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Why isn't a sacrifice fly an official at bat but an RBI ground out is?
Posted on 4/19/23 at 7:24 am
Posted on 4/19/23 at 7:24 am
The batter is sacrificing himself either way, no?
10
Posted on 4/19/23 at 7:34 am to facher08
The thought is that a sac fly (or a sac bunt) is an intentional act, but an RBI ground out is just a side benefit of trying to get a hit.
I don't necessarily agree, but that's the why.
I don't necessarily agree, but that's the why.
Posted on 4/19/23 at 7:36 am to facher08
Why is a fielder's choice considered an at bat, but not a hit since the runner reached safely? It's because them's the rules.
I think a lot of it has to do with intent. A batter is given benefit of the doubt on a sac fly as being an attempt to advance the runner by giving himself up to score the runner. Not so different from a sac bunt. Is this always a true sacrifice and not just a fortunate break for the batter? No. A ground out that results in an RBI was not a sacrifice but a consolation, just like the runner reaching safely on a fielder's choice.
I think a lot of it has to do with intent. A batter is given benefit of the doubt on a sac fly as being an attempt to advance the runner by giving himself up to score the runner. Not so different from a sac bunt. Is this always a true sacrifice and not just a fortunate break for the batter? No. A ground out that results in an RBI was not a sacrifice but a consolation, just like the runner reaching safely on a fielder's choice.
Posted on 4/19/23 at 7:45 am to facher08
quote:
The batter is sacrificing himself either way, no?
It’s completely stupid
Posted on 4/19/23 at 7:48 am to facher08
The rules are the rules and the facts are the facts
When the cheese drawer opens, you gotta pay the tax.
When the cheese drawer opens, you gotta pay the tax.
Posted on 4/19/23 at 7:54 am to facher08
quote:
The batter is sacrificing himself either way, no?
Fly balls are almost never dropped but ground balls can get through for a hit. What the previous guy said is true, it is about intent.
Posted on 4/19/23 at 8:02 am to AwesomeSauce
quote:
Why is a fielder's choice considered an at bat, but not a hit since the runner reached safely?
Because an out was still made. Just like if a guy tries to sac bunt but if the runner trying to advance gets out, it's no longer a sac bunt.
Posted on 4/19/23 at 8:13 am to facher08
I was thinking about this the other day at a minor league game, I thought RBI ground outs werent an AB too. Were they always?
Posted on 4/19/23 at 8:13 am to Dale Murphy
Why you don’t get OBP for a ROE
Posted on 4/19/23 at 8:20 am to Nono
quote:
The rules are the rules and the facts are the facts When the cheese drawer opens, you gotta pay the tax.
Hahahahaha
Posted on 4/19/23 at 8:30 am to Dale Murphy
quote:I understand and used that in my explanation for why a positive outcome doesn't negate intent. Also execution, if runner gets cut down, or lead runner gets out on a sac bunt, it's no longer a sac and counts as an AB due to inability to execute.
Dale Murphy
Posted on 4/19/23 at 8:34 am to AwesomeSauce
quote:Because you hurt your team, caused an out, and probably didn’t advance an runners.
Why is a fielder's choice considered an at bat, but not a hit since the runner reached safely?
Posted on 4/19/23 at 9:02 am to facher08
the bigger question is why is it only considered a sac fly when a runner is scored and not when you are advancing a runner from second to third? Yet, the sac bunt is a sac bunt when a runner is advanced to any base.
I tend to disagree that a player's intent is to hit a fly ball that results in a sacrifice. A bunter is clearly giving themselves up. A hitter hitting a sac fly was more than likely trying to jack a big dong and ended up flying out instead.
I tend to disagree that a player's intent is to hit a fly ball that results in a sacrifice. A bunter is clearly giving themselves up. A hitter hitting a sac fly was more than likely trying to jack a big dong and ended up flying out instead.
Posted on 4/19/23 at 9:07 am to AwesomeSauce
quote:
Why is a fielder's choice considered an at bat, but not a hit since the runner reached safely? It's because them's the rules.
He is just replacing the one that was out due to him directly causing the out. Why would you reward that?
Posted on 4/19/23 at 9:22 am to BHTiger
I think sometimes I overestimate the collective intelligence of the MSB. Three responses and none of you read the super long five sentences where it is clear my first two sentences were rhetorical and in jest and not a serious question. C'mon man!
Posted on 4/19/23 at 9:55 am to Nono
quote:
The rules are the rules and the facts are the facts When the cheese drawer opens, you gotta pay the tax.
A toll is a toll and a roll is a roll
And without tolls we don’t get no rolls.
Posted on 4/19/23 at 9:59 am to facher08
quote:
Why isn't a sacrifice fly an official at bat but an RBI ground out is?
How exactly is a rainbow made? How exactly does a sun set? How exactly does a posi-trac rear-end on a Plymouth work? It just does.
Posted on 4/19/23 at 10:13 am to facher08
ROE should count favorably towards OBP.
Posted on 4/19/23 at 10:50 am to facher08
quote:
RBI ground out
Is usually a fielder's choice, hence an at bat because its considered a choice of the fielder.
Sac fly is an intentional act by the hitter, hence precipitated by the hitter.
This post was edited on 4/19/23 at 10:53 am
Posted on 4/19/23 at 10:56 am to AwesomeSauce
quote:
I think sometimes I overestimate the collective intelligence of the MSB. Three responses and none of you read the super long five sentences where it is clear my first two sentences were rhetorical and in jest and not a serious question. C'mon man!
We read it all. Your analogy of a fielder's choice was dumb and they called you out for it. Don't get pissy and backtrack now.
The rest of your post was fine but just a repeat of what had already been said in the thread.
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