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Started By
Message
1
Posted on 8/23/25 at 6:31 pm to Knight of Old
quote:
I’m not sure if you consider yourself Christian but if you do, I’d like to know what Bible you read…
I have a old King James bible. Had it since I was a kid. I'm Catholic though. I get my bible passages from online resources too.
Posted on 8/23/25 at 6:32 pm to Pelican fan99
quote:
Did a jew bang your wife or something?
No. An Islamist did not either.
But it seems to be a common practice for many American men.
Posted on 8/23/25 at 6:32 pm to lake chuck fan
quote:
While Christianity and Judaism are different beliefs, they aren't entirely seperable since Christianity was an extension of Judaism.
Islam definitely shares a lot more with Judaism than it does Christianity, and it shares a lot with both. One way to understand Islam would be as a merchant/warrior religion with heavy Jewish practices with an apocryphal story about Jesus, which may have been borrowed from one of the many other apocryphal gospels. There were several Jewish tribes in pre-Islamic Arabia and several are mentioned in the constitution of Medina, as well as two of Muhammad's wives being from Jewish tribes.
Posted on 8/23/25 at 6:35 pm to GumboPot
quote:TheTalmud is more akin to an anthology of essays by Jewish scholars - not sacred text.
You should read some passages from the Talmud. They hate us A LOT more.
Dude, you want to know who hates you, read the Koran…
Posted on 8/23/25 at 6:35 pm to GumboPot
"My religions right those other 15000 ones are wrong. I KNOW because theres a BOOK that for centuries was only readable by those in power and re written because the original was too mean. Its a book guys it must be true!!! Being gone or missing for 2000 years is just a TEST!!"
Posted on 8/23/25 at 6:36 pm to Knight of Old
quote:
TheTalmud is more akin to an anthology of essays by Jewish scholars - not sacred text.
Dude, you want to know who hates you, read the Koran…
I know.
That's why we are not an Islamists nation.
Posted on 8/23/25 at 6:37 pm to GumboPot
We are one nation, under God, period!
Posted on 8/23/25 at 6:40 pm to Gusoline
quote:
"My religions right those other 15000 ones are wrong. I KNOW because theres a BOOK that for centuries was only readable by those in power and re written because the original was too mean. Its a book guys it must be true!!! Being gone or missing for 2000 years is just a TEST!!"
Founding Fathers and their religion:
Abraham Clark,Presbyterian
Arthur Middleton,Episcopalian
Benjamin Franklin,Deist (raised Presbyterian)
Benjamin Harrison,Episcopalian
Benjamin Rush,Presbyterian
Button Gwinnett,Episcopalian
Caesar Rodney,Presbyterian (with Deist leanings)
Carter Braxton,Episcopalian
Charles Carroll,Roman Catholic
Edward Rutledge,Episcopalian
Elbridge Gerry,Episcopalian
Francis Hopkinson,Episcopalian
Francis Lee,Episcopalian
Francis Lewis,Episcopalian
Francis Lightfoot Lee,Episcopalian
George Clymer,Episcopalian (Quaker influences)
George Read,Episcopalian
George Ross,Episcopalian
George Taylor,Episcopalian (raised Presbyterian)
George Walton,Episcopalian
James Smith,Presbyterian
James Wilson,Presbyterian (Deist leanings)
John Adams,Unitarian (Congregationalist)
John Hancock,Episcopalian
John Hart,Presbyterian
John Morton,Episcopalian (raised Lutheran/Pietist)
John Penn,Episcopalian
John Witherspoon,Presbyterian
Joseph Hewes,Episcopalian (raised Quaker)
Josiah Bartlett,Congregationalist (Unitarian leanings)
Lewis Morris,Episcopalian
Lyman Hall,Congregationalist
Matthew Thornton,Presbyterian
Philip Livingston,Presbyterian
Richard Henry Lee,Episcopalian
Richard Stockton,Presbyterian
Robert Morris,Episcopalian (Deist leanings)
Roger Sherman,Congregationalist
Samuel Adams,Congregationalist
Samuel Chase,Episcopalian
Samuel Huntington,Presbyterian
Stephen Hopkins,Baptist (with Quaker influences)
Thomas Heyward Jr.,Episcopalian
Thomas Jefferson,Deist (raised Episcopalian)
Thomas Lynch Jr.,Episcopalian
Thomas McKean,Presbyterian
Thomas Nelson Jr.,Episcopalian
Thomas Stone,Episcopalian
William Ellery,Congregationalist
William Floyd,Episcopalian
William Hooper,Presbyterian
William Paca,Episcopalian
William Whipple,Congregationalist
William Williams,Congregationalist
Posted on 8/23/25 at 6:56 pm to Eurocat
quote:
It was founded as more of a "Deist" nation, not a Christian nation. Read the letters of the founders to one another or to their spouses, children, friends. Read newspapers from the time. God comes up with almost annoying frequency. Jesus Christ is almost never mentioned. That's why things say IN GOD WE TRUST instead of In Jesus we trust or "Jesus Saves".
While Deism influenced Jefferson and Franklin, any attempt to characterize the founding of the nation as anything other than overtly Christian is objectively false.
You couldn’t even hold a play in Revolutionary era Boston because it was seen as unChristian.
The entire PA colony at that time on the eastern seaboard was a stronghold for the Quaker sect.
The only notable exceptions were Jefferson and Franklin who were heavily influenced by the enlightenment and leaned into the deistic views you alluded to, but they were without doubt or question the exception rather than the rule.
“Roughly, of the 56 signers of the Declaration, about half were affiliated with Anglican or Congregationalist churches, with smaller numbers of Presbyterians, Quakers, and others.”
Posted on 8/23/25 at 7:16 pm to tide06
quote:
The only notable exceptions were Jefferson and Franklin who were heavily influenced by the enlightenment and leaned into the deistic views you alluded to
They aren’t the only exception. See James Madison and his essay Memorial and Remonstrance. There are several more who took the idea that of religious liberty being a natural right, which again has its origins in the Enlightenment. In other words, even those founders who were practicing Christians were influenced by Enlightenment ideas about freedom of religion.
Posted on 8/23/25 at 7:33 pm to GumboPot
Separation of church and state
Posted on 8/23/25 at 7:47 pm to crazy4lsu
quote:
They aren’t the only exception. See James Madison and his essay Memorial and Remonstrance. There are several more who took the idea that of religious liberty being a natural right, which again has its origins in the Enlightenment. In other words, even those founders who were practicing Christians were influenced by Enlightenment ideas about freedom of religion.
I agree fully that many if not all of the signers were at a minimum aware if not heavily influenced enlightenment ideals.
We’re also in agreement that those ideals are what changed our path from what otherwise would’ve likely been some shade of a Christian theocracy in which the church would’ve been formally enshrined as the official religion of the new nation as some particularly in New England would’ve likely preferred.
What I do take issue with is the inference that the founders weren’t heavily Christian. The facts are absolutely clear on that point.
If you want to argue to what degree dome were attending church weekly that’s fine, but I would point out that running a revolution during war time doesn’t really lend itself to attending services when half the time they were fleeing from city to city worried about what their families were facing at home and living hundreds or thousands of miles from local church.
Posted on 8/23/25 at 7:50 pm to Eurocat
quote:
That's why things say IN GOD WE TRUST instead of In Jesus we trust or "Jesus Saves".
Well you're obviously not a Time Traveler from 18th Century America and what was a given.
When you order Sushi do you have to specify that you don't want the Tuna cooked?
Or will the Sushi Chefs understand inherently?
Posted on 8/23/25 at 7:57 pm to GumboPot
I have always wondered how Judeo got added in with Christian.
Hannity is a dunce.
Hannity is a dunce.
Posted on 8/23/25 at 7:58 pm to GumboPot
Wait, I don’t see a tiny hat person on that list.
Oh yeah, they were too busy importing slaves.
Oh yeah, they were too busy importing slaves.
This post was edited on 8/23/25 at 8:19 pm
Posted on 8/23/25 at 8:00 pm to Knight of Old
quote:
TheTalmud is more akin to an anthology of essays by Jewish scholars - not sacred text. Dude, you want to know who hates you, read the Koran…
They both hate you, but at least the Koran recognizes Jesus as a prophet. That said, Both doctrines are trash incompatible with western civilization and both need to go.
Posted on 8/23/25 at 8:01 pm to tide06
quote:
What I do take issue with is the inference that the founders weren’t heavily Christian.
Oh, shite, I misread your post. I thought you were saying that those founders were the only ones who were influenced by the Enlightenment, not that the majority of the founders were not Christian. Mea culpa.
In terms of early American history, the foreword of one edition of Memorial and Remonstrance suggested that there was declining religious participation in 1780’s Virginia. There were several petitions opposing the General Assessment bill (which I believe would have given taxpayer money to religious teachers), some petitions opposed the bill because they felt that it would do nothing to limit the influence of Deism on government. I believe it might have been the most popular, which suggests that Deists were fairly prominent, especially in Virginia government.
Posted on 8/23/25 at 8:02 pm to GumboPot
If there was any doubt that the US was founded as a Christian nation, I'll just leave a link to some of the founding father's quotes. I'll also leave a link to what the community did to a famous atheist pushing that agenda.
LINK
This is what they thought of atheism in this country.
The Founding Fathers on Jesus, Christianity and the Bible
quote:
Samuel Adams Father of the American Revolution, Signer of the Declaration of Independence I . . . recommend my Soul to that Almighty Being who gave it, and my body I commit to the dust, relying upon the merits of Jesus Christ for a pardon of all my sins. (Will of Samuel Adams)
quote:
William Cushing First Associate Justice Appointed by George Washington to the Supreme Court Sensible of my mortality, but being of sound mind, after recommending my soul to Almighty God through the merits of my Redeemer and my body to the earth. (Will of William Cushing)
quote:
John Hancock Signer of the Declaration of Independence I John Hancock, . . . being advanced in years and being of perfect mind and memory-thanks be given to God-therefore calling to mind the mortality of my body and knowing it is appointed for all men once to die [Hebrews 9:27], do make and ordain this my last will and testament…Principally and first of all, I give and recommend my soul into the hands of God that gave it: and my body I recommend to the earth . . . nothing doubting but at the general resurrection I shall receive the same again by the mercy and power of God. (Will of John Hancock)
quote:
Daniel St. Thomas Jenifer Signer of the Constitution In the name of God, Amen. I, Daniel of Saint Thomas Jenifer . . . of dispossing mind and memory, commend my soul to my blessed Redeemer. . . (Will of Daniel St. Thomas Jenifer)
LINK
This is what they thought of atheism in this country.
quote:
Paine later published his Age of Reason, which infuriated many of the Founding Fathers. John Adams wrote, “The Christian religion is, above all the religions that ever prevailed or existed in ancient or modern times, the religion of wisdom, virtue, equity and humanity, let the Blackguard [scoundrel, rogue] Paine say what he will.”2 Samuel Adams wrote Paine a stiff rebuke, telling him, “[W]hen I heard you had turned your mind to a defence of infidelity, I felt myself much astonished and more grieved that you had attempted a measure so injurious to the feelings and so repugnant to the true interest of so great a part of the citizens of the United States.”3
quote:
In fact, Paine’s views caused such vehement public opposition that he spent his last years in New York as “an outcast” in “social ostracism” and was buried in a farm field because no American cemetery would accept his remains
The Founding Fathers on Jesus, Christianity and the Bible
quote:
LINK
Posted on 8/23/25 at 8:03 pm to GumboPot
quote:
Paul would cast down the teaching of the Talmud and Koran today
He’d also take issues with the doctrine and practice with just about every Christian denomination and non-denominational church in America today.
And yay. Yet another thread where people can wear their doctrine on their sleeve and argue about it.
This post was edited on 8/23/25 at 8:07 pm
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