- My Forums
- Tiger Rant
- LSU Recruiting
- SEC Rant
- Saints Talk
- Pelicans Talk
- More Sports Board
- Fantasy Sports
- Golf Board
- Soccer Board
- O-T Lounge
- Tech Board
- Home/Garden Board
- Outdoor Board
- Health/Fitness Board
- Movie/TV Board
- Book Board
- Music Board
- Political Talk
- Money Talk
- Fark Board
- Gaming Board
- Travel Board
- Food/Drink Board
- Ticket Exchange
- TD Help Board
Customize My Forums- View All Forums
- Show Left Links
- Topic Sort Options
- Trending Topics
- Recent Topics
- Active Topics
Started By
Message
re: Why are we afraid of Democratic Socialism?
Posted on 2/12/20 at 10:49 am to beerJeep
Posted on 2/12/20 at 10:49 am to beerJeep
quote:
Which is more socialist than what we have now
The Bismarck model is the major model we have now. What do you think the Bismarck model is? Again, employer sponsored health insurance is the Bismarck model, and its NHE costs are much lower than the government run programs.
quote:
Except supply rises as well. Each year more doctors arrive on the scene. Each year, more accessible treatments are found. Each year, new drugs are discovered.
Demand has been increasing steadily since the 70s, despite new medical schools, expansion of mid-level providers, and technology advancements. Healthcare costs are rising everywhere in the world, and have been for a long time. Supply can't keep up, unfortunately.
2
Posted on 2/12/20 at 10:50 am to crazy4lsu
quote:
The Bismarck model can deal with this more effectively, as long as the person is employed. A person can pay for what level of coverage they want.
But even that won't solve the barriers to access problems. If your insurer cannot make a profit then there is no incentive to be efficient with coverage. If coverage isn't efficient then use will not efficient - unless you had some type of deductible system.
quote:
It's the unemployed that are the problem in the Bismarck model.
It's the free-rider problem that is always the issue when looking at the economics of any system.
Posted on 2/12/20 at 10:50 am to CptRusty
quote:
What do they think is going to happen when people with private insurance aren't massively overpaying for the same procedures in order to prop up the medicare payouts?
Medicare pays far better than Medicaid.
And the other assumption that kills national healthcare systems is the assumption that people use healthcare when they’re sick.
Posted on 2/12/20 at 10:51 am to DimTigerDontHate
In Trump's America, i get to walk my dog.
In the Sanders- AOC- wacky Democrats version of America, I'll have to eat my dog.
What questions do you have?
In the Sanders- AOC- wacky Democrats version of America, I'll have to eat my dog.
What questions do you have?
Posted on 2/12/20 at 10:51 am to DimTigerDontHate
quote:
We already live in a socialist society in many respects, and it has only worked towards the betterment of society.
Posted on 2/12/20 at 10:51 am to crazy4lsu
quote:
Demand has been increasing steadily since the 70s, despite new medical schools, expansion of mid-level providers, and technology advancements.
Well that's what happens when we become a society of sugar-devouring sedate slobs.
Posted on 2/12/20 at 10:51 am to crazy4lsu
quote:
Demand has been increasing steadily since the 70s, despite new medical schools, expansion of mid-level providers, and technology advancements. Healthcare costs are rising everywhere in the world, and have been for a long time. Supply can't keep up, unfortunately.
Posted on 2/12/20 at 10:51 am to the808bass
quote:Thats how socialized systems lower costs.
Every scheme that covers everyone is going to be an “overt rationing scheme.”
Posted on 2/12/20 at 10:53 am to Taxing Authority
Artificially decreasing demand is the only hope for socialized medicine.
Posted on 2/12/20 at 10:54 am to the808bass
quote:
Every scheme that covers everyone is going to be an “overt rationing scheme.”
In a system where everyone has private insurance, getting what you pay for is a better way of dealing with rationing (as in you choose what you need) rather than the Beveridge and NHI models which dictate to you what you need.
We could have UHC with private insurance right now given what we spend per capita on healthcare. You would need to reorganize things, cut Medicare, Medicaid, and all other government healthcare programs. Put another way, if Medicare, Medicaid etc. were privatized right now, you'd see significant NHE savings with the same amount of coverage.
Posted on 2/12/20 at 10:55 am to crazy4lsu
quote:
The vast majority of medical innovation is done right here in America. Not many medical innovations and new drugs coming out of Germany, GB, France, Norway, etc. Wonder what is behind all those new innovations and breakthroughs.
Do you have any idea cpt? Can you help me figure out why on earth these other countries seem to be unable to come up with new medical procedures and drugs?
Posted on 2/12/20 at 10:55 am to DimTigerDontHate
1.
2.
3.
4.
5.
6.
7.
8.
9.
10.
2.
3.
4.
5.
6.
7.
8.
9.
10.
Posted on 2/12/20 at 10:56 am to DimTigerDontHate
quote:Has it?
We already live in a socialist society in many respects, and it has only worked towards the betterment of society.
Has the govt state and the lack of personal accountability been a good thing. Lets face it, we are a young, young country. And we are falling apart waiting on govt to fix things.
Things that suck in life in the US: Bridges and roadways, public schools, charity health systems, the VA, welfare programs....
Medicare and Social Security are definitely going to go broke.
What is doing well. Private schools, toll roads, and free enterprise.
The only thing the govt does well that it should be doing is providing for a common defense....and the far left thinks that needs to be minimized.
Posted on 2/12/20 at 10:56 am to DimTigerDontHate
quote:
Why do I get the feeling that if public libraries and public schooling didn't already exist today, they would be seen as some far left radical socialist idea?
Some people support that idea.
Libraries are locally funded and almost all of them have a "friends of XYZ Libraries" to help raise additional money for them.
Schools are almost entirely local and state funded, the fed money going to them outside of the meal program is relatively small.
The VA system is a disaster, and medicare / social security are pyramid schemes that are getting closer to collapsing. Medicaid is such a terrible program that more and more doctors are refusing to accept it. That's part of the reason so many poors go to the hospital... docs won't take medicaid.
I'm a big proponent of state's rights, and if some states want to implement more socialist ideas in their states, they can knock themselves out. Let them form their own state single payer health system. Let them make college free for all state residents.
It might be a disaster, but it would be more manageable on a state level.
Posted on 2/12/20 at 10:56 am to Antonio Moss
quote:
If your insurer cannot make a profit then there is no incentive to be efficient with coverage.
The German solution to this was to make insurance companies non-profit, which had the effect of increasing the number of companies that offer plans, which number around 200. One of the best healthcare providers in the US, Kaiser, is also non-profit with profit making subsidiaries, if I recall.
Posted on 2/12/20 at 10:57 am to crazy4lsu
quote:
In a system where everyone has private insurance, getting what you pay for is a better way of dealing with rationing (as in you choose what you need) rather than the Beveridge and NHI models which dictate to you what you need.
This is some sort of naive misunderstanding of economics at large.
Posted on 2/12/20 at 10:57 am to crazy4lsu
quote:
The vast majority of medical innovation is done right here in America. Not many medical innovations and new drugs coming out of Germany, GB, France, Norway, etc. Wonder what is behind all those new innovations and breakthroughs.
Do you have any idea cpt? Can you help me figure out why on earth these other countries seem to be unable to come up with new medical procedures and drugs?
Posted on 2/12/20 at 10:57 am to the808bass
quote:Correct. No “system” can survive unlimited demand for service.
Artificially decreasing demand is the only hope for socialized medicine.
The only question is... is it better to be limited by a bureaucratic government that treats you like 1 of 300,000,000 people (essentially disposable) or by your own skills and capabilities?
As i watch the opportunity cost of my SS and MEDI increasing by the day—the latter is far preferable.
Posted on 2/12/20 at 10:58 am to the808bass
quote:
This is some sort of naive misunderstanding of economics at large.
What do you mean exactly?
Posted on 2/12/20 at 10:58 am to crazy4lsu
quote:
The vast majority of medical innovation is done right here in America. Not many medical innovations and new drugs coming out of Germany, GB, France, Norway, etc. Wonder what is behind all those new innovations and breakthroughs.
Do you have any idea cpt? Can you help me figure out why on earth these other countries seem to be unable to come up with new medical procedures and drugs?
Page 8 of 22
Popular
Back to top
Follow TigerDroppings for LSU Football News