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Message
re: Vice is rational: forgive student loans; don't give Amazon money
Posted on 11/18/18 at 5:34 pm to upgrayedd
Posted on 11/18/18 at 5:34 pm to upgrayedd
quote:
How do these people not understand the difference between a tax break and giving entities money
Because leftists believe all money to be inherently property of the state. By not taking money from taxpayers, you are essentially stealing the state's resources.
0
Posted on 11/18/18 at 5:37 pm to SlowFlowPro
Neither is a great option.
The only way I would consider a student loan forgiveness option is if it were tied to the government getting completely out of financial aid (except for plans where if you go into the military we will pay for college after so many years).
The only way I would consider a student loan forgiveness option is if it were tied to the government getting completely out of financial aid (except for plans where if you go into the military we will pay for college after so many years).
Posted on 11/18/18 at 5:39 pm to Quidam65
let me also be clear
forgiving student loans and NOT qualifying that forgiveness as income would be irrationally unfair
forgiving student loans and NOT qualifying that forgiveness as income would be irrationally unfair
Posted on 11/18/18 at 5:41 pm to upgrayedd
quote:
How do these people not understand the difference between a tax break and giving entities money
Not voicing my opinion on the deals, but Amazon is getting more than tax breaks. They are getting credits. So let’s at least start with that reality.
This post was edited on 11/18/18 at 5:42 pm
Posted on 11/18/18 at 5:44 pm to cahoots
so we're clear, i don't support these tax packages on a philosophical level
but in terms of reality, states/localities keep offering them so to keep pace you have to just offer the best, bad deal you can or you're totally left out
sometimes it can be very beneficial for everyone (see: the economic engine of LA, SWLA)
sometimes, it can be horrible (see: our film tax credits)
but in terms of reality, states/localities keep offering them so to keep pace you have to just offer the best, bad deal you can or you're totally left out
sometimes it can be very beneficial for everyone (see: the economic engine of LA, SWLA)
sometimes, it can be horrible (see: our film tax credits)
Posted on 11/18/18 at 5:50 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
so we're clear, i don't support these tax packages on a philosophical level
Oh I get your point. It’s a damned if you do, damned if you don’t thing. It’s complicated.
I’m just responding the typical diarrhea spouted about liberals not understanding math. The poster I responded to doesn’t understand this deal, clearly
This post was edited on 11/18/18 at 5:55 pm
Posted on 11/18/18 at 5:51 pm to cahoots
quote:
I’m just responding the typical diarrhea spouted about liberals not understanding math.
these particular ones don't
they also don't understand the difference in wealth and income, as well as the difference in real wealth and paper wealth
Posted on 11/18/18 at 5:51 pm to SlowFlowPro
People get more offended about the peasant getting relief than trillion dollar bailouts to corporations and bank.
My fellow conservatives more annoyed about a 12k loan forgiven than 400 million in foreign aid going to 1 of the dozens of countries who hate us.
People more offended we let our officials pay more in interest to China then everything else combined because we can’t spend properly
My fellow conservatives more annoyed about a 12k loan forgiven than 400 million in foreign aid going to 1 of the dozens of countries who hate us.
People more offended we let our officials pay more in interest to China then everything else combined because we can’t spend properly
Posted on 11/18/18 at 6:01 pm to gobuxgo5
thats the scalability of objective/subjective point of view
The average American really cant wrap his or her brain around half a Trillion dollars, but they sure as shite can relate to Bob my neighbor getting a waiver on a $20k due
The average American really cant wrap his or her brain around half a Trillion dollars, but they sure as shite can relate to Bob my neighbor getting a waiver on a $20k due
Posted on 11/18/18 at 6:05 pm to Uncle Stu
speaking of scalability, how would we even uniformly forgive loans?
so the guy with $20k gets the same benefit as the guy with $200k?
so the guy with $20k gets the same benefit as the guy with $200k?
Posted on 11/18/18 at 6:06 pm to upgrayedd
quote:
How do these people not understand the difference between a tax break and giving entities money
It is more than that. Certain companies shouldn't get deals over other entities. So even if they got the logic wrong, they are still correct.
Either lower the tax burden for everyone or don't. Targeted deals for connected entities is BS.
Posted on 11/18/18 at 6:07 pm to Uncle Stu
Tax subsidies are unconstitional cronyism. Why should one company get something no other business gets.
Forgiving college loans will be the equivalent of devaluing the dollar by however many trillion is owed....no different than printing money and handing it out. Plus ...not very fair to those that actually paid the debt or paid for college.
Neither of these should be done.
Forgiving college loans will be the equivalent of devaluing the dollar by however many trillion is owed....no different than printing money and handing it out. Plus ...not very fair to those that actually paid the debt or paid for college.
Neither of these should be done.
This post was edited on 11/18/18 at 6:08 pm
Posted on 11/18/18 at 6:17 pm to SlowFlowPro
Why should student loans be forgiven? How about car loans? Mortgage? Just payback the loan like you agreed to and move on. Enough already about student loan forgiveness.
Posted on 11/18/18 at 6:21 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
speaking of scalability, how would we even uniformly forgive loans?
I assume you go to the same uninformed political actors from death boards used for socialized heath care to determine value and worth towards the collective in order to prioritize whose debt is forgiven
Posted on 11/18/18 at 6:26 pm to TimeOutdoors
Is pretty straightforward, it is the only remedy available to those who have been defrauded. Don't blame those seeking forgiveness. Some private, for profits have made off like bandits with the Education Department being culpable given its statutory/regulatory authority. Blame the student, fine, but that doesn't release the business nor the government from its responsibilities. Yes, courts have likewise waded in as a course of recourse.
Amount forgiven is considered income.
Student loans have typically been considered off limits via bankruptcy.
Amount forgiven is considered income.
Student loans have typically been considered off limits via bankruptcy.
This post was edited on 11/18/18 at 6:33 pm
Posted on 11/18/18 at 6:34 pm to wfallstiger
quote:
Is pretty straightforward, it is the only remedy available to those who have been defrauded.
Exactly what part of this is "fraud" ??
Posted on 11/18/18 at 6:38 pm to Uncle Stu
The schools themselves under scrutiny used fraudulent means to enroll students, is pretty straightforward. Google can address specifics....Al Collins college Program Performance Review, operated by Career Education Corporation...trades on the stock market. The college I am familiar with was cited by the ED for 18 "serious" Title IV violations....it is your money they are stealing
Want to hold individuals, government entities accountable, fine, apply the same expectations to a business, in this case, colleges for profit
Want to hold individuals, government entities accountable, fine, apply the same expectations to a business, in this case, colleges for profit
This post was edited on 11/18/18 at 6:44 pm
Posted on 11/18/18 at 6:42 pm to TeLeFaWx
quote:
Student loan debt is going to manifest itself as an issue in untold ways. The societal cost of all the Millennials not being able to buy homes and start families might be so great some sort of populist measure might be smart. I have never seen a socialist program that works, so don't think I'm suggesting it, especially not something designed by the Democrats, but it's definitely food for thought. I will agree with Democrats that we shouldn't have privatized student loans. It created a monster.
If one state does it, they might attract a lot of new college graduates. Then (theoretically) businesses would follow - you would not only have an educated workforce, but also one that makes lower salary demands than they otherwise would.
Not saying it's what they should do, just spitballing as far as the rationale.
Posted on 11/18/18 at 6:51 pm to wfallstiger
quote:
used fraudulent means to enroll students, is pretty straightforward.
then your issue is with that institution and would be remedied in a court of law
I still fail to see why the Federal Government should be involved in forgiving any loans, unless the Federal Government was complicit in the act of fraud
quote:
it is your money they are stealing
sounds like its the student's money who threw it down a educational ponzi scheme. When I took a loan out to subsidize my education, yes it was the government's money, but I signed for it, and I had to accept responsibility of repayment.
Posted on 11/18/18 at 6:52 pm to wfallstiger
quote:
Is pretty straightforward, it is the only remedy available to those who have been defrauded.
Diploma Mills aren’t the problem. They’re insignificant.
Legitimate universities are the problem.
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