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Joe Haden and Patrick Peterson: Do they deserve as much money as Sherman?
Posted on 5/14/14 at 4:10 pm
Posted on 5/14/14 at 4:10 pm
11
Posted on 5/14/14 at 4:16 pm to AllBamaDoesIsWin
Peterson isn't on the same level as Sherman right now. He's gonna get paid for his potential to be better
Posted on 5/14/14 at 4:17 pm to AllBamaDoesIsWin
quote:
In terms of assignment then, Sherman is not tested in the same way as Haden and Peterson.
BIG key in that article
I'd take Haden over sherman all day regardless
Posted on 5/14/14 at 4:19 pm to AllBamaDoesIsWin
I think he's the best in the game but I don't think he's in a league of his own. He is asked to do less than the other elite corners.
quote:
While Haden led the league aligning opposite a team’s opposing No. 1 wideout on 65% of snaps and Peterson did so 55% of the time, Sherman was far lower at 27%.
Posted on 5/14/14 at 4:19 pm to AllBamaDoesIsWin
(no message)
This post was edited on 12/26/21 at 1:45 pm
Posted on 5/14/14 at 4:20 pm to AllBamaDoesIsWin
they deserve what their teams are willing to pay them
Posted on 5/14/14 at 4:20 pm to AllBamaDoesIsWin
Haden yes. Peterson no.
Posted on 5/14/14 at 4:21 pm to BilJ
Just imagine Peterson or Haden on that Seattle D. Sherman has that advantage. Also like the article said, he stays on his side of the field and isn't matched up with the team's best WR nearly as much as Peterson and Haden. Plus he doesn't have to go against the best QB in the NFC West twice a year.
Posted on 5/14/14 at 4:24 pm to PortCityTiger24
Yeah, Sherman plays with Pro Bowlers in his secondary. Haden has played on an island his whole career thus far with little. Peterson may not be quite as good, but he returns punts and even plays a little WR, too.
Posted on 5/14/14 at 4:27 pm to GynoSandberg
quote:
Peterson may not be quite as good, but he returns punts and even plays a little WR, too.
Too many fumbles in the punt return game. He hasn't scored a TD since his rookie season when he had 4.
I think Peterson is around the 5th best corner in the game yet. He's only 23 though. He'll end up the best in the game
Posted on 5/14/14 at 4:28 pm to AllBamaDoesIsWin
quote:
Just as easily as a blitz can generate the sort of pressure to force a mistake from a quarterback it can as easily leave a corner isolated on an island with little or no help if the blitz is picked up or beaten. Clearly a top-drawer corner needs to be able to shut his man down in both scenarios, taking advantage of what the blitz can bring while remaining steadfast in coverage of a base pass rush.
I thought Seattle didn't blitz all that much. At least they didn't when I saw them play a few times.
wonder how much less they blitzed than CLE or ARI did. Or if it was about the same.
Posted on 5/14/14 at 4:31 pm to AllBamaDoesIsWin
Sherman has arguably the best safety in the league ( Earl Thomas) watching his back also. Peterson has lined up at right cb, left cb, and slot and I think Haden might be better than Sherman IMO.
Posted on 5/14/14 at 4:33 pm to AllBamaDoesIsWin
Yes. And for a few reasons.
PP and Haden are true "shadow" CBs in the NFL. They go up against the other teams #1WR man to man every game, every snap, etc. Sherman doesnt do this. Sherman is still awesome though. And Seattle plays a good bit of zone as well.
And you gotta look at age and potential / ceiling, especially with PP. Sherman is 26. Haden is 25. Peterson is still just 23. IMO, Sherman is at the top of his game right now. Haden is close to the top of his game, but still has a little room to get even better. PP, on the other hand, is just starting to make that climb. And hes already a great CB. But once he puts it all together and the light bulb goes on for him, which it will because hes 1 of the hardest workers in the game and will reach his potential, he will be 1 of the best to ever play the CB position.
Athletically, PP and Haden are better than Sherman. And PP is on a diff level than both Haden and Sherman. Nowhere tear his peak, while Sherman is at his peak and Haden is almost there.
And that article makes some good points. But, the best point that article makes is the "shutdown or track" section. Hell, Sherman is on the WR2 more than he is on the WR1. PP and Haden are WR1 majority of the time. And thats huge.
But its all about the system IMO. Sherman is playing with 2 of the top S in the game. But is great at what they ask him to do. But I dont think he would be as good being on an island vs other teams #1 like PP and Haden do. Its a completely diff type of playing style.
Sherman got paid for what hes done. Haden got paid for what hes done. PP is going to get paid for what hes about to become. In a year or 2, PP is going to be playing the CB spot at 1 of the highest levels we have seen.
PP and Haden are true "shadow" CBs in the NFL. They go up against the other teams #1WR man to man every game, every snap, etc. Sherman doesnt do this. Sherman is still awesome though. And Seattle plays a good bit of zone as well.
And you gotta look at age and potential / ceiling, especially with PP. Sherman is 26. Haden is 25. Peterson is still just 23. IMO, Sherman is at the top of his game right now. Haden is close to the top of his game, but still has a little room to get even better. PP, on the other hand, is just starting to make that climb. And hes already a great CB. But once he puts it all together and the light bulb goes on for him, which it will because hes 1 of the hardest workers in the game and will reach his potential, he will be 1 of the best to ever play the CB position.
Athletically, PP and Haden are better than Sherman. And PP is on a diff level than both Haden and Sherman. Nowhere tear his peak, while Sherman is at his peak and Haden is almost there.
And that article makes some good points. But, the best point that article makes is the "shutdown or track" section. Hell, Sherman is on the WR2 more than he is on the WR1. PP and Haden are WR1 majority of the time. And thats huge.
But its all about the system IMO. Sherman is playing with 2 of the top S in the game. But is great at what they ask him to do. But I dont think he would be as good being on an island vs other teams #1 like PP and Haden do. Its a completely diff type of playing style.
Sherman got paid for what hes done. Haden got paid for what hes done. PP is going to get paid for what hes about to become. In a year or 2, PP is going to be playing the CB spot at 1 of the highest levels we have seen.
This post was edited on 5/14/14 at 4:37 pm
Posted on 5/14/14 at 4:37 pm to KG5989
ESPN just covered this today. Sherman stays on one side of the line 90% or more of the time meaning he is not following the best WR. Some of the other greats in the game are lining up either side of the in to match up with the best WR. I did not read the article so this may have been covered
Posted on 5/14/14 at 4:49 pm to KG5989
quote:
PP and Haden are true "shadow" CBs in the NFL. They go up against the other teams #1WR man to man every game, every snap, etc. Sherman doesnt do this.
Revis > Sherman for the reasons mentioned above
Posted on 5/14/14 at 4:51 pm to mrbroker
quote:
ESPN just covered this today. Sherman stays on one side of the line 90% or more of the time meaning he is not following the best WR. Some of the other greats in the game are lining up either side of the in to match up with the best WR. I did not read the article so this may have been covered
I don't think anybody that has responded so far has read the full article
That's the one thing that everyone holds against Sherman, but it's a key component to Seattle's defensive strategy, lining up the same almost every time. The author clearly states that despite not matching up on the #1 all of the time, Sherman has such a huge advantage in the other areas that it doesn't make up the difference (in his opinion).
quote:
So after looking at all of these splits in the statistics is there any doubt that Sherman has separated himself from this triumvirate of newly-minted corners? In terms of production and performance Sherman clearly separates himself from the other two with the only counter argument available that Haden and Peterson operate in more varied and difficult assignments. However, is the performance level close enough for that difference in assignment level to bridge the gap?
In my opinion, no.
As onlookers we are always seeking discussion and debate to anoint someone as the best at a position but sometimes there simply isn’t much of a debate to be had, and this is one of those cases. That the Seahawks do not ask or need Sherman to shadow a No. 1 receiver does not denigrate what he does locking down his side of the field, it merely gives him an “incomplete” grade in terms of what some people like to see a top cornerback doing. Simply operating a more difficult assignment does not elevate a very good corner to that next level of performance.
This post was edited on 5/14/14 at 4:56 pm
Posted on 5/14/14 at 4:52 pm to LooseCannon22282
quote:
wonder how much less they blitzed than CLE or ARI did. Or if it was about the same.
I'm not sure the exact percentage, but I did see a stat that said that Arizona blitzed more than any team last season. I want to say it was roughly 50-60 percent of snaps.
Posted on 5/14/14 at 5:12 pm to TDawg1313
quote:
despite not matching up on the #1 all of the time, Sherman
Sherman is only on the WR1 27% of the time... Hes on the WR2 more so than the WR1. And when you take into account,it kinda inflates his grade, QBR vs him, and other numbers. Hes not going against the the other teams top WR / main target.
And they run a zone majority of the time. With 2 of the best S in the game back there. Its a completely diff skill set. Sherman is great at it though, no doubt about it. But its harder to guard a WR1 man to man than it is to be lined up against a WR2 majority of the time, and in a zone.
If I was paying a CB the $$$ that Sherman just got paid, he better be on the other teams WR1. Sherman is still great though, no doubt about that.
But that guy is going off what the #s and grade say. And the #s are there and dont lie. But they are a little skewed when you take into the fact that hes in a zone and lined up with WR2 majority of the time.
Regardless, all 3 are great CBs.
Posted on 5/14/14 at 5:21 pm to boom roasted
quote:
While Haden led the league aligning opposite a team’s opposing No. 1 wideout on 65% of snaps and Peterson did so 55% of the time, Sherman was far lower at 27%.
This is big. I wanna see Sherman shadow number 1s more.
Posted on 5/14/14 at 5:21 pm to Epic Cajun
quote:
I'm not sure the exact percentage, but I did see a stat that said that Arizona blitzed more than any team last season. I want to say it was roughly 50-60 percent of snaps.
okay, so definitely more than SEA
that would only leave CLE as the unknown. I hardly saw them play at all except for a minutes on a Thursday night game against Buffalo... and that was at a bar. So I didn't pay as much attention to it.
the other times it was just highlight clips on either espn or nfl network.
saw seattle play twice against the Saints, twice against the 49ers, once against the Cards, and once against the Rams (MNF). They just didn't seem to blitz much in those games. They were usually getting so much pressure from their front four that they didn't have to.
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