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re: Tom Homan: “As a Catholic, I think they need to spend time fixing the Catholic Church."

Posted on 11/14/25 at 3:56 pm to
Posted by Champagne
Sabine Free State.
Member since Oct 2007
53786 posts
Posted on 11/14/25 at 3:56 pm to
The Early Church Fathers! Yes, it's good to study them.

Here's a great book - The Fathers Know Best. It's a comprehensive study that demonstrates the solid Church Father foundation of the RCC.

LINK





Posted by Squirrelmeister
Member since Nov 2021
3431 posts
Posted on 11/14/25 at 4:00 pm to
quote:

I disagree, I'm researching now to convert and it is more true than any protestant church ive ever attended.

It’s definitely more ancient, cooler, and interesting. Swinging the censer, filling the “holy of holies” with incense smoke, and singing to invoke the presence of Yahweh into the unleavened holy shewbread almost makes me feel like I’m sitting in a temple of the Yahwist cult before the Babylonian conquest.

Just don’t send your children to be altar-servers and you’ll be alright.
Posted by Diamondawg
Mississippi
Member since Oct 2006
37248 posts
Posted on 11/14/25 at 4:03 pm to
quote:

Squirrelmeister
And just like that. You are here.
Posted by aTmTexas Dillo
East Texas Lake
Member since Sep 2018
23021 posts
Posted on 11/14/25 at 4:05 pm to
quote:

How could "the Church" be established prior to the resurrection?


Bingo!
The church formed after the assumption of Christ and Pentecost. John the Baptist was a Jew and died before all these events. He believed the Messiah was coming. He was preparing people for the Messiah.
Posted by ShoeBang
Member since May 2012
21959 posts
Posted on 11/14/25 at 4:05 pm to
quote:

oh get the absolute frick out of here


You have to stop entertaining someone who thinks he knows what Jesus knows. He stated it before. he's either a troll or a blasphemer - neither deserve your time or energy.

He's gonna be very surprised how many catholics got to heaven one day. Even more so when he sees St. Paul.
Posted by Brotorious
NOLA
Member since May 2013
530 posts
Posted on 11/14/25 at 4:08 pm to
quote:

The Catholic Church is not the religion of following Jesu


The Catholic Church is a tool for those that seek Christ like any other church or denomination. There are shitty people in all corners of the world, in all places of the world.

You lose sight of the fact that God is a blanket that we put over the mystery to give it shape….so that our small feeble minds can comprehend the mystery.
Posted by RebRxV
Member since Oct 2022
489 posts
Posted on 11/14/25 at 4:15 pm to
quote:

The Catholic Church is not the religion of following Jesus.


Please, please, please stop showing your ignorance. Attend a Mass with an open mind, then discuss your statement.
Posted by 3down10
Member since Sep 2014
38822 posts
Posted on 11/14/25 at 4:15 pm to
quote:



Paul was not a false prophet.
And who are you or the man that taught you that to make that claim today?
The other disciples didn't reject him in fact they were astonished by his understanding of the scriptures.
They took is admonishment.

But you know better.


I know the father. I was taught by what you would call the Holy Spirit, the one and only true teacher.

These things you believe impossible because they have been replaced by ceremony/tradition/idols and symbols.

When I read the words of Jesus, I see the same understanding I was taught. In that way I know the father was in him, I see it. I learned the understanding separate of Jesus, and it was actually Christians who would point out Jesus to me when I would talk about things. I can explain most everything in modern terms.

Which is crazy because I grew up Christian and the words of Jesus just didn't hit the same. They had no meaning even though I was "saved". Basically amounted to be nice and believe this one thing about Jesus.

Today you could straight up prove to me that Jesus never existed and it would not matter to me at all, because whoever wrote the story knows the father. You don't get that level of understanding from anything else. Without the father there is no understanding.

Unfortunately I do not see that when I read Paul. Instead I see what I was taught not to do. Being that he was a Pharisee, it's not all that surprising that he can point out the flaws in others. He would know the ancient texts, which were the religious texts of the time much better than most.

But when I see Paul praising "Jesus", he is praising the idol, the label and the sacrifice. Turns the murder into the thing that saves you, not his life. We see strict adherence to rituals and such out of the church, a signature of the Pharisees. Bringing the authority back to the scribes rather than the people themselves. Removes the actual relationship with god and understanding for idols and symbolism. I wish it wasn't so, I've tried and tried to think I just misunderstand Paul, but it's like asking me to accept 1+1=3. I just can't.

Idol worship is btw the main reason both Islam and Judiasm put down Christianity and they are correct. But then they also don't like the trinity, which I think is a misunderstanding.

Posted by CDUBTX
TX
Member since Mar 2022
326 posts
Posted on 11/14/25 at 4:22 pm to
We’re all believers and shouldn’t be infighting. We should however be considering people like Ben Shapiro who said Jesus was just a Jew who revolted against the Romans and was crucified for his trouble. Verbatim. Let’s focus our arguments toward those that deserve it.
Posted by LSUbest
Coastal Plain
Member since Aug 2007
15107 posts
Posted on 11/14/25 at 4:25 pm to
So you don't grasp the spiritual allegories in the old testament.
I didn't either until I continued studying the bible.
Paul's work has revealed so much to me it's breathtaking.
I can't say how many times I was overjoyed with a new revelation.
Posted by 3down10
Member since Sep 2014
38822 posts
Posted on 11/14/25 at 4:26 pm to
quote:



The Catholic Church is a tool for those that seek Christ like any other church or denomination. There are shitty people in all corners of the world, in all places of the world.

You lose sight of the fact that God is a blanket that we put over the mystery to give it shape….so that our small feeble minds can comprehend the mystery.


It's a replacement for God, and to prevent people from finding God.

God is not a blanket. God is the highest level of consciousness. We are a limited level of consciousness, of which is required to have experience. That's why God is within. Do you think that means sitting next to your kidney? Your soul/spirit is a piece of God.

Thus God is the father and we are the children. Now in our limited perceptions we can not perceive the father directly in it's entirety, it would destroy us, aka the death of the soul. And that is where what you would call the holy spirit comes in. It will show you this and teach you things. I just saw it as God, but in understanding it matches the holy spirit and the trinity. And you will understand exactly what Jesus means when he says - that which is flesh is flesh and that which is spirit is spirit.

And with that will come understanding on the commandments as well, why you need to keep them. There is an actual path to follow.

It's in me, it's in you, it's in all of us assuming they have a soul. But we look out there for God and answers. Look to the church, look to other men. But God is within, not out there.
Posted by 3down10
Member since Sep 2014
38822 posts
Posted on 11/14/25 at 4:30 pm to
quote:

So you don't grasp the spiritual allegories in the old testament.
I didn't either until I continued studying the bible.
Paul's work has revealed so much to me it's breathtaking.
I can't say how many times I was overjoyed with a new revelation.


Which ones?

The biggest use I have for the bible is to have common terminology to express things between men. Because I don't really have labels for these things otherwise.

Beyond that, you are merely describing the job/function of the Pharisees. Which isn't surprising considering Paul was a Pharisee.

Posted by LSUbest
Coastal Plain
Member since Aug 2007
15107 posts
Posted on 11/14/25 at 4:39 pm to
quote:

Beyond that, you are merely describing the job/function of the Pharisees.


No. Not one did what Paul did. And Jesus rebuked them for their wicked hearts.

quote:

Which ones?


Many. Melchizedek in Hebrews.

Hebrews is full of them. It was a fog to me the first 4-5 times reading it.

The sacrifices from Genesis. It all points to Jesus.

"Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

Paul explains them all.

But just because you don't "feel" Paul doesn't mean he's a false prophet.
Posted by gaetti15
AK
Member since Apr 2013
14848 posts
Posted on 11/14/25 at 4:42 pm to
quote:

hich ones?

The biggest use I have for the bible is to have common terminology to express things between men. Because I don't really have labels for these things otherwise.

Beyond that, you are merely describing the job/function of the Pharisees. Which isn't surprising considering Paul was a Pharisee.


so question, do you reject the letters of Paul in the NT?

Trying to figure out if you a modern day Marcionite or Ebionite or like a Christian anarchist
This post was edited on 11/14/25 at 4:44 pm
Posted by LSUbest
Coastal Plain
Member since Aug 2007
15107 posts
Posted on 11/14/25 at 4:48 pm to
Get a Dake's Annotated Reference Bible.

You'll have to ignore the obvious denominational stuff but he notes what scriptures from the old testament that is mentioned in the new testament.
Posted by 3down10
Member since Sep 2014
38822 posts
Posted on 11/14/25 at 4:57 pm to
quote:

No. Not one did what Paul did. And Jesus rebuked them for their wicked hearts.


He persecuted Christians, then suddenly he becomes the one who creates the religion in the name of Jesus. All of with the same theme of the Pharisees/Scribs/Priests/Pope or whatever you want to call them being the authority.

Replacements for the real thing. Jesus tells you directly in John 14 the holy spirit is what will teach you. Not Paul. When offered to become the religious/political authority, Jesus rejected it. He was also rejected by the Pharisees and others for this very reason because they believed the Messiah would restore Davids kingdom, aka Greater Israel.

quote:


Many. Melchizedek in Hebrews.

Hebrews is full of them. It was a fog to me the first 4-5 times reading it.

The sacrifices from Genesis. It all points to Jesus.

"Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

Paul explains them all.

But just because you don't "feel" Paul doesn't mean he's a false prophet.


If a man has an extremely important message to give you with instructions that will save your life and the life of others. He travels through hell, takes many wounds in the process of delivering this message. He makes it to your door step and hands you the message with his last breathe.

Would you not say that man sacrificed his life to save you? Would you then worship his death as being that which saves you? Would you then make trinkets out of the tools used to kill him?

Or do you think maybe the message and instructions he was trying to give you was so important that he sacrificed himself to give them to you knowing what the consequences of his actions would be. And that you should put more importance into that message and those instructions than you should towards the death of the messenger.

Sacrifice may not mean what you think it means.
This post was edited on 11/14/25 at 5:13 pm
Posted by 3down10
Member since Sep 2014
38822 posts
Posted on 11/14/25 at 5:06 pm to
quote:

so question, do you reject the letters of Paul in the NT?

Trying to figure out if you a modern day Marcionite or Ebionite or like a Christian anarchist


I reject anything that isn't inline with the understanding I was given. I see the father in Jesus, I do not see him in Paul.

I don't belong to any religion. But feel free to put whatever label makes you feel happiest. At least I have the luxury to only get downvoted rather than stoned.
Posted by Brotorious
NOLA
Member since May 2013
530 posts
Posted on 11/14/25 at 5:47 pm to
Everything I wrote went
Over your head.
Posted by Ponchy Tiger
Ponchatoula
Member since Aug 2004
48984 posts
Posted on 11/14/25 at 5:53 pm to
quote:

they are a for profit conglomerate that is pretty far removed from Jesus. There are some good priests and nuns who are salt of the Earth people, but beyond that it's not the church of Jesus.


What Church do you follow or attend?
Posted by 3down10
Member since Sep 2014
38822 posts
Posted on 11/14/25 at 5:54 pm to
quote:

Get a Dake's Annotated Reference Bible.

You'll have to ignore the obvious denominational stuff but he notes what scriptures from the old testament that is mentioned in the new testament.


Thanks, but I don't really care about these kind of Pharisee type things.

I'll refer you to Matthew 23

There is only one true teacher.
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