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Message
Why Kiffin over Napier??
Posted on 10/25/21 at 9:56 am
Posted on 10/25/21 at 9:56 am
I posted this in another thread...im not really understanding why people absolutlely love Kiffin other than possibly the attitude.
so can you give me your thought process on Kiffin over someone like Napier?
Napier @ ULL >>>> than Kiffin @ FAU
Kiffin failed at USC, barely had UT with a winning record, went .500 at ole miss last year, never lost less than 3 games at FAU and had a losing season 33% of the time there.
This is Kiffins second season where he prolly loses 2 games or less. He also isnt some great recruiter like people make him out to be, atleast without O. Right now he is 10th in the conference, #6 in conference last year, his first season after being hired he was 12th.
I will give Kiffin credit, his team this year is 9th in the conference in team talent and obviously much better than that but its not like he has been killing in transfer portal either.
dont get me wrong I like Kiffin, but using past results when he has been at been programs...he has been mediocre. overall the up and down career screams extremely smart but not very detailed and organized.
At UT he was 7-6, 4-4 in conference. he took over after Fulmer has the 5-7 season in 2008.
At USC he was 28-15 and only had one season with less than 5 losses, 17-12 in conference
at FAU went 11-3, 5-7, 11-3. So never lost less than 3 games and had losing season 33% of the time.
at ole miss he went 5-5 last year.
This is only going to be his second season to have less than 3 losses.
Napier isnt my #1 or anything but he is above Kiffin. Kiffin screams very high Highs but also plenty of upset losses and some mediocre losses for sure.
15
Posted on 10/25/21 at 9:57 am to lsu777
Power 5 > Funbelt
Posted on 10/25/21 at 9:59 am to lsu777
Kiffin is a much better offensive mind and gameday coach with a bunch more experience. Those are the reasons. Napier is more mature and possibly could run a better program.
Posted on 10/25/21 at 10:00 am to lsu777
quote:
im not really understanding why people absolutlely love Kiffin other than possibly the attitude.
Really? It's seriously debatable that Kiffin is the best offensive mind in college football.
and even better, he's a great mind during the week, AND on Saturday's. Which this program currently doesn't have.
This post was edited on 10/25/21 at 10:01 am
Posted on 10/25/21 at 10:02 am to lsu777
quote:
At USC he was 28-15 and only had one season with less than 5 losses, 17-12 in conference
They had >60 scholarship players most of that time
Posted on 10/25/21 at 10:02 am to tigerbait01
quote:
Power 5 > Funbelt
so even when Kiffin has been meidocre in P5? even when Napier was better at similar level programs?
Posted on 10/25/21 at 10:04 am to CP3forMVP
quote:
Really? It's seriously debatable that Kiffin is the best offensive mind in college football.
absolutely. but does offensive mind suddenly mean great HC cause that doesnt seem to be the case with kiffin.
quote:
and even better, he's a great mind during the week, AND on Saturday's. Which this program currently doesn't have.
so the reason for wanting him is he is the opposite of O?
because nothing about his past results screams elite.
and im ok with Kiffin but im not understanding why so many have him so damn high on the list.
Posted on 10/25/21 at 10:07 am to lsu777
quote:
and im ok with Kiffin but im not understanding why so many have him so damn high on the list.
I think most are under the assumption that the really really big names are unlikely to happen. If it does then great but not counting on it.
Kiffin would be the first choice over the Napier’s and Tucker’s of the world, which is a fair position.
Posted on 10/25/21 at 10:08 am to tigerbait01
quote:
Power 5 > Funbelt
I'm not necessarily advocating for Napier but this is a dumb argument. This is how to miss out on the next Spurrier/Saban/Meyer level coach.
Posted on 10/25/21 at 10:08 am to lsu777
Kind of like with O, it’s more about what you’ve done in the immediate past for a lot of people. In this case, Lane has a good thing going at Ole Miss of all places. The guy can coach offense. Something LSU has begged for outside of one season in the past decade
Posted on 10/25/21 at 10:09 am to lsu777
quote:
at ole miss he went 5-5 last year.
So are you not going to mention that he’s currently 6-1 and should win the rest of his games this season.
Lane has had some questions in his previous stops, but let’s not forget that he was trying to do this at a very young age. He was 32 coaching the Raiders and 35/36 at Tennessee/USC. He’s proven more as of recent his potential when he had the horses.
Posted on 10/25/21 at 10:11 am to Adajax
Look I like Napier, two weeks ago I literally said he was my pick if I could choose. I’m simply answering the question, this is why more people want Kiffin. Simply put. And I’m sorry to tell you, but there’s not another Saban. Won’t see one in our lifetime. People need to stop chasing that ghost
Posted on 10/25/21 at 10:11 am to lsu777
quote:
so even when Kiffin has been meidocre in P5? even when Napier was better at similar level programs?
Well he took over an absolute dumpster fire in Oxford and in year 2 they're in the top 10.
Posted on 10/25/21 at 10:11 am to Draconian Sanctions
Kiffin is an OC that is playing HC. He runs great, great offenses, but he has never had a defense that was worth a crap, and I've yet to see him appear to be elite at any other part of program building beyond running the offense. His recruiting is lackluster, and his booster engagement at UT and USC were definitely abysmal. Maybe too soon to make a call on that at Ole Miss, but if he flirts with us or another job opening, we'll find out pretty quick. Also haven't seen him drive expansion of facilities or para-staff/programs. I just don't see him as a program builder guy.
Posted on 10/25/21 at 10:11 am to Draconian Sanctions
quote:
They had >60 scholarship players most of that time
well considered they were only docked 10 schollies a year(30 over 3) then that is on him and lack of roster management.
the sanctions were announced on june 10 and were 30 schollies over 3 years and bowl ban in 2010 and 2011.
Sanctions were bad but that 2010 team had no business losing to Oregon state or really ND for that matter.
in 2011, his best season ever, he lost to an Astate team that finished the season with losing record. Were great other than that.
then 2012 had no business losing 5 of last 6, followed by opening 2013 conference play 0-2.
stop acting like he got some raw deal at USC and that his record there is any different than anywhere else.
Posted on 10/25/21 at 10:13 am to SeanLSU
quote:
Kiffin is an OC that is playing HC. He runs great, great offenses, but he has never had a defense that was worth a crap, and I've yet to see him appear to be elite at any other part of program building beyond running the offense. His recruiting is lackluster, and his booster engagement at UT and USC were definitely abysmal. Maybe too soon to make a call on that at Ole Miss, but if he flirts with us or another job opening, we'll find out pretty quick. Also haven't seen him drive expansion of facilities or para-staff/programs. I just don't see him as a program builder guy.
I agree with this, but DJ Durkin was a great hire and they're much better on defense.
The rest is definitely true though. Napier seems like a program builder type for sure.
Posted on 10/25/21 at 10:14 am to The Hurricane
quote:
So are you not going to mention that he’s currently 6-1 and should win the rest of his games this season.
Lane has had some questions in his previous stops, but let’s not forget that he was trying to do this at a very young age. He was 32 coaching the Raiders and 35/36 at Tennessee/USC. He’s proven more as of recent his potential when he had the horses.
No absolutely i give him 100% credit. he deserves all the credit in the world. He has them playing great. but lets not act like that is the norm. He will finish this season with 2 or less losses but that is only 2nd time in career.
As i pointed out, with Lane you get high Highs but also bunch of meidocre sprinkled in. very similar to his usc tenure and i expect OM to regress back to mean next year.
Posted on 10/25/21 at 10:17 am to SeanLSU
quote:
I just don't see him as a program builder guy.
I can understand this perspective.
I would be happy with either he or Napier but at least with Kiffin you know you’re getting consistently very good offenses and he recruited really well at his two big stops.
He would also inject the program with some badly needed enthusiasm and optimism.
Though I do agree Napier has more program builder vibes. And maybe at the end of the day that should be the deciding factor
This post was edited on 10/25/21 at 10:19 am
Posted on 10/25/21 at 10:19 am to SeanLSU
quote:
Kiffin is an OC that is playing HC. He runs great, great offenses, but he has never had a defense that was worth a crap, and I've yet to see him appear to be elite at any other part of program building beyond running the offense. His recruiting is lackluster, and his booster engagement at UT and USC were definitely abysmal. Maybe too soon to make a call on that at Ole Miss, but if he flirts with us or another job opening, we'll find out pretty quick. Also haven't seen him drive expansion of facilities or para-staff/programs. I just don't see him as a program builder guy.
This is my take. I think he is decent at getting good coaches under him but in all other things program wise....he is an OC playing HC.
Not an elite recruiter especially without ED O doing it for him. Shitty with boosters, no foresight with all other things around the program.
im not saying i will be mad with kiffen as I think if we do get him, its an ED O situation...we win an NC and he is gone within 6 years. Ill take it, but he isnt a program builder.
Napier isnt saban, nobody is. But IMO he is closest thing to it out there.
everyone wants to say well kiffen has P5 expierence....yea and its been mediocre at best, just like his G5 expierence. High highs, but mediocrity sprinkled in everywhere.
look at FAU, Great first season, losing season the 2nd year then another great season. Up and Down, up and down. just liek USC and just like OM will be. He cant build and maintain.
Posted on 10/25/21 at 10:22 am to Draconian Sanctions
quote:
can understand this perspective.
I would be happy with either he or Napier but at least with Kiffin you know you’re getting consistently very good offenses and he recruited really well at his two big stops.
He would also inject the program with some badly needed enthusiasm and optimism.
Though I do agree Napier has more program builder vibes. And maybe at the end of the day that should be the deciding factor
I agree 100%. Im not anti-kiffin for sure and you know you will be getting a bad arse offense and based on past high highs then mediocrity. I would take it.
but to correct you...he really hasnt been some huge recruiter, especially with ED O. He is decent to good, not great. But i think alot of that would take care of itself at LSU and its why im ok with him.....
i just dont think he is better as a true HC than Napier.
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