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re: jets make trade offer for ivory
Posted on 4/20/13 at 12:53 pm to josh336
Posted on 4/20/13 at 12:53 pm to josh336
So is Loomis' reputation going to take a hit with some people when a 3rd round pick is not gotten in this trade if it happens? Don't the Saint's have to make this trade just to sign their draft picks? I thought that if Ivory wasn't traded then someone else's contract had to be reworked for the Saint's to have the space for the picks. What are the resident cap experts saying?
1
Posted on 4/20/13 at 12:55 pm to Brettesaurus Rex
He's not useless. He does a lot of things ok but he's great at nothing.
Posted on 4/20/13 at 12:55 pm to Brettesaurus Rex
That's him.
quote:
Dudes pretty useless IMO
And it's fine to think that. Didn't say he was going to fill Ingram/Sproles/Thomas's shoes. Not a stretch to say he'd be capable as a 3rd/4th string RB depending on how you view Sproles
This post was edited on 4/20/13 at 1:01 pm
Posted on 4/20/13 at 1:19 pm to BayouLSU
The Saints are in a terrible position when it comes to Ivory.
The Jets aren't known as the shrewdest negotiators in the league but I think they're smart enough to realize:
1. The Saints can't afford to keep another RB on the active roster;
2. The Saints can't afford to have Sproles, Ingram, Thomas and Ivory making $2 mill a year against the cap;
3. The Saints need to free up cap space in order to have a half way shot of filing bigger needs (LT and anybody on defense); and
4. The Saints have to have cap room to sign rookies.
I fully expect that we'll end up with a 5th round pick this year...that's it. It's better than not making an offer and losing him for nothing.
The Jets aren't known as the shrewdest negotiators in the league but I think they're smart enough to realize:
1. The Saints can't afford to keep another RB on the active roster;
2. The Saints can't afford to have Sproles, Ingram, Thomas and Ivory making $2 mill a year against the cap;
3. The Saints need to free up cap space in order to have a half way shot of filing bigger needs (LT and anybody on defense); and
4. The Saints have to have cap room to sign rookies.
I fully expect that we'll end up with a 5th round pick this year...that's it. It's better than not making an offer and losing him for nothing.
This post was edited on 4/20/13 at 1:20 pm
Posted on 4/20/13 at 1:43 pm to saintsanalyst
Sad if we lose the Kracken. Good luck to him if he goes though, guy played his heart out when healthy. 
Posted on 4/20/13 at 1:50 pm to adono
A few comments on the last 10 or so posts.
First anyone thinking we were getting higher than a fourth for Ivory does not understand value. We tendered
him at the second round level because the other option was tendering him at his selected round level, and him being undrafted meant a team could steal him for no compensation.
Hell given Ivory's history and small body of work I'm suprised a fourth is being considered. I had a fifth at best
with a sixth as likely.
Second, Cadet is far from useless. As a fourth string back he is still as good as if not better than most teams' third string back, if not their second.
Third, to state this again, we do NOT need to clear cap to sign our current picks or any minimum salary vets. The top 51 rule is in play and only our first rounder will take up a significant amount of space (about a mil, leaving us with a half mil in space).
And finally we don't have to trade Ivory so we are in a position of strength in trade talks. We can and have carried 5 backs before and made it work (with the fifth being inactive on game days until an injury occurred). While it would be nice, we don't need to clear cap space. I imagine this is why we are pushing for a fourth.
First anyone thinking we were getting higher than a fourth for Ivory does not understand value. We tendered
him at the second round level because the other option was tendering him at his selected round level, and him being undrafted meant a team could steal him for no compensation.
Hell given Ivory's history and small body of work I'm suprised a fourth is being considered. I had a fifth at best
with a sixth as likely.
Second, Cadet is far from useless. As a fourth string back he is still as good as if not better than most teams' third string back, if not their second.
Third, to state this again, we do NOT need to clear cap to sign our current picks or any minimum salary vets. The top 51 rule is in play and only our first rounder will take up a significant amount of space (about a mil, leaving us with a half mil in space).
And finally we don't have to trade Ivory so we are in a position of strength in trade talks. We can and have carried 5 backs before and made it work (with the fifth being inactive on game days until an injury occurred). While it would be nice, we don't need to clear cap space. I imagine this is why we are pushing for a fourth.
Posted on 4/20/13 at 2:06 pm to bonethug0108
What about us packaging a later round pick with Ivory for a higher pick?
Ivory and our 5 round pick for a Jets 3rd round pick?
Ivory and our 5 round pick for a Jets 3rd round pick?
Posted on 4/20/13 at 2:09 pm to bonethug0108
quote:
Third, to state this again, we do NOT need to clear cap to sign our current picks or any minimum salary vets. The top 51 rule is in play and only our first rounder will take up a significant amount of space (about a mil, leaving us with a half mil in space).
Well! That shoots the shite out of my argument.
I still don't think they want to keep all of the present RBs on the roster. Hell, they don't even need to keep any...they never use them anyway!
Posted on 4/20/13 at 2:24 pm to adono
@slackhouse, that is a possibilty but it might be more like Ivory and our fourth for their third, or Ivory and our sixth/seventh for their fourth.
Thirds hold much more value over fourth rounders.
adono, I agree we should try to uncrowd the back field. Honestly I'd like to get down to using a two back rotation in Ingram and PT but Sproles is too good of a weapon. I think running Sproles 3-6 times a game with the other two splitting 20-26 carries would be ideal. Maybe run Ingram slightly more while using PT and Sproles on most passing downs.
Thirds hold much more value over fourth rounders.
adono, I agree we should try to uncrowd the back field. Honestly I'd like to get down to using a two back rotation in Ingram and PT but Sproles is too good of a weapon. I think running Sproles 3-6 times a game with the other two splitting 20-26 carries would be ideal. Maybe run Ingram slightly more while using PT and Sproles on most passing downs.
Posted on 4/20/13 at 7:16 pm to bonethug0108
quote:
Jason La Canfora ?@JasonLaCanfora 3h Jets interest in Saints RB Chris Ivory remains very real.
Posted on 4/20/13 at 7:22 pm to THRILLHO
Not surprising given their current backfield. Honestly if this trade doesn't happen I think they may reach for a back if they get the Bucs pick for Revis(if not then they'll get one in the second).
Posted on 4/20/13 at 7:43 pm to bonethug0108
I'd give RBs their own drives instead of the shitty come in come out come in come out strategy. Obviously in some situations where one has to come out they would, or if it's a Sproles Down.
Posted on 4/20/13 at 8:16 pm to AllBamaDoesIsWin
quote:
I'd give RBs their own drives instead of the shitty come in come out come in come out strategy. Obviously in some situations where one has to come out they would, or if it's a Sproles Down
Dead on what I've been saying at work with my buddy, even the Sproles part. Payton even said something to that effect.
I think start off with PT if your first drive is planned more pass heavy and let him do the first 2-3 series with Sproles rotating in as the situation calls for it. If the first drive is run heavy you could use either but probably go with Ingram just to get him going.
Towards the end, if we are up use Ingram and if we are down use PT, again rotating Sproles in as called for.
You can even use Sproles with either back on the field.
I think this would help with their rhythm and keep them from getting tired running in and out every other play.
This post was edited on 4/20/13 at 8:17 pm
Posted on 4/20/13 at 8:53 pm to bonethug0108
Honestly if a third is being considered for Ivory, I would trade Ingram now to them and see if we can get a 2nd. I just feel and felt at the time of drafting Ingram, that he was overrated due to the Alabama offensive line and running back wasn't a position of need. Also, the RB position has lost tremendous value to the point where if its not an Adrian Peterson or a generational back, there is no need to draft one in the 1st round anymore.
Posted on 4/20/13 at 8:55 pm to irvchilichill1
3 team trade. #jets get TB 13th this year and a third next and Chris ivory via NO. TB-get revis and 6-NO. NO gets jets 4 TB7
Posted on 4/20/13 at 9:01 pm to irvchilichill1
A 3rd is not being considered. Word is Saints want 4th and Jets offering 5th. Ingram would get about the same.
But yeah I think teams will move more and more away from non-every down LBs and RBs(I have one of each in my mock if you think Ogletree isn't an every down LB; and both are going with the final picks).
But yeah I think teams will move more and more away from non-every down LBs and RBs(I have one of each in my mock if you think Ogletree isn't an every down LB; and both are going with the final picks).
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