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Started By
Message
re: You vax clown-experts, get in here and explain your stance
Posted on 9/21/21 at 7:20 am to Eli Goldfinger
Posted on 9/21/21 at 7:20 am to Eli Goldfinger
quote:
I’m genuinely curious
I'm more curious.
Are you a Doctor in the Shoals area?
You are releasing patient information from Hellen Keller Hospital on a public message board.
This post was edited on 9/21/21 at 7:27 am
1
Posted on 9/21/21 at 7:25 am to jp4lsu
I love the 3 & 5 downvotes on my 2 posts above, and no rebuttal or contrary information.
There is no contrary info because it is a fact that an mRNA "vax" has not been successful in animal or human trials. Muchless there is absolutely no knowledge of long term affects in the future and they are not certain if ADE(Antibody-dependent Enhancement) will create adverse effects when the virus or a variant of the virus is reintroduced to the patient.
They haven't figured out why ADE happens. Go read about in NIH website. Sure it will help some and then ADE could occur in others. They don't have a grasp on why it happens. This is why it has been unsuccessful in development.
There is no contrary info because it is a fact that an mRNA "vax" has not been successful in animal or human trials. Muchless there is absolutely no knowledge of long term affects in the future and they are not certain if ADE(Antibody-dependent Enhancement) will create adverse effects when the virus or a variant of the virus is reintroduced to the patient.
They haven't figured out why ADE happens. Go read about in NIH website. Sure it will help some and then ADE could occur in others. They don't have a grasp on why it happens. This is why it has been unsuccessful in development.
Posted on 9/21/21 at 7:26 am to Eli Goldfinger
quote:
I’m genuinely curious as to what is the mechanism by which the mrna vaccines become deadly in the future.
That’s not how this works. How about you cite one long tail study on these vaccines so you can prove to us nothing happens.
That’s how every other vaccine in history has been studied except for this one.
Eagerly awaiting your super scientific response that’s not political.
Posted on 9/21/21 at 7:28 am to RebelExpress38
quote:bullshite. There's plenty of people here saying it will happen. So, yeah, that is how it works.
That’s not how this works.
Posted on 9/21/21 at 7:33 am to RebelExpress38
Eli is releasing patient information on a public message board.
He has to be a doctor in the Shoals area to release the info he's released.
He needs a perma ban and law enforcement called on his arse.
He has given out patient information.
He has to be a doctor in the Shoals area to release the info he's released.
He needs a perma ban and law enforcement called on his arse.
He has given out patient information.
Posted on 9/21/21 at 7:56 am to jp4lsu
ADE is not specific to mRNA vaccines. It is a phenomenon that can and has occurred with conventional style of vaccines and with certain viral diseases themselves. ADE is a real thing, but is one of the major considerations with development of any vaccine. This isn’t some back room mystery thing that is going to take scientists by surprise, that a few brilliant rogues are trying to warn the world about. It’s basically vaccine 101. ADE has thus far prevented an effective RSV vaccine, but it also was an issue with early versions of measles vaccines. Measles vaccines are now in every day use, because they developed a way to do it that does not cause ADE. That hasn’t been solved yet in RSV.
Again, ADE is not an mRNA vaccine problem. It is an antibody/antigen/cell interaction problem. The method whereby the antibodies are produced is not the relevant factor.
And IF It was going to occur, when will it happen? ADE isn’t some latent seed that will erupt at some point. It has to do with how the pathogen and the immune complex interacts. We have both the pathogen and the immune complexes interacting in millions of people. Where is the ADE? Hint: Infection rate is not what you need to look for. Infection severity is what you would need to look for. If this was a thing, the vaccinated people would be much sicker overall than the non vaccinated. This is not happening.
Just a point of clarification to this discussion.
ADE is real
ADE is not good
ADE is NOT mRNA vaccine related issue. It is an issue of ‘immunity gone wrong’ that can and has happened with immunity from any source including the more traditional viral vaccines and from natural acquired immunity.
ADE is not happening despite millions of vaccine doses and millions of infections.
If a variant comes along that is enhanced by ADE, guess what? Yes, the vaccinated will get sicker than they would otherwise. And so would the previously infected. The immunity conferred by either source would now be a detriment.
Again, ADE is not an mRNA vaccine problem. It is an antibody/antigen/cell interaction problem. The method whereby the antibodies are produced is not the relevant factor.
And IF It was going to occur, when will it happen? ADE isn’t some latent seed that will erupt at some point. It has to do with how the pathogen and the immune complex interacts. We have both the pathogen and the immune complexes interacting in millions of people. Where is the ADE? Hint: Infection rate is not what you need to look for. Infection severity is what you would need to look for. If this was a thing, the vaccinated people would be much sicker overall than the non vaccinated. This is not happening.
Just a point of clarification to this discussion.
ADE is real
ADE is not good
ADE is NOT mRNA vaccine related issue. It is an issue of ‘immunity gone wrong’ that can and has happened with immunity from any source including the more traditional viral vaccines and from natural acquired immunity.
ADE is not happening despite millions of vaccine doses and millions of infections.
If a variant comes along that is enhanced by ADE, guess what? Yes, the vaccinated will get sicker than they would otherwise. And so would the previously infected. The immunity conferred by either source would now be a detriment.
Posted on 9/21/21 at 8:00 am to MrLarson
quote:
You are releasing patient information from Hellen Keller Hospital on a public message board.
Publicly available info.
Do you understand how PHI works?
Posted on 9/21/21 at 8:02 am to MrLarson
quote:
He has given out patient information.
Link?
Posted on 9/21/21 at 8:03 am to Eli Goldfinger
I am no expert.
All I know is my wife, pharmacist recently had 2 doctors come in for their Pfizer shots. Another was a nurse in tears...literally crying of gratitude for the vax booster...
each told my wife about the conditions "it's horrible what we're seeing, worse than last year"
I mean we can bat this covid vax thing back and forth all day long
If you haven't attended a funeral from someone dying from the Covid then perhaps you won't ever think the vax is a good thing.
I conclude the board is only looking at things that fit their belief the whole thing is a government conspiracy to control us.
All I know is my wife, pharmacist recently had 2 doctors come in for their Pfizer shots. Another was a nurse in tears...literally crying of gratitude for the vax booster...
each told my wife about the conditions "it's horrible what we're seeing, worse than last year"
I mean we can bat this covid vax thing back and forth all day long
If you haven't attended a funeral from someone dying from the Covid then perhaps you won't ever think the vax is a good thing.
I conclude the board is only looking at things that fit their belief the whole thing is a government conspiracy to control us.
Posted on 9/21/21 at 8:06 am to ApexTiger
quote:
the board is only looking at things that fit their belief the whole thing is a government conspiracy to control us.
I’m as politically conservative as anyone on this board, but the antivax stance by many conservatives is pretty embarrassing.
I hate mandates, but I also hate purposeful ignorance.
Posted on 9/21/21 at 8:10 am to ApexTiger
quote:
If you haven't attended a funeral from someone dying from the Covid then perhaps you won't ever think the vax is a good thing.
How many vaccines does it take to prevent one death?
Posted on 9/21/21 at 8:11 am to Eli Goldfinger
You’re conflating the issue and ignoring the context. I hope it makes you feel smarter. It doesn’t make you look smarter.
Posted on 9/21/21 at 8:14 am to yallallcrazy
Yes you are correct yallallcrazy. ADE is not specific to mRNA vaccine and can occur with vaccines created in a conventional manner using dead virus. I never said this is only specific to mRNA vax's.
My statement on mRNA is that there hasn't been a successful mRNA vax that made it thru trials in animal or human and there isn't any knowledge of long term effects. You couple that with the risks of ADE potential and it looks less attractive as a solution.
My statement on mRNA is that there hasn't been a successful mRNA vax that made it thru trials in animal or human and there isn't any knowledge of long term effects. You couple that with the risks of ADE potential and it looks less attractive as a solution.
Posted on 9/21/21 at 8:14 am to Eli Goldfinger
quote:
I hate mandates, but I also hate purposeful ignorance.
If I have already had covid - why is my government mandating me to get a vaccine I don't want and offering me no choice but to lose my job in the matter. That is fricked up beyond recognition. I lost my father to covid. What would have been good for my father and might have saved his life - key word - might - since we know people who are vaccinated can also end up dead from covid but for me - I've already had covid and survived it and now i'm being forced by my shitty arse govt to get a vaccine.
Posted on 9/21/21 at 8:23 am to Prettyboy Floyd
quote:
why is my government mandating me to get a vaccine
They should not be doing that.
We agree on this.
Posted on 9/21/21 at 8:25 am to ApexTiger
quote:
I conclude the board is only looking at things that fit their belief the whole thing is a government conspiracy to control us.
I would disagree with this statement. I don't look at this as govt conspiracy but as me doing my due diligence in getting facts, and researching and not putting my life and faith in bureaucrats who have flipped flopped, been inconsistent in their direction, have motives, have been caught lying and covering, and have ignored successful therapeutics and even ignored basic health advice of supercharging immune systems. Instead they place all hope on a vaccine and then decide they are going to play God and force it on everybody.
This doesn't make me or others that might hesitate on the vax conspiracy theorist.
Now I do think that there is a huge over-reach of govt to grab power from the individual and their power to make decisions for themselves. This was done with Obamacare and this is the next step in removing or rights as individuals to chose what is best for us and our family and even community.
Posted on 9/21/21 at 8:25 am to the808bass
quote:
You’re conflating the issue and ignoring the context. I hope it makes you feel smarter. It doesn’t make you look smarter.
Explain this conflation.
Posted on 9/21/21 at 8:27 am to Eli Goldfinger
quote:
Explain
Explain how you're getting patient information for Hellen Keller Hospital?
Posted on 9/21/21 at 8:28 am to jp4lsu
quote:
no human MRNA vax has been successful, and the same is true for animal trials. None have been successful and ADE was the cause for failure.
You said this. It may not be how you meant it, but it basically is saying that mRNA vaccines are bad because ADE. That is incorrect. The biggest issue with mRNA vaccines was getting the mRNA transported into the cell. This was the big problem. Like most big problems, it appears to have been solved when the research went from smoldering along as something really cool to be researched, to hyper speed when there was an impetus to do so.
If a person has reason to be concerned about a new vaccine technology, ADE isn’t one. ADE exists or doesn’t exist independent of the tech used in the vaccine. And in point of fact, independent of whether there even is a vaccine. So,
Posted on 9/21/21 at 8:29 am to Eli Goldfinger
What is your take on natural immunity?
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