6 31.56 828.6 27.6
2 James Harden, HOU 82 38.1 .598 20.6 12.6 32.2 2.2 15.6 8.8 25.36 693.1 23.1
LeBron James, CLE 76 35.6 .588 21.5 10.4 31.1 4.7 18.8 11.8 27.64 692.9 23.1
4 Russell Westbrook, OKC 80 34.4 .554 29.0 11.9 33.3 6.1 18.1 12.4 27.64 683.0 22.8
Kevin Durant, OKC 72 35.8 .634 16.3 11.3 30.2 2.0 21.8 12.4 28.25 682.8 22.8
6 Kawhi Leonard, SA 72 33.1 .616 12.2 6.9 24.2 4.7 18.4 11.8 26.11 554.6 18.5
7 Chris Paul, LAC 74 32.7 .575 33.7 8.9 28.1 1.8 12.0 7.0 26.31 552.8 18.4
8 Hassan Whiteside, MIA 73 29.1 .629 2.9 13.8 18.8 13.1 32.4 23.1 25.69 478.5 16.0
9 Kyle Lowry, TOR 77 37.0 .578 23.2 10.5 26.0 2.2 12.3 7.3 22.20 476.5 15.9
10 Karl-Anthony Towns, MIN 82 32.0 .590 10.0 11.3 23.1
And if you standardize it for minutes (e.g., 36 per game), Steph's numbers really improve. (Harden's would go down)
This post was edited on 5/9/16 at 1:36 pm
Posted on 5/9/16 at 1:34 pm to slackster
quote:
LeBron is one of the few players in the league who brings value above and beyond his own numbers. When he is on a team, free agents are more apt to sign and veterans are more likely to take a pay cut in an attempt to win a ring. When he leaves, players leave with him. That shouldn't be taken into account within the context of the league MVP, but it definitely adds to his overall legacy. Within reason, players want to play on his teams.
M - V - P !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Posted on 5/9/16 at 1:35 pm to WestCoastAg
quote:
they absolutely are not better than cleveland
Okay. Once again, LeBron is a big reason why KLove is finally fitting in with the team and the 2nd biggest reason for their defensive presence (Lue being the biggest reason). Their defensive presence iwould decline if you replace LBJ with PG13.
quote:
if you think steph curry is replaceable,
I didn't say he was replaceable, I said GS not losing a beat replacing Curry with Lilliard isn't a far stretch. That isn't a slight to Curry's talents, it's a compliment to that team.
Posted on 5/9/16 at 1:36 pm to RTR America
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