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re: Why does the cake baker allow gay couples to buy his premade cakes?
Posted on 12/5/17 at 5:09 pm to Jeff Boomhauer
Posted on 12/5/17 at 5:09 pm to Jeff Boomhauer
quote:
Is being a Klan member a protected class?
So Constitutional rights only apply to the "protected class"?
0
Posted on 12/5/17 at 5:17 pm to SUB
quote:
why shouldn't the sale of a pre-made cake that he knows will be used in a gay wedding also violate his moral principles?
You answered your own question. Since he doesn't ask a person if they are gay before selling them a cake, how would he know?
Posted on 12/5/17 at 5:35 pm to Revelator
I think you misunderstood. He told the gay couple that they could buy one of his premade cakes available in the store. He knew they were gay.
Posted on 12/5/17 at 5:40 pm to SUB
quote:
. He told the gay couple that they could buy one of his premade cakes available in the store. He knew they were gay
Because they asked for a customized design instead of buying one off the shelf.
This is a big distinction. IMO the baker should be allowed to refuse a customized service for any or no reason. He should not be allowed to bar gays from his retail store.
This post was edited on 12/5/17 at 5:43 pm
Posted on 12/5/17 at 5:43 pm to SUB
quote:
He told the gay couple that they could buy one of his premade cakes available in the store. He knew they were gay.
I presume they feel the custom made cakes are more meaningful for them.
Some restaurants will say "No substitutions"
They will make you the roasted vegetables to go with one dish. But, not if you order the one that comes with corn and potatoes.
I have been a HUGE friend of Gay Marriage rights. But, I see no reason why this cake maker MUST accept this assignment.
What I wish they would do is this:
Baker: I don't make custom cakes for Gay weddings
Gays: You HAVE to. Its the law!!!
Baker: Okay. I suppose the law forces me. So, I'll make it. Come pick it up in 2 weeks
...2 weeks later....
Gays: HEY! This cake is NOT like the one we ordered! We asked for PINK FROSTING and THREE TIERS!!! This is Chocolate frosting and 1 Tier and that one is all COLLAPSED!!!"
Baker: You say that is NOT the cake you ordered? Hmmm...that is QUEER, ain't it? Say...that seemed to work out just fine, no?
Posted on 12/5/17 at 5:47 pm to SUB
quote:
He told the gay couple that they could buy one of his premade cakes available in the store.
There's no indication that was stated:
quote:
In the case, Charlie Craig and David Mullins walked into Masterpiece Cakeshop, owned by Jack Phillips, and said they “wanted a wedding cake.” Phillips replied that he would make them a cake for other events like a birthday or a shower but would not make a cake for a same-sex wedding. The couple got up and left. There was no discussion of any words, symbols, or designs the couple might want. The entire exchange lasted twenty seconds.
The briefing for the petitioners and some of their supporting amici assert that Mullins and Craig asked Phillips to “design and create” a wedding cake. The Colorado appeals court repeated that formulation without citing anything in the record to support it. But Phillips’ own account of the exchange, in his affidavit, says nothing about a request that he “design and create” a cake. Instead, he says the couple told him simply that they “wanted a wedding cake for ‘our wedding’” and that he replied, “I just don’t make cakes for same-sex weddings.”
LINK
Posted on 12/5/17 at 5:59 pm to SUB
quote:
He told the gay couple that they could buy one of his premade cakes available in the store. He knew they were gay.
And?
Posted on 12/5/17 at 6:02 pm to SUB
quote:
My point is that his moral compass is inconsistent.
How so?
It's his "moral compass". It's not up to you or anyone else to judge it valid or not.
This post was edited on 12/5/17 at 6:04 pm
Posted on 12/5/17 at 6:06 pm to cwill
quote:
But Phillips’ own account of the exchange, in his affidavit, says nothing about a request that he “design and create” a cake.
But if it, in fact, was to be a custom cake, then you side with the bakers...right?
Posted on 12/5/17 at 6:09 pm to Dale51
Not judging if his moral compass is right. Stating a fact that it is inconsistent.
Posted on 12/5/17 at 6:29 pm to SUB
quote:
Stating a fact that it is inconsistent.
You initially didn't claim it was "right"..or wrong, you claimed it wasn't "valid". That is what I pointed out...it's not up to you or anyone else to judge it valid or not. It is his moral compass.
Posted on 12/5/17 at 6:48 pm to SUB
quote:
He told the gay couple that they could buy one of his premade cakes available in the store. He knew they were gay.
But he didn't spend several hours working on those cakes with his conscience grating on him.
When you force him to spend his time and energy violating his conscience you are forcing someone to do psychological harm to themselves.
What kind of sick bastard does that to someone?
Posted on 12/5/17 at 7:07 pm to TrueTiger
quote:
But he didn't spend several hours working on those cakes with his conscience grating on him.
When you force him to spend his time and energy violating his conscience you are forcing someone to do psychological harm to themselves.
I know. So he a only cares if he has to knowingly put a lot of effort into the act that he opposes. A sale is no big deal and principles go out the window.
If you are morally against murder, are you ok with selling someone a weapon, knowing that they plan to murder someone with it because of the level of effort?
This post was edited on 12/5/17 at 7:10 pm
Posted on 12/5/17 at 7:07 pm to SUB
If he doesn’t know those sinful gays are buying his cakes then he has plausible deniability with his lord and savior.
But if he knows he’s baking a cake to celebrate their decision to be gay...one way ticket to a lifetime of eternal damnation in hell fire.
But if he knows he’s baking a cake to celebrate their decision to be gay...one way ticket to a lifetime of eternal damnation in hell fire.
Posted on 12/5/17 at 7:18 pm to SUB
quote:
If you are morally against murder, are you ok with selling someone a weapon, knowing that they plan to murder someone with it because of the level of effort?
Of course not.
I stand with you against this mighty man of straw.
Posted on 12/5/17 at 7:25 pm to SUB
where does the Bible.. this bakers religious text.. say anything at all about gay marriage?
thanks.
thanks.
Posted on 12/5/17 at 7:36 pm to TrueTiger
quote:
What kind of sick bastard does that to someone
Grand standing gay men
Posted on 12/5/17 at 7:41 pm to bmy
It's his conscience that matters.
Not the bible.
There are atheists that don't agree with gay relationships.
Not the bible.
There are atheists that don't agree with gay relationships.
This post was edited on 12/5/17 at 7:43 pm
Posted on 12/5/17 at 7:45 pm to TrueTiger
quote:
It's his conscience that matters.
Not the bible.
There are atheists that don't agree with gay relationships.
so it's not his religious convictions then?
interesting
Posted on 12/5/17 at 7:45 pm to SUB
What would be the outcome if a customer walked into a graphic arts and printing shop owned by a devout Muslim couple and wanted them to print posters from a drawing that mocks the prophet Mohammad, should they be legally required to print them, is this not the same situation as the baker?
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