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re: Iraq in downward spiral; Who will Obama blame?
Posted on 6/12/14 at 11:53 am to asurob1
Posted on 6/12/14 at 11:53 am to asurob1
quote:
Bush IS to blame.
Obama did a surge.
Obama kept the troops there and they will still be there through 2016.
Obama damn near was rallying to start shite in Syria after we just got done doing shite in Lybia.
I guess your precious Obama gets off the hook.
Posted on 6/12/14 at 11:53 am to TX Tiger
quote:Who do you think we went to war against in 1991 in Kuwait?
Dude, Saddam Hussein was a household name.
Pre-Iraq invasion?
Serious question: Are you on memory altering drugs?
Posted on 6/12/14 at 11:53 am to asurob1
You missed the point rob. You saw the words Iraq, blame, and Obama and went straight to your rant.
Posted on 6/12/14 at 11:54 am to AbuTheMonkey
quote:
Baghdad falls = U.S. ground soliders back into Iraq within six months ?
I think we'll be providing air support within a matter of a few days.
There's also the issue of the ISIS actually taking Baghdad. It's an entirely different beast than any of these cities they've taken so far. They'll be stepping away from the home field for the first time since they started this operation.
I posted this fact in another post, but I'll post it here again: there are about as many people in Sadr City alone (which is about 98% Shi'a) in Baghdad as there are an all of Mosul, by far the largest city taken so far.
That is a good point, I remember you saying that before. Have there been any intelligence community articles that point out or estimate the true fighting force size of ISIS?
Although it appears even Al-Qaeda avoids them, are there other terrorist outfits that might jump in on this with them?
Posted on 6/12/14 at 11:55 am to Lsut81
quote:
Geez, this thread has spiraled out of control, but I should have expected it...
Again, I am not arguing who's fault the circumstances actually are... The question I was asking is if Obama will use the "Blame Bush" fallback that he has over and over again after he claimed credit/responsibility for ending the war in Iraq.
You can't say "I ended the war and things fell into despair, but its still Bush's fault"
Obama wants it both ways and the original question was if this situation will be the same as always.
Your so full of shite.
Obama got the troops out of Iraq. Period.
They won't be going back. Iraq will begin it's decent into the shite hole that every country in that part of the world falls into because it requires a dictator to strong arm the people into its will.
Giving "freedom" to people who don't want it always goes this way. Always.
This shite stain is clearly on the "leadership" of George W Bush, and you can try to paint it as the current administration's fault. Try really hard, but anyone with half a brain knows better.
Posted on 6/12/14 at 11:57 am to asurob1
quote:
Your so full of shite.
Show me where I have said anything different?
Looks like you're the one full of shite
Posted on 6/12/14 at 11:57 am to TK421
quote:O.K. Just looked it up. Perhaps "vast majority" isn't the right term, but the idea is relevant and doesn't change the context in which it was used.
The vast majority of Americans couldn't tell you who the current Vice-President is.
Good lord, you're crazy.
Pew Survey: 41% Can't ID Biden as Vice President
Posted on 6/12/14 at 11:57 am to TX Tiger
quote:
Pre-Iraq invasion?
Any one who considered themselves newsworthy literate - yes. The ones that didn't, I could care less what they think. It's kind of like people who don't vote but then bitch about everything that is wrong because so-n-so got elected. That's their right to stay silent with their non vote but it doesn't give them much credence to bitch about it afterwards imo.
Posted on 6/12/14 at 11:57 am to asurob1
quote:0 for 1
Your so
quote:0 for 2 & 3 in the same sentence.
it's decent
quote:Apparently you're qualified.....
anyone with half a brain knows better.
Posted on 6/12/14 at 11:57 am to LSURussian
quote:
Who do you think we went to war against in 1991 in Kuwait?
I honestly don't think he's ever heard of that one. And he has the nerve to call all of us clueless.
Posted on 6/12/14 at 11:57 am to AbuTheMonkey
ISIS has apparently declared it's going to take Najaf and Karbala, which are two of the biggest Shi'ite shrines.
Both cities are to the southwest of Baghdad.
Najaf and Mosul, which they've already taken, are to the northwest. This means they'd effectively loop around Baghdad and cut it off from much of the country, limiting access to anything west of the Euphrates.
If they go from there and take the Tigris river between Baghdad and the Gulf, Baghdad's fricked unless the Iranians decide to help them out. And Iran would rather help themselves to, say, the oil fields at Basra which are along the Gulf near the Kuwaiti border.
Both cities are to the southwest of Baghdad.
Najaf and Mosul, which they've already taken, are to the northwest. This means they'd effectively loop around Baghdad and cut it off from much of the country, limiting access to anything west of the Euphrates.
If they go from there and take the Tigris river between Baghdad and the Gulf, Baghdad's fricked unless the Iranians decide to help them out. And Iran would rather help themselves to, say, the oil fields at Basra which are along the Gulf near the Kuwaiti border.
This post was edited on 6/12/14 at 11:59 am
Posted on 6/12/14 at 11:58 am to TX Tiger
quote:
Perhaps "vast majority" isn't the right term
Perhaps? It's no where close to being the correct term you ignorant loon.
Posted on 6/12/14 at 12:00 pm to Poodlebrain
quote:
Social Security and Medicare went to shite and have caused enormous deficits and national debt. Why are FDR and LBJ not given responsibility for our deficits and national debt, or was I mistaken when Obama tried to blame Bush for our deficits and national debt? At some point if you don't solve a problem created by others you become responsible for it. When does Obama become responsible for problems, caused by others, he did not solve, and may have exacerbated?
That was a mildly clever attempt at misdirection, but SS and Medicare are 50 and 70 years old respectively. There have been a lot hands in those pots manipulating a lot of things for decades. FDR and LBJ bear some of the blame, but decades of mismanagement can't fall squarely on any single president or Congress. And those programs have, by the way, at least provided some palpable benefits while straining the nation's economic health.
Iraq in total has been an unmitigated disaster that was conceived and pushed entirely by one administration. It was authorized by Congress and supported by most Americans (myself included) because we honestly believed Saddam had WMD. Perhaps he did and moved it into Syria. But we have not been able to validate the justification for the war in over 10 years. As I said, it was started by one administration, enjoyed early success, went to shite because we dramatically underestimated the required compliment of troops needed to secure the country and failed to anticipate the breadth of the insurgency, partially stabilized by a surge once Rumsfeld's incompetent arse retired, and was placed on a timetable for US disengagement--all within one administration.
No one can solve Iraq without putting a million troops in country. It was fricked up under Saddam, but it wasn't broken. Now it's broken. And Saddam's removal even had the unintended consequence of emboldening Iran and giving them an opportunity to better meddle in our affairs both in Iraq and throughout the region. Whoever started this stupid fricking thread with the usual circle-jerk inducing sarcastic title should have simply asked: who's to blame for Iraq? It's fairly apparent to those with human brains, friend.
This post was edited on 6/12/14 at 1:16 pm
Posted on 6/12/14 at 12:02 pm to LSURussian
quote:The vast majority of Americans are consumed with the latest hit song, fashion, class-status, etc.
Dude, Saddam Hussein was a household name.
Pre-Iraq invasion?
Who do you think we went to war against in 1991 in Kuwait?
Do you deny this?
Posted on 6/12/14 at 12:03 pm to TX Tiger
quote:
The vast majority of Americans are consumed with the latest hit song, fashion, class-status, etc.
Apparently you are. You'd never heard of the Gulf War before this thread.
Posted on 6/12/14 at 12:04 pm to GeauxxxTigers23
quote:
Nobody is really arguing that point. I don't know why you guys keep yelling at everybody about it.
Then what the frick is the point of this thread other than to gather together to tug on each other's balls.
Posted on 6/12/14 at 12:05 pm to GeauxxxTigers23
quote:
Apparently you are. You'd never heard of the Gulf War before this thread.
Dude don't bother with him.
He disqualified himself from the debate the moment he said who is sadaam.
Posted on 6/12/14 at 12:06 pm to Homesick Tiger
quote:Agreed. But that's not what was stated.
Pre-Iraq invasion?
Any one who considered themselves newsworthy literate - yes.
quote:I agree.
The ones that didn't, I could care less what they think. It's kind of like people who don't vote but then bitch about everything that is wrong because so-n-so got elected. That's their right to stay silent with their non vote but it doesn't give them much credence to bitch about it afterwards imo.
Posted on 6/12/14 at 12:07 pm to AUbused
quote:
This is the crux of the OP. My answer is the question is ridiculous because what is going on right now in Iraq was inevitable short of us staying there forever. There is no reason to blame anyone for a deadline because the deadline wouldn't exist if we weren't there.
And you honestly think the US, the rest of the world and Iraq would have been better off if we had left Hussein in power?
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