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What are the economics of Affordable Care Act?

Posted on 9/25/13 at 10:21 am
Posted by Swankie
Far from you
Member since Jan 2011
40 posts
Posted on 9/25/13 at 10:21 am
(Originally posted this on the Political board, but realized it should have been posted here.)


With Affordable Care Act so close to opening, I am interested in the effect the ACA will have on various people. I've never actually asked a doctor what his or her thoughts were on "Obamacare," but I'm very much interested. I know I have friends who have a parent that's a doctor. What are their thoughts on this new healthcare program? Thanks in advance. (P.S. - I'm interested in the economics and facts of the program, not the politics.)
This post was edited on 9/25/13 at 10:25 am
Posted by Teddy Ruxpin
Member since Oct 2006
39649 posts
Posted on 9/25/13 at 10:29 am to
quote:

P.S. - I'm interested in the economics and facts of the program, not the politics.)


Good luck separating those two things.
Posted by Blakely Bimbo
Member since Dec 2010
1183 posts
Posted on 9/25/13 at 10:47 am to
Bottom line economics for our family.

We HAD (new plan starts in January) a Cadillac healthplan through husband's job.

Now we will be moved into $3000 deductible HSA/100% when we reach out of pocket $10 grand. Pre tax dollar contributed to HSA we can fund first year IIRC around 7 grand because we are over 55.

Still be paying several hundred dollars a month for coverage. Three pages of covered preventative services. Going to have to negotiate with doctors for services and meds.

Positives for HSA is that we can take it with us and I can inherit, but past spouse, money goes to beneficiary or estate and will be taxable. At least that is how I interpret the plan.

Like all insurance, you don't know what you got until you have to use it, so we are just going to be winging it this first year.

As I said in another thread, we are not sure what we are going to be responsible for until the HSA is funded by payroll deductible dollars. We are going to be limiting spending this Christmas.

I can understand families holding off on major purchases like housing until they fully grasp the changes. HR meetings started in mid- late August and my husband says that all his clients are talking about the changes.

There is a lot of confusion out there and I have heard of many companies that are only going to be giving employees allotments to purchase their own from those exchanges. The media reports that some of the exchanges are not ready to accept customers.

I don't think anyone really knows how this is all going to work and it is going to be a huge cluster for quite a while.
Posted by prplhze2000
Parts Unknown
Member since Jan 2007
51642 posts
Posted on 9/25/13 at 2:48 pm to
It will drive up costs and thus premiums but it attempts to soothe the populace through back door price controls i.e. subsidies.
Posted by Captain Ron
Location: Ted's
Member since Dec 2012
4340 posts
Posted on 9/25/13 at 4:19 pm to
quote:

What are the economics of Affordable Care Act?


Crash the current health care industry so the government can go to a single-payer system.. i.e. taxpayers paying for more free shite to freeloaders.
Posted by Poodlebrain
Way Right of Rex
Member since Jan 2004
19860 posts
Posted on 9/27/13 at 7:58 am to
Your question is overly broad. The answer depends on one's perspective, and everyone has a different perspective. The person who becomes eligible for expanded Medicare in one of the states that has elected that option will have a different view of the economics than someone who has his work hours reduced by an employer seeking to avoid providing health insurance to employees. Similarly, the answers of doctors, hospitals and insurance companies will also be different. The law will create opportunities for some while at the same time creating burdens for others. On a global basis I think the cost of the burdens imposed will exceed the benefits of the opportunities created.
Posted by wiltznucs
Apollo Beach, FL
Member since Sep 2005
8978 posts
Posted on 9/27/13 at 10:28 am to
I work in healthcare admin at one of the largest hospitals in the country. I did a considerable amount of my undergrad and graduate work debating the pros and cons of nationalized healthcare.

There is a lot of misinformation and confusion about Obamacare. I notice a number of folks here blaming Obamacare for decisions their employers made. In many cases Obamacare has been a convenient excuse for employers to reduce their benefit expenditures on their employees.

The argument for nationalized healthcare is that the single payer system as it exists elsewhere is more efficient in terms of dollars spent to deliver care. This is an undeniable fact which is not up to debate. The data also suggests that people in countries with nationalized healthcare generally live longer than Americans so even quality is difficult to debate. Where the debate exists is whether or not nationalized care is as efficent in terms of timeliness and whether this will meet the expectations of America's immediate gratification oriented society.

Will Physicians and hospitals make less? The data from overseas says yes.

Will hospitals survive? We survived the DRA under Reagan and prospered and will do it again.

Will MD's bemoan Obamacare as driving MD's to quit medicine? Yes they will in spite of the fact that the 2013 graduating class of newly minted Physicians was the largest in American history and 2014 will pump out even more.
This post was edited on 9/27/13 at 10:33 am
Posted by 2geaux
Georgia
Member since Feb 2008
2615 posts
Posted on 9/30/13 at 4:21 pm to
My partner and I own 4 businesses. It will cost a minimum of $90k and that is if we don't provide it. We are going to divest ourselves of one company to get below the 50 employee max. It will put us at a competitive disadvantage to keep it and won't allow for future growth. So, from my stand point, it will create unemployment and stagnate the economy. And whose to say what banks will do when the newly unemployed stop paying their mortgages.
Posted by NC_Tigah
Carolinas
Member since Sep 2003
124714 posts
Posted on 10/1/13 at 5:51 am to
quote:

I'm interested in the economics and facts of the program
Frankly, so is every actuary in the industry.

Effects will be variable depending on industry, age, income and other factors. Economically the ACA is redistributional. In that sense it should have the much same effect as a progressive 10% corporate/personal income tax increase (~$200B/yr, $2T/10years). Under ACA, young healthy policy holders also shoulder an increased burden of older sicker patient costs.

Those businesses which cannot offload ACA costs to employees will take a hit. ACA adds costs directly with increased policy expense, and indirectly in dealing with regulations and penalties. As with any corporate tax, those costs, where possible, will be passed through. Could add another 2% or more to inflation, a near double in this market.

Health insurance carriers will be pressured. IMO, investment in that sector is at risk. ACA limits profitability via the 80% rule. It increases actuarial risk due to variance in young healthy participation. With fewer healthy members, costs will rise. Carriers' policy options are limited under the ACA, also rendering cost of coverage more expensive.

Hospitals, Clinics, and Medical personnel will be affected. How significantly, is anybody's guess. Hospital administrators remain in a quandary about revenue effects. Layoffs have commenced. Physicians are closing practices in favor of employment usually via hospitals. Economic effects via the medical industry? I'd guess, not much. Leadership transference from physicians to administrators and politicians is another thing entirely. Effects on the public will eventually be significant. My suspicion is hospitals and doctors will see little economic change when the dust settles.

Miscellaneous pockets include Big Pharma - winner. Med device makers - losers.

In general terms of healthcare sector performance and investment, track Medicaid expansion. There should be an inverse relationship between Medicaid growth and HC sector profitability.
Posted by Burt Reynolds
Monterey, CA
Member since Jul 2008
22443 posts
Posted on 10/1/13 at 4:07 pm to
quote:

I've never actually asked a doctor what his or her thoughts were on "Obamacare," but I'm very much interested.


I was talking to the doctors I work with today about it. They aren't too happy about it. The doctors are getting screwed pretty hard in this deal especially since their compensation is already dropping. It's just a huge disaster. I wouldn't be surprised if there's a huge physician strike in a few years. Docs aren't getting paid enough to even cover their overhead costs.

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