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re: Crackpot ASOIAF Theories SPOILERS
Posted on 11/28/13 at 5:06 pm to Hugo Stiglitz
Posted on 11/28/13 at 5:06 pm to Hugo Stiglitz
quote:
I think Varys is more big picture oriented while Littlefinger likes to shake shite up in the short term and exploit the chaos.
Varys big picture involves order. Littlefinger's big picture involves widespread chaos. His plan is on a much quicker pace and more easily adaptable than Varys'. Varys plan is incredibly carefully calculated, while Littlefinger largely plays it by ear.
2
Posted on 11/28/13 at 5:42 pm to OMLandshark
Yeah, they're definitely playing two separate games. I imagine Varys's plan will crumble first; I just don't see Faegon staying on the throne for the next 2 books. Whenever Faegon does die, it should be interesting to see what happens: does Varys go down with the ship, or turn to Dany?
And Sansa is LF's demise, whether she personally kills him or not.
I imagine Jon and Stannis are going to play huge roles as well in TWoW and ADoS; but I think Stannis and Mel are going to die by the end of TWoW. I think Cersei is toast too in the next book.
Speaking of Sansa, y'all think she may leave the Vale and run into the Gravedigger (aka Sandor) and/or Stoneheart?? Although I think it would just be bittersweet/complete the story arc if Arya kills LS; she was there for the RW and will finish off LS since she's a shadow of her human self. And I don't think that Sansa and Sandor's story is finished.
And Sansa is LF's demise, whether she personally kills him or not.
I imagine Jon and Stannis are going to play huge roles as well in TWoW and ADoS; but I think Stannis and Mel are going to die by the end of TWoW. I think Cersei is toast too in the next book.
Speaking of Sansa, y'all think she may leave the Vale and run into the Gravedigger (aka Sandor) and/or Stoneheart?? Although I think it would just be bittersweet/complete the story arc if Arya kills LS; she was there for the RW and will finish off LS since she's a shadow of her human self. And I don't think that Sansa and Sandor's story is finished.
This post was edited on 11/28/13 at 5:44 pm
Posted on 11/28/13 at 5:58 pm to ladytiger118
quote:
Yeah, they're definitely playing two separate games. I imagine Varys's plan will crumble first; I just don't see Faegon staying on the throne for the next 2 books. Whenever Faegon does die, it should be interesting to see what happens: does Varys go down with the ship, or turn to Dany?
Honestly, I don't expect Aegon to do much in ADOS, which will be his downfall. Varys will tell Aegon to stay behind in the safety of King's Landing, while the rest of our heroes go out and kick the Others' arse on the Trident. Jon will be the ultimate victor who will slay the Great Other and all the other armies fighting with him on the final battle at the Trident will bow to him, and the rest of the realm will as well and instantly betray Aegon for not coming to their rescue.
quote:
I imagine Jon and Stannis are going to play huge roles as well in TWoW and ADoS; but I think Stannis and Mel are going to die by the end of TWoW. I think Cersei is toast too in the next book.
Agreed. I think that Stannis will be the Epilogue character of next book, and in the end become the Great Other that Melisandre is so fearful of.
quote:
Speaking of Sansa, y'all think she may leave the Vale and run into the Gravedigger (aka Sandor) and/or Stoneheart?? Although I think it would just be bittersweet/complete the story arc if Arya kills LS; she was there for the RW and will finish off LS since she's a shadow of her human self. And I don't think that Sansa and Sandor's story is finished.
I don't think they'll run into each other again honestly.
Posted on 11/28/13 at 6:05 pm to OMLandshark
Interdasting; I think she's going to run into him again. A lot of fans seem to think he's going to come out of retirement and kill UnGregor, but I think that may be contrary to his healing arc. I do think he's coming back somehow though.
Oh and hopefully we get confirmation about Benjen.
Oh and hopefully we get confirmation about Benjen.
Posted on 11/28/13 at 6:32 pm to ladytiger118
Happy Thronesgiving, my fellow crackpotters!
Posted on 11/28/13 at 6:57 pm to ladytiger118
quote:
Oh and hopefully we get confirmation about Benjen.
I've gone ahead and made the assumption we will never hear another word about him.
That way I'm not disappointed when hes not even mentioned in the winds of winter
Posted on 11/28/13 at 6:57 pm to Gugich22
It's been really busy in this thread today 
. I wonder if we'll have as much traffic on Christmas day.
Happy Thronesgiving to you too.
. I wonder if we'll have as much traffic on Christmas day. Happy Thronesgiving to you too
.Posted on 11/28/13 at 8:57 pm to OMLandshark
quote:
Varys big picture involves order. Littlefinger's big picture involves widespread chaos. His plan is on a much quicker pace and more easily adaptable than Varys'. Varys plan is incredibly carefully calculated, while Littlefinger largely plays it by ear.
I've stated this exact point multiple times in the early day of this thread. I feel like a proud papa all of y'all have learns so well
But yea Varys wasn't lying when he told Ned that he served the realm. He wants the realm intact otherwise what will Aegon have to rule over?
But he also wants it leaderless and in disarray which is why he killed Kevan. Aegon is much more likely to win the support of westeros if he can come across as the savior and the true heir to the iron throne who will lead the realm back to prosperity.
That's why he allowed cersei to have Robert killed.
That's also why he wanted Ned alive and on the wall. Varys knew that Robb and the north had the ability to win the war and also knew that the people would follow him and Aegon wouldn't stand a chance.
LF just wants to watch the world burn.
This post was edited on 11/28/13 at 8:58 pm
Posted on 11/28/13 at 11:07 pm to ladytiger118
quote:
Oh and hopefully we get confirmation about Benjen.
that he's Coldhands?
Posted on 11/28/13 at 11:20 pm to CottonWasKing
Do you think that Varys/Illyrio would betray each other? And what happens if everyone wants Jon to be king when Faegon didn't do anything against the Others?
Posted on 11/28/13 at 11:58 pm to ladytiger118
quote:
Do you think that Varys/Illyrio would betray each other? And what happens if everyone wants Jon to be king when Faegon didn't do anything against the Others?
This is A Song of Ice and Fire so of course they COULD betray each other but I can't envision a circumstance that it would be beneficial to do so. They've both been orchestrating this plan for more than a decade and I think all their chips now lay with Aegon.
They may have possibly been truly behind Viserys or Dany at one point (doubtful IMO. They sold Dany to Drogo solely to remove her from the equation) but I think they've now placed their full hopes in Aegon now with Dany possibly being a backup plan,in the event of Aegons death, at best.
I think they work together throughout the course of the story. They're honestly two of the most trustworthy characters in the series if you think about it. The only person they've ever betrayed was Viserys and they really just gave him what he wanted even though they knew it would lead to his death.
As far as Jon goes, if the realm chose him as king I think he would rule. He wouldn't like it but he would do his duty just as Ned would've done and just like Jon has already done when he was voted lord commander of the nights watch.
I don't think he would wage a war to gain the throne though. The throne would have to be vacant already or he would rule from winterfell or maybe even Dragonstone. Both would be his ancestral homes.
However I don't think any of that happens. Jon probably is AA IMO so it will be his actions that win the war but I think his fight will be in the shadows far away from the public eye. Dany and her dragons will be who are heralded as heroes and proclaimed savior of the realm.
Posted on 11/29/13 at 12:02 am to Jayre
quote:
that he's Coldhands
Coldhands is too old to be Benjen.
The children of the forest say that this about the others killing Coldhands: " they killed him long, long ago".
That statement is coming from a race of people with lifespans of hundreds maybe even thousands of years. Benjen had been missing for what 2-3 years? That's like a week in the minds of the Children not "long long ago".
I personally don't think we ever hear from or see Benjen again. He served his purposes as a literary device. He got Jon to the wall and he got the watch to the fist of the first men. I think his fate remains a mystery and a testament to the unforgiving nature of beyond the wall.
This post was edited on 11/29/13 at 12:05 am
Posted on 11/29/13 at 5:39 am to CottonWasKing
I agree with most of what you said, but I don't see Dany sitting the IT at the end. And I think she's going to be very polarizing when she arrives in Westeros. Some fans think she's a red herring. I think she's going to play a huge role vs. The Others but I'm not sure if I see her living to the end of the series.
Posted on 11/29/13 at 6:14 am to ladytiger118
I honestly don't even see the iron throne existing at the end of this story. At least not in the sense that it will be the seat of the ruler of the 7 kingdoms. I think we see westeros go back to how they stood before Aegon the conqueror won it at the field of fire.
Probably not exactly because I don't see 7 individual independent kingdoms but I think the continent will definitely be divided.
The north will be independent from the throne as will Dorne. I would almost stake my life on that.
The iron islands will likely be free as well or under the control of the north one.
The riverlands will likely be a vassal of winterfell at least officially.
The westerlands are pretty much up for grabs but I could see Tyrian ending up with them.
The stormlands will be ruled by Stannis if he survives if he doesn't then Davos will likely rule in his stead until myrcella comes of age unless Stannis names an heir which I don't see happening.
The reach is a wildcard. I see them taking some very heavy casualties here soon and Dorne would love to encroach on the riches that land possesses.
So I pretty much said all that just say this. I don't think the iron throne or who sits it will really be relevant by the end. It already holds pretty much no actual power and it hasn't since Tywin was killed. The form of rule that the targaryens created died with the man who sacked the city and removed them from power ironically enough.
Probably not exactly because I don't see 7 individual independent kingdoms but I think the continent will definitely be divided.
The north will be independent from the throne as will Dorne. I would almost stake my life on that.
The iron islands will likely be free as well or under the control of the north one.
The riverlands will likely be a vassal of winterfell at least officially.
The westerlands are pretty much up for grabs but I could see Tyrian ending up with them.
The stormlands will be ruled by Stannis if he survives if he doesn't then Davos will likely rule in his stead until myrcella comes of age unless Stannis names an heir which I don't see happening.
The reach is a wildcard. I see them taking some very heavy casualties here soon and Dorne would love to encroach on the riches that land possesses.
So I pretty much said all that just say this. I don't think the iron throne or who sits it will really be relevant by the end. It already holds pretty much no actual power and it hasn't since Tywin was killed. The form of rule that the targaryens created died with the man who sacked the city and removed them from power ironically enough.
Posted on 11/29/13 at 6:36 am to CottonWasKing
Well said 
Posted on 11/29/13 at 8:39 am to ladytiger118
I stand by my theory Tyrian is the Ben Franklin of westros. Rich, smart and whoring
Posted on 11/29/13 at 11:58 am to ladytiger118
So who is the biggest beta in the series?
I nominate Tristifer Botley.
I nominate Tristifer Botley.
Posted on 11/29/13 at 3:59 pm to Cosmo
quote:
So who is the biggest beta in the series?
I love the guy but...
Posted on 11/29/13 at 4:07 pm to CottonWasKing
quote:
I personally don't think we ever hear from or see Benjen again. He served his purposes as a literary device. He got Jon to the wall and he got the watch to the fist of the first men. I think his fate remains a mystery and a testament to the unforgiving nature of beyond the wall.
I really hope he's the "Prologue" character in WoW.
Posted on 11/29/13 at 4:13 pm to OMLandshark
I tend to think he shows back up myself.
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