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FB's Wine Corner, Ep 2: The Rhone Valley
Posted on 10/31/24 at 2:22 pm
Posted on 10/31/24 at 2:22 pm
The Knight Gaspard de Sterimberg, wounded and weary following a years long Crusade against heretics in Southern France, requests a boon from the Queen of France: a small hilltop in Southeastern France, near the banks of the Rhone River, where he can rest and recover in solitude, become a hermit, and tend to the land and grape vines that surround it. This seemingly innocuous act gives rise to one of the most famous tiny wine Appellations in the world and its signature grape: Hermitage and its signature grape, Syrah.
The history of Wine is filled with stories such as this, legendary tales of Knights fighting Crusades and Popes moving from Rome to Avignon, that bring texture and substance to what we consume. The Rhone Valley is a historic place, one of the most important wines areas of the world, and yet it does not get the pomp and circumstance that places like Bordeaux and Burgundy do, and subsequently, can have lower prices (with the notable exceptions of places like Hermitage and Cote Rotie.)
> The Rhone Valley is broken down into two general areas: The Northern Rhone and the Southern Rhone.
The Northern Rhone is the spiritual fatherland of one of the world’s most planted grapes: Syrah (called Shiraz in places like Australia). Places like Hermitage and Cote Rotie make the purest (and most EXPENSIVE) expressions of the grape. If you are on more of a budget like me, Crozes-Hermitage is the larger area surrounding the hill and is much much more affordable than Hermitage itself.
The Southern Rhone is known for Grenache primarily, and also grows Syrah and Mourvedre. If you’ve ever seen someone refer to “GSM Blends” that is a blending of the 3 grapes and any time you see the ubiquitous “Cotes du Rhone” in a store and it’s a red wine, that is most often a GSM blend, with Grenache dominating, from the Southern Rhone.
This post was edited on 10/31/24 at 2:26 pm
Posted on 10/31/24 at 2:22 pm to Fun Bunch
Below we will explore some of the more famous and well known areas of the Rhone that you may need to know by name to explore the region.
Northern Rhone:
Hermitage – 100% Syrah, black fruit, spices, more earthy and sometimes smokey than Cote Rotie
Cote Rotie – Mostly Syrah, but 20% of Viognier, a white wine grape somewhat similar to Chardonnay can be blended in. The wines can be more floral than Hermitage, and more lively.
Coindrieu – White wine(!) based on viognier. Pricey and beautiful wines, a great alternative to Chardonnay.
Southern Rhone:
Gigondas (Jhee-gohn-dahs) – one my absolute go-tos if I want a BIGGER wine but don’t want to spend Bordeaux bucks. Often big intense black fruit wines. Love them. Great less expensive alternative to the next wine…
Chateauneuf-du-Pape – One of the stars of the show and the most famous Southern Rhone wine. These are blends that can be of many grapes. They are big, powerful, and age worthy. The Southern Rhone’s answer to Bordeaux in a way.
There are of course several other areas that are very important like Tavel and Vacqueryas.
Northern Rhone:
Hermitage – 100% Syrah, black fruit, spices, more earthy and sometimes smokey than Cote Rotie
Cote Rotie – Mostly Syrah, but 20% of Viognier, a white wine grape somewhat similar to Chardonnay can be blended in. The wines can be more floral than Hermitage, and more lively.
Coindrieu – White wine(!) based on viognier. Pricey and beautiful wines, a great alternative to Chardonnay.
Southern Rhone:
Gigondas (Jhee-gohn-dahs) – one my absolute go-tos if I want a BIGGER wine but don’t want to spend Bordeaux bucks. Often big intense black fruit wines. Love them. Great less expensive alternative to the next wine…
Chateauneuf-du-Pape – One of the stars of the show and the most famous Southern Rhone wine. These are blends that can be of many grapes. They are big, powerful, and age worthy. The Southern Rhone’s answer to Bordeaux in a way.
There are of course several other areas that are very important like Tavel and Vacqueryas.
This post was edited on 10/31/24 at 2:42 pm
Posted on 10/31/24 at 2:22 pm to Fun Bunch
Some wines you can get your hands on:
Delas Hermitage Domaine Des Tourettes - $130 at Total Wine – Hermitage Syrah, wonderful wine for the price. STRONG and powerful. Serious wine with spice and leather.
Pierre Henri Morel Chateauneuf du Pape - $68 at Total Wine – spectacular wine at such a low price point for this region. MASSIVE wine with a meaty taste. Big wine.
Pierre Amadieu Gigondas Pas de l’Aigle - $45 – another great wine at this price point. Highly recommend it to get a sample of the region. A big wine with blackberry, game, and plums. High in alcohol
And the bargain wine you can get at almost any store:
Guigal Cotes du Rhone Rouge – $15 at total wine and most stores - Guigal (Gwee-ghal) might be THE Rhone Valley Producer and they have wines that run the gamut from CRAZY expensive to this one, which is crazy cheap. Is it spectacular? No it is definitely not, but it is a good daily drinker for 15 bucks, from a very good producer. For a mass produced wine, its nice. Blackberry, oak and chocolate.
Don’t forget that Rhone, especially the Southern Rhone, also makes White Wine, Rose, and Sparkling wine. We can talk about those too if anyone is interested.
Delas Hermitage Domaine Des Tourettes - $130 at Total Wine – Hermitage Syrah, wonderful wine for the price. STRONG and powerful. Serious wine with spice and leather.
Pierre Henri Morel Chateauneuf du Pape - $68 at Total Wine – spectacular wine at such a low price point for this region. MASSIVE wine with a meaty taste. Big wine.
Pierre Amadieu Gigondas Pas de l’Aigle - $45 – another great wine at this price point. Highly recommend it to get a sample of the region. A big wine with blackberry, game, and plums. High in alcohol
And the bargain wine you can get at almost any store:
Guigal Cotes du Rhone Rouge – $15 at total wine and most stores - Guigal (Gwee-ghal) might be THE Rhone Valley Producer and they have wines that run the gamut from CRAZY expensive to this one, which is crazy cheap. Is it spectacular? No it is definitely not, but it is a good daily drinker for 15 bucks, from a very good producer. For a mass produced wine, its nice. Blackberry, oak and chocolate.
Don’t forget that Rhone, especially the Southern Rhone, also makes White Wine, Rose, and Sparkling wine. We can talk about those too if anyone is interested.
Posted on 10/31/24 at 3:29 pm to Fun Bunch
Do any of these need age on them? Or are they perfectly fine opening upon purchase?
Posted on 10/31/24 at 3:36 pm to Epic Cajun
90%+ of all wines you will ever buy don't need age.
Most of them don't. Any Cotes Du Rhone certainly don't, and Gigondas mostly can be drunk now. Croze Hermitage, Grenache Blanc white wines etc don't.
Hermitage DEFINITELY could use some level of age in most cases. A lot of Cote Rotie does as does Cornas. But you are also talking about some high end wines at that point
CdP does not need to be aged either. However, aging them 3-4 years does not hurt. They can be enjoyed young, we aren't dealing with Bordeaux with them. They are great great wines that can be drank now. One of the best bottles I've ever had was a 130 dollar CdP with about 9 years of age though (its really not necessary)
Most Grenache based Rhone blends are MEANT TO BE DRANK YOUNG.
Like I said...the vast majority of wines under 100 don't need to be aged and can be drank now, they may just need an aeration or decant, especially the bigger wines.
I'm not an expert, that's just what I've read.
Most of them don't. Any Cotes Du Rhone certainly don't, and Gigondas mostly can be drunk now. Croze Hermitage, Grenache Blanc white wines etc don't.
Hermitage DEFINITELY could use some level of age in most cases. A lot of Cote Rotie does as does Cornas. But you are also talking about some high end wines at that point
CdP does not need to be aged either. However, aging them 3-4 years does not hurt. They can be enjoyed young, we aren't dealing with Bordeaux with them. They are great great wines that can be drank now. One of the best bottles I've ever had was a 130 dollar CdP with about 9 years of age though (its really not necessary)
Most Grenache based Rhone blends are MEANT TO BE DRANK YOUNG.
Like I said...the vast majority of wines under 100 don't need to be aged and can be drank now, they may just need an aeration or decant, especially the bigger wines.
I'm not an expert, that's just what I've read.
This post was edited on 10/31/24 at 3:46 pm
Posted on 10/31/24 at 3:39 pm to Fun Bunch
Adding, while a lot of Cotes du Rhone are not huge wines and are smooth and less big than say Cabs, some of those Rhone valley wines are BIG blackfruit alcohol bombs, and so a little decant can't hurt. 1-3 hours for say a CdP that is very young.
The very best rule for decanting is this:
POUR SOME IN YOUR GLASS WHEN YOU OPEN THE BOTTLE. If you like it just fine, start drinking. If you feel like its "tight" or doesn't have a lot of aromas or taste...let it sit. Revisit it in 30 minutes or so and try again.
The very best rule for decanting is this:
POUR SOME IN YOUR GLASS WHEN YOU OPEN THE BOTTLE. If you like it just fine, start drinking. If you feel like its "tight" or doesn't have a lot of aromas or taste...let it sit. Revisit it in 30 minutes or so and try again.
This post was edited on 10/31/24 at 3:45 pm
Posted on 10/31/24 at 3:46 pm to Fun Bunch
quote:
CdP that is very young.
What's very young for a CdP? Sorry for all the questions, I'm really big into whiskey and wanting to get deeper into wines. I already enjoy wine, but I'm not nearly into the geeky side of wine as I am with whiskey.
Posted on 10/31/24 at 3:52 pm to Epic Cajun
3-4 years. Most of the ones you will see on shelves at TW will be 2020s and 2021s. You can drink them in the parking lot of Total Wine if you want.
The one I rec'd above for 68 is a 2020. I've had a previous year of that wine.
You can certainly get them for less though.
There's a Pierre Henri Morel, same producer, CdP at total wine for 50 bucks. Guigal has one for 51. I've had the Guigal one, its great for the price.
The one I rec'd above for 68 is a 2020. I've had a previous year of that wine.
You can certainly get them for less though.
There's a Pierre Henri Morel, same producer, CdP at total wine for 50 bucks. Guigal has one for 51. I've had the Guigal one, its great for the price.
This post was edited on 10/31/24 at 3:53 pm
Posted on 10/31/24 at 3:53 pm to Epic Cajun
quote:
Sorry for all the questions
Ask as many as you want. If I can't answer I'll google it.
I will be doing a lot of these going forward just for my own fun.
Posted on 10/31/24 at 5:46 pm to Fun Bunch
Another great wine thread FB. We like GMS wines for their combination of fruit & spice.
So far, we prefer the wines from Gigondas & Lirac.
quote:Got turned onto this region by a chance encounter with a guy from the area while wine tasting in Oz. Wife mentioned her affinity for Chateauneuf-du-Pape and he mentioned Vacqueyras (vah-kay-ras), Lirac, Gigondas, & Violès as affordable alternatives.
Gigondas
So far, we prefer the wines from Gigondas & Lirac.
Posted on 10/31/24 at 6:01 pm to Fun Bunch
Solid thread, Bunch
Really wanting to make a trip soon especially to some Hermitage vineyards. I've really enjoyed pure Syrahs.
I'm also patiently awaiting your thread on orange wines
Really wanting to make a trip soon especially to some Hermitage vineyards. I've really enjoyed pure Syrahs.
I'm also patiently awaiting your thread on orange wines
This post was edited on 10/31/24 at 6:05 pm
Posted on 10/31/24 at 7:06 pm to TheLegend
The wife and I are huge orange wine fans. Maybe I’ll do that in between wherever the next country is after France (Spain or Italy).
Posted on 11/1/24 at 9:28 am to BigDropper
quote:
Got turned onto this region by a chance encounter with a guy from the area while wine tasting in Oz. Wife mentioned her affinity for Chateauneuf-du-Pape and he mentioned Vacqueyras (vah-kay-ras), Lirac, Gigondas, & Violès as affordable alternatives.
So far, we prefer the wines from Gigondas & Lirac.
Thank you for this contribution. I did not have time to mention Lirac, but both Vacqueyras and Lirac can be good value.
Coincidentally, Costco sells Kirkland brand Gigondas and Vacqueyras at different times of the year. The Gigondas in particular is EXCELLENT for the price, highly recommend.
This post was edited on 11/1/24 at 9:29 am
Posted on 11/1/24 at 10:10 am to Fun Bunch
quote:
Costco sells Kirkland brand Gigondas
This stuff usually goes for $14 a bottle and is an incredible value. Whenever people talk about Chateauneuf-du-Pape, I try to turn them on to Gigondas as a cheaper, but great alternative.
Posted on 11/1/24 at 10:12 am to Bleed P&G
quote:
This stuff usually goes for $14 a bottle and is an incredible value. Whenever people talk about Chateauneuf-du-Pape, I try to turn them on to Gigondas as a cheaper, but great alternative.
Same
Posted on 11/2/24 at 8:45 pm to Fun Bunch
quote:
Guigal Cotes du Rhone Rouge
Picked this bottle up this afternoon, definitely a solid pour. Think I might step up to a CdP Pierre Henri Morel next. Is there a definite step up in quality between the CdP you recommended and the Hermitage that is roughly double the price? Syrah is the varietal that I first enjoyed in the red wine realm.
Posted on 11/2/24 at 10:49 pm to Fun Bunch
We love our Rhones here. CDPs are good but we prefer Gigondas and Vacqueray. Lately we've been enjoying the Kirkland picks. The Vacqueray is an affordable daily drinker.
Posted on 11/2/24 at 11:55 pm to Trout Bandit
This are very good buys. They absolutely slam for the price.
Posted on 11/2/24 at 11:57 pm to Epic Cajun
They are very different wines. I’m personally a fan of CdP so I’ve had it much more than I’ve ever had Hermitage (which I’ve only had ,have 2-3 times ever.
Get the CdP. I’d you’re a big Syrah fan get a good Crozes-Hermitage for spending the bigger bucks
Get the CdP. I’d you’re a big Syrah fan get a good Crozes-Hermitage for spending the bigger bucks
Posted on 11/3/24 at 4:56 am to Fun Bunch
I love a good rose. Any recommendations?
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