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re: Trying to be objective...is O really a bad decision?
Posted on 12/6/16 at 12:36 pm to Topwater Trout
Posted on 12/6/16 at 12:36 pm to Topwater Trout
quote:
I really think its easy to win here
Let me throw you an olive branch. I agree LSU is one of the jobs that has innate advantages that make it easier to win.
But surely you understand we are not unique in this respect? Other programs with great innate advantages are not automatically successful either. Florida, USC, FSU, UGA, LSU, Alabama, and others can, and have, done poorly with bad head coaches. The head coach is the determining factor.
That means having the fundamentals for great success doesn't make a head coach less important, it makes having the right head coach even more valuable. Because it is the difference between bad/mediocre results and potential national championships.
1
Posted on 12/6/16 at 12:38 pm to SeekGreatness
quote:
Thanks for the preview of some of the excuses you geniuses are going to make for O after each loss during the upcoming 4-7 loss seasons.
Blame the players
Blame the OC
Blame the DC
Blame the weather
Blame the game time
Blame the field conditions
Blame the refs
Blame....anyone but Orgeron
this is exactly what is going to happen... thats why that one poster was right when he posted it will be impossible to fire the guy because of emotional attachment to the fanbase... it is one of the major reasons why it is a terrible hire.. id fire him the second he asked for a raise, his coordinators are the ones doing all the work.. and it will be a revolving door there.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 12:46 pm to Topwater Trout
quote:
you said my statement was one of the dumber narratives yet you haven't seen the most common narrative on here...holy shite
Wow, are you this dense
I was replying directly to you, you responding with some thing i didn't say. That you don't get the difference is rather telling.
quote:
you're damn right I did and its the truth. Some are still crying b/c we didn't get in a bidding war with Texas b/c they think we could have gotten their guy
I can't speak for "some" or others and i really don't care. I'm not upset because "my preferred candidate didn't get the job. I am upset because I think we settled for a crappy coach that no other big schools would have hired because he "fits"
Posted on 12/6/16 at 12:49 pm to Topwater Trout
quote:
I really think its easy to win here
then you really know nothing about college football. No program recruits itself or wins by itself. The evidence is overwhelming to the level of what direction the sun rises.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 12:49 pm to 7nette
quote:
I believe he will have us competing for sec championships starting next year
like i said, he will win 10 games next year, cause its already setup for success.. im worried about the two years that follow..
Posted on 12/6/16 at 12:58 pm to roscoe mike
I will wait and see what the team looks like next year. I can say that coach O identified some of the problems with this team and made instant changes and had the team playing better than it has in many years. A top notch offensive hire could have this team playing at a higher level than has been seen at LSU in a very long time. LSU's defense looks to be in very good hands and Coach O is known to be one of the best at getting talent, so I guess we shall see.
This hire could blow up in LSU's face, but if it starts going bad he can be replaced without trouble.
This hire could blow up in LSU's face, but if it starts going bad he can be replaced without trouble.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 1:02 pm to TigerFan55555
quote:
like i said, he will win 10 games next year, cause its already setup for success
perhaps you have a different copy of the schedule from the one i have cause the one i have includes 5 road conference games, i really don't see how that adds up to 10 wins
Posted on 12/6/16 at 1:05 pm to LSU40
quote:
This hire could blow up in LSU's face, but if it starts going bad he can be replaced without trouble
I don't think replacing him will be as easy as it would be if he were another coach. Orgeron came to be head coach because of skillful political maneuvering, providing access to certain media members, appealing to certain boosters, using the most common memes from radio and message boards, and appealing to people's sense of identity.
If he wins 7-9 games next year that will be a pretty bad result (with 4 gimme games out of conference and most of the SEC not named Alabama in absolute rebuild mode). But I think excuses will be made. And he will be propped up by Aranda for as long as Aranda is at LSU - so he is unlikely to plunge to the 3-6 win territory that would make the need to replace him overcome all objections.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 1:06 pm to Topwater Trout
quote:
no one of the dumber narratives out there is that we didn't conduct a coaching search. Nobody knows what happened over the last few months. They don't know if agents contacted LSU (most likely they did and would have to show interest for their client) People truly believe we did nothing and I am sorry you can cry about the hire but there is no way they weren't in contact with more coaches than Jimbo and Herman.
We don't know but we can make reasonable inferences based on the evidence. So let's look at the evidence.
1. Ed Orgeron was hired as HC of freaking LSU.
We can stop right there. That's pretty damning. Someone that has no resume to support this level of job, somehow got this job. The evidence suggests that we did nothing.
Quite frankly that's the most flattering thing we can say about Alleva. If he actually did conduct a coaching search and still ended up thinking O was the best option, then he's a moron in addition to being lazy and cowardly.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 1:08 pm to molsusports
quote:
Let me throw you an olive branch. I agree LSU is one of the jobs that has innate advantages that make it easier to win.
But surely you understand we are not unique in this respect? Other programs with great innate advantages are not automatically successful either. Florida, USC, FSU, UGA, LSU, Alabama, and others can, and have, done poorly with bad head coaches. The head coach is the determining factor.
That means having the fundamentals for great success doesn't make a head coach less important, it makes having the right head coach even more valuable. Because it is the difference between bad/mediocre results and potential national championships.
THIS x 100,000,000
Posted on 12/6/16 at 1:13 pm to molsusports
While what you said could be true and what happens, there is a chance he is successful and gets this team
on a great roll. Time will tell, I will just try and remain positive and hope for the best.
on a great roll. Time will tell, I will just try and remain positive and hope for the best.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 1:22 pm to molsusports
quote:
7-9 games next year that will be a pretty bad result (with 4 gimme games out of conference and most of the SEC not named Alabama in absolute rebuild mode). But I think excuses will be made. And he will be propped up by Aranda for as long as Aranda is at LSU - so he
Just think about this. O could have a 7 win season next year and not be fired. Les didn't have a 7 win season his entire tenure.
This post was edited on 12/6/16 at 1:24 pm
Posted on 12/6/16 at 1:47 pm to molsusports
quote:
Orgeron came to be head coach because of skillful political maneuvering, providing access to certain media members, appealing to certain boosters, using the most common memes from radio and message boards, and appealing to people's sense of identity
No kidding. It was his greatest recruiting job yet.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 2:06 pm to molsusports
quote:
I don't think replacing him will be as easy as it would be if he were another coach. Orgeron came to be head coach because of skillful political maneuvering, providing access to certain media members, appealing to certain boosters, using the most common memes from radio and message boards, and appealing to people's sense of identity.
If he wins 7-9 games next year that will be a pretty bad result (with 4 gimme games out of conference and most of the SEC not named Alabama in absolute rebuild mode). But I think excuses will be made. And he will be propped up by Aranda for as long as Aranda is at LSU - so he is unlikely to plunge to the 3-6 win territory that would make the need to replace him overcome all objections.
x1000
Posted on 12/6/16 at 2:08 pm to Topwater Trout
quote:
I really think its easy to win here
I never really thought about it in this light, but this statement is probably the biggest reason O got hired in the first place. Everyone thinks LSU is a plug and play situation. That les was just coming to work blindfolded and winning 10 games a year.
As has been stated, many schools have gone down the ranks because of a bad hire...even schools with more advantages. USC, texas, ND, and Florida all have just as much appeal as LSU and they've had seasons of complete suck very recently.
College football is more competitive today than it has ever been. Most schools are spending big to get the right coach.
Any SEC school has enough talent to beat LSU any given week. The difference between top to bottom is lower than ever...yet y'all think a monkey could do it.
Guess you're gonna find out.
Alleva and pro O guys deserve to be belittled every single day until he proves us wrong. So get used to it.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 2:08 pm to SeekGreatness
quote:
Just think about this. O could have a 7 win season next year and not be fired. Les didn't have a 7 win season his entire tenure.
And if it happens, not only will there be excuses, but people will overtly cheer for O and probably be happy that we "took a chance," and that "he can learn from his mistakes and do better next year."
They are all in on O. It will take multiple sub .500 seasons to make a point.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 2:11 pm to roscoe mike
Once Fisher was out and Herman pulled his stunt, Alleva should have revamped the coaching search.
What on earth was the rush to make Orgeron official immediately after you cut ties with Herman? Orgeron wasn't going anywhere.
Alleva had an obligation to the university and the team to follow through and do his due diligence after his first two options fell through.
The fact that he IMMEDIATELY made Orgeron official and tried to pass it off as his leading choice all along, wreaks of butt hurt on the part of Alleva.
Regardless of whether or not Orgeron winds up being successful here, one thing will remain the same: Alleva handled this incredibly poorly and did not respect the process enough to put his feelings aside and follow through with due diligence.
Alleva "took his ball and went home".
What on earth was the rush to make Orgeron official immediately after you cut ties with Herman? Orgeron wasn't going anywhere.
Alleva had an obligation to the university and the team to follow through and do his due diligence after his first two options fell through.
The fact that he IMMEDIATELY made Orgeron official and tried to pass it off as his leading choice all along, wreaks of butt hurt on the part of Alleva.
Regardless of whether or not Orgeron winds up being successful here, one thing will remain the same: Alleva handled this incredibly poorly and did not respect the process enough to put his feelings aside and follow through with due diligence.
Alleva "took his ball and went home".
This post was edited on 12/6/16 at 2:12 pm
Posted on 12/6/16 at 4:00 pm to roscoe mike
Not as bad as some people believe. Would've been better to get a Peterson or Fisher.
Some are just being little bitches and want to whine about everything.
Some are just being little bitches and want to whine about everything.
Posted on 12/6/16 at 4:15 pm to frankenfish
He is gonna be under a microscope early on due to his lack of success as a HC. And tbh he hasn't looked like a world beater. He's been wishy washy in what he wants offensively. Named his 80 yr old buddy permanent dline coach.. (No way he can go on road to recruit and before anyone says waiver I doubt that's approved next season).. Has both his qb commits wandering wtf after the comments and offering tua. He supposedly threatened his staff by saying get something done recruiting or else which reminds me of ole miss.. So I wander how much he's really changed since that learning experience? Do ppl really change ?? He is who he is.. He's a respected dline coach.. We will see how respected he is as a HC..
Posted on 12/6/16 at 4:16 pm to dcrews
I believe the rush to hire O was in large part an effort to retain Aranda before he got interested in exploring other jobs. It worked.
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