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re: Star Wars: TFA -Official Discussion Thread - Spoilers
Posted on 12/23/15 at 12:11 am to saintsfan92612
Posted on 12/23/15 at 12:11 am to saintsfan92612
quote:Did she? I missed that, but I was looking at his head and face.
I thought she cut off his hand. Did she not?
They do like to chop off some hands in this series though.
0
Posted on 12/23/15 at 12:28 am to StrongBackWeakMind
quote:
Can you have a conversation without being a smartass, or no?
Depends on what you bring to the table
quote:
He had enough energy to outrun Rey and Finn in the forest,
You don't know that. He could have taken another way out or cut them off at a pass.
quote:
but not crush Finn in a matter of seconds? Hell, Finn even landed a blow on him.
Why are you still acting like this was a competitive duel? Dude was bleeding out, it was competitive for like 30 seconds, Kylo took the upper hand, sliced his back all crispy like and that was that.
Posted on 12/23/15 at 12:38 am to ReturnoftheMuschamp
Kylo Ren has an odd skill set. He can effortlessly freeze people and stop blast fire in mid air, something we really didn't see in the other movies from more powerful Jedi/Sith. Vader absorbed it but didn't just hit pause like that.
Yet at the same time he looks very amateurish with a light saber and doesn't seem to have any of the "super human" athletic abilities that we saw from pretty much every Jedi and Sith in the other movies. Based on that display he would be killed by every force user in every other movie.
Yet at the same time he looks very amateurish with a light saber and doesn't seem to have any of the "super human" athletic abilities that we saw from pretty much every Jedi and Sith in the other movies. Based on that display he would be killed by every force user in every other movie.
This post was edited on 12/23/15 at 12:41 am
Posted on 12/23/15 at 1:02 am to Roger Klarvin
Well there are 4 different elements to/types of the Force, so it's not like he has mastered them all. There are only two things I can think of in the previous 6 movies that were more impressive then stopping and holding that laser blast in place:
Yoda's efforts in the fight with Palpatine and Vader force choking someone through a video screen (can't remember where the guy on the other end was, but he wasn't near Vader that's for damn sure)
Yoda's efforts in the fight with Palpatine and Vader force choking someone through a video screen (can't remember where the guy on the other end was, but he wasn't near Vader that's for damn sure)
Posted on 12/23/15 at 2:07 am to ReturnoftheMuschamp
quote:This might seem like blasphemy to some, but I suspect we see the Force portrayed a little differently than in the prequels and such. Not so tidy, not so many precise little rules, like some special attack you get in a video game when you level up. We've already gotten back to a vaguer notion than it was before, now there is the Light and the Dark sides, and that is about as defined as we get.
Well there are 4 different elements to/types of the Force, so it's not like he has mastered them all
Kylo might already be able to do things Luke can't do, and Luke should have a lot more ability to do things Kylo can't.
This frees up the writers and directors to do all sorts of intriguing things; we haven't seen mind-reading, or blaster freezing before. Who knows what we will see next. One thing I hope is that it isn't easily predictable.
Posted on 12/23/15 at 4:26 am to Boss
This movie was good for a PC version of new hope.
Posted on 12/23/15 at 6:40 am to ReturnoftheMuschamp
I see you forgot to address the force throw that sent Rey flying through the forest.
ETA: Like the other poster said, it's not a big deal. I understand why they did it the way they did it. But it's still a small gripe I have with that scene.
quote:
Why are you still acting like this was a competitive duel?
quote:It should have been competitive for like 0 seconds. That's my opinion. If you can't see the logic in the gripe, then I can't help you.
it was competitive for like 30 seconds
ETA: Like the other poster said, it's not a big deal. I understand why they did it the way they did it. But it's still a small gripe I have with that scene.
This post was edited on 12/23/15 at 6:47 am
Posted on 12/23/15 at 6:45 am to saintsfan92612
quote:I didn't see that. I thought she decapitated him at first.
I thought she cut off his hand. Did she not?
Posted on 12/23/15 at 7:22 am to Roger Klarvin
I don't think Kylo is the most trained with the saber, it looks cool and all but he still has alot to learn and he is nothing like Vader, Count Dooku etc. Kylo fights with emotion, you can tell in the fight he is and Fin is just fighting his aggressive attacks. When you are aggressive you don't pay much attention to the attacks of the other guy.
The prequels made the jedi look pretty amazing maybe too amazing, but if you remember General Grievous was a formidable foe, yeah he usually used 4 sabers, but he gave Ben-Kenobi a challenge. Also remember Grievous droid guards, used electric swords, droids have no connection to the force and they gave Jedi a challnege.
BTW Grievous defeated Jedi during his time. It is reasonable to think that Ren has a lot more training to go including saber skills.
again Kylo who isn't well trained and see above.
The prequels made the jedi look pretty amazing maybe too amazing, but if you remember General Grievous was a formidable foe, yeah he usually used 4 sabers, but he gave Ben-Kenobi a challenge. Also remember Grievous droid guards, used electric swords, droids have no connection to the force and they gave Jedi a challnege.
BTW Grievous defeated Jedi during his time. It is reasonable to think that Ren has a lot more training to go including saber skills.
quote:
The idea that Finn could pick up a light saber and even defend a single strike from Ren is laughable. Comparing it to the Luke/Vader dual is silly, Luke was a semi-trained Jedi who could leap ten feet in the air and use the force.
again Kylo who isn't well trained and see above.
Posted on 12/23/15 at 7:32 am to Roger Klarvin
quote:
Kylo Ren has an odd skill set. He can effortlessly freeze people and stop blast fire in mid air, something we really didn't see in the other movies from more powerful Jedi/Sith. Vader absorbed it but didn't just hit pause like that.
Yet at the same time he looks very amateurish with a light saber and doesn't seem to have any of the "super human" athletic abilities that we saw from pretty much every Jedi and Sith in the other movies. Based on that display he would be killed by every force user in every other movie.
The movie is very clear what they are trying to set up. Ren has learned some powerful uses of the force, stopping blaster shots not unreasonable. If you really think about it, Yoda moved an X-wing fighter, Dooku moved senate platforms, Vader didn't move anything significant, but I'm sure he could. My point is stopping a blaster isn't that difficult for someone well connected with the force, Luke moved small objects without much training. It's intimidating in battle, but it's not a really complicated force trick.
But back to what the movie tried to show Ren as
a young sith lord who to the outside viewer looks like an unstoppable force, but when you get to know him you come to realize he isn't that powerful. He hides his real face with a mask, he tries to imitate his grandfather's voice, he has a cool looking saber. But really isn't that impressive, the light side of the force is "tearing him apart" at least, that is what he told Han, which could be a lie. He has temper tantrums, while sure the dark side uses anger, but they don't use it uncontrolled like he does.
JJ wanted to set up someone who tries to show the Galaxy he is not someone to be messed with, but when you get to know him his isn't that scary.
Posted on 12/23/15 at 7:33 am to StrongBackWeakMind
quote:
It should have been competitive for like 0 seconds. That's my opinion. If you can't see the logic in the gripe, then I can't help you.
I love when people argue like this.
see my post two above this one I try to explain it, if it's so illogical it should be easy to refute.
Posted on 12/23/15 at 7:36 am to athenslife101
sorry to do a callback from page 3 of this thread, but can someone explain these two for me? im drawing a blank
Kylo Ren deciding he didn't need BB88 or Han going light speed through the shield felt very very very forced to me.
Kylo Ren deciding he didn't need BB88 or Han going light speed through the shield felt very very very forced to me.
Posted on 12/23/15 at 7:37 am to catholictigerfan
quote:
again Kylo who isn't well trained
assumption, stopped blaster fire, was able to deflect blaster fire(when was Luke able to do this? ROTJ?), pull people to him, knock people out with a snap of his fingers, mind read(Vader couldn't/didn't do that to Leia and used a droid instead), yada,yada,yada.
It's just cheap writing/direction. "OOOOOHhh, cool special effect the crowd will love."
Like Lucas in the prequels, Jedi can run light speed?(Cooooool!) But then later they run normal speed chasing down someone? Not sure what it's called, maybe continuity? But it seems like there's a separate writer for each scene and the story is taped together at the end.
Posted on 12/23/15 at 7:38 am to Roger Klarvin
quote:
Vader absorbed it but didn't just hit pause like that.
The didn't have the technology to do that back then.
Posted on 12/23/15 at 7:42 am to catholictigerfan
quote:
the light side of the force is "tearing him apart" at least, that is what he told Han, which could be a lie.
He also said it to Vader's mask. Said he felt the pull to the light.
Posted on 12/23/15 at 7:49 am to Scoob
I think she cut off part of his cape then the side vent on his Saber was pushing into his leg when hisSaber was being ground into the snow. Then slash across the face.
Posted on 12/23/15 at 8:20 am to Kujo
quote:
assumption, stopped blaster fire, was able to deflect blaster fire(when was Luke able to do this? ROTJ?), pull people to him, knock people out with a snap of his fingers, mind read(Vader couldn't/didn't do that to Leia and used a droid instead), yada,yada,yada.
probably nothing I will say will convince you. But they mention that he needs more training in the movie itself. Did they ever say Vader need more training? The movie makes clear that Ren is nothing compared to Vader. His training isn't in skills its being able to control his skills and emotions. As I've tried to say emotions hinder you ability to use the force, this is clear in the first three movies. When Ren is in control he is able to use the force to his advantage, but his emotions easily get out of whack. Remember Luke's training.
Posted on 12/23/15 at 8:33 am to Kujo
quote:
assumption, stopped blaster fire, was able to deflect blaster fire(when was Luke able to do this? ROTJ?), pull people to him, knock people out with a snap of his fingers, mind read(Vader couldn't/didn't do that to Leia and used a droid instead), yada,yada,yada.
No, it's completely emphasized he has not been trained properly. If he had been, he would have been able to create a competent lightsaber. He clearly has raw power, but has no idea how to control this power. Plus doesn't that make the villain more interesting when he gets more powerful and composed as the series progresses?
This post was edited on 12/23/15 at 8:34 am
Posted on 12/23/15 at 8:36 am to catholictigerfan
quote:That snide remark was directed at another poster.
I love when people argue like this.
quote:I see the logic in your explanation, just as you should be able to see the logic in mine. The other post said our position is illogical; hence the response.
see my post two above this one I try to explain it, if it's so illogical it should be easy to refute.
There is no right or wrong. I've already said that I understand why they did it the way they did it. But I think that Ren should have crushed him in a matter of seconds, even with the injury. And Finn sure as hell shouldn't have been able to land a blow on him.
This post was edited on 12/23/15 at 8:41 am
Posted on 12/23/15 at 8:48 am to StrongBackWeakMind
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