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Started By
Message
re: Texas AG Paxton sues Catholic charity for aiding and encouraging illegal immigration
Posted on 2/21/24 at 9:22 am to reddy tiger
Posted on 2/21/24 at 9:22 am to reddy tiger
quote:
Purported Christians supporting the punishing of a Christian church for following Christ’s example as it pertains to fellow Christians and refugees.
bullshite. Jesus never advocated for people to flaunt and flat out break the law. In fact he was very explicit about the subject.
quote:
Romans 13:1-2 says: "Obey the government, for God is the One who has put it there. There is no government anywhere that God has not placed in power. So those who refuse to obey the law of the land are refusing to obey God, and punishment will follow."
There are many unjust laws on the books but when society decides as a whole to ignore the law, chaos is sure to follow. You only need to look at many of our big cities where state and local governments have decided certain criminal activity isn’t that big of a deal and turns a blind eye to it. What constitutes “theft” in certain places now has led to businesses fleeing because of the criminal activity it invited. Removing basic standards for public drug use, and public urination and defecation has turned cities like LA, San Fran and Portland into complete hellholes of massive homeless populations where open drug use, and shitting and pissing on the sidewalk is the norm. Willfully ignoring our immigration laws and flaunting them by invoking the name of Jesus has created a humanitarian crisis stretching multiple continents.
I absolutely reject this idea that willfully breaking the law is following Christ’s example.
0
Posted on 2/21/24 at 10:13 am to reddy tiger
quote:
Every study ever conducted says that illegal immigrants commit crime at rates lower than native citizens and that immigration (both legal and illegal) is great for our economy.
Well that's blatantly false. Here's one study that shows the exact opposite.
Misuse of Texas Data Understates Illegal Immigrant Criminality
This study shows how all of the other studies that I assume* you are referencing use incorrect data interpretation to reach their conclusions.
*Assumed because you didn't cite anything.
quote:
These studies do not appreciate that it can take years for Texas to identify convicts as illegal immigrants while they are in custody. As a result, the studies misclassify as native-born a significant number of offenders who are later identified as illegal immigrants.
At any given time, each arrestee or convict falls into one of four categories in the DPS data:
- Legal immigrants identified by DHS upon intake/arrest;
- Illegal immigrants identified by DHS upon intake/arrest;
- Illegal immigrants identified by DCJ in prison; and
- Other/unknown (including both the native-born and yet-to-be-identified immigrants).
Oh look at that - if you group the "unknowns" with the native-born population, that group ends up being the largest. Shocker!
Once you correct for that misinterpreted data:
quote:
Illegal immigrants in Texas appear to be convicted of crimes such as homicide, sexual assault , and kidnapping at higher rates than the state average. By contrast, they appear to be convicted at lower rates for crimes such as robbery and drugs.
Posted on 2/21/24 at 10:30 am to EKG
Catholic Charities is a straight up leftist, activist political org. Nothing Christian about it
Posted on 2/21/24 at 10:31 am to EKG
So it's okay to ignore and even punish sincerely held religious beliefs if they prove inconvenient for the Government?
Posted on 2/21/24 at 10:40 am to tokenBoiler
quote:
So it's okay to ignore and even punish sincerely held religious beliefs if they prove *inconvenient for the Government?
You misspelled “illegal.”
Posted on 2/21/24 at 10:44 am to EKG
About time. now go get HIAS.
“ HIAS is the world's oldest refugee agency, formally established as the Hebrew Immigrant Aid Society in 1902. While originally set up by Jews to help fellow Jews for reasons of religious imperative and communal solidarity, HIAS in the 2020s is a multi-continent, multi-pronged humanitarian aid and advocacy organization.”
“ HIAS is the world's oldest refugee agency, formally established as the Hebrew Immigrant Aid Society in 1902. While originally set up by Jews to help fellow Jews for reasons of religious imperative and communal solidarity, HIAS in the 2020s is a multi-continent, multi-pronged humanitarian aid and advocacy organization.”
Posted on 2/21/24 at 10:45 am to EKG
quote:
I knew this would be brought up, and it’s a fair point.
There’s little need to point out the irony of secularists and liberals who fail to consult the Bible in every other area of life, suddenly attempting to use God’s word to justify illegal immigration; the absurdity speaks for itself.
as a Christian, i'm always trying to make sure i understand the scripture and what it said in context on these.
i'll never be down with "build the wall" and "you've got to go back" but also, it's very obvious that these aren't refugees leaving wartorn lands. and there is a lot about welcoming them in, but also that there is much more about having to work and bear fruit in the new testament than there is about welcoming immigrants.
there's nothing about coming into a country and expecting luxury hotels, food, travel, accomodations from the government on a non-believer's dime.
reminds me of:
Posted on 2/21/24 at 10:46 am to scottydoesntknow
quote:except for all the adoptions they do and social services they provide
Catholic Charities is a straight up leftist, activist political org. Nothing Christian about it
What does Annunciation House have to do with Catholic Charities?
This post was edited on 2/21/24 at 10:48 am
Posted on 2/21/24 at 11:08 am to EKG
I generally against government suing religous organizations. In this case, Paxton should be going after those that are funding the NGOs, not the NGOs themselves.
Posted on 2/21/24 at 11:09 am to GreenRockTiger
quote:
What does Annunciation House have to do with Catholic Charities?
Annunciation House is associated with the Catholic Churh, but i don't know that it is with Catholic Charities in this instance. There's propbably some conflation.
Obviously CC does a lot of good, much like other organizations that i disagree with on some political ends.
Where i think CC is losing the plot here is that they say, "yes, we'll get you in, give you services and then get you settled." Those are not bad things.
Where it goes awry is when they coach them how to break the law and get around proper immigration rules set up by their government and then set up the immigrants to be supported by the tax payer dime afterwards.
if they were building a giant utopia complex to help everybody on their own dime while bringing in people that were true refugees (political assylum or from wartorn countries) then sure. but it's very obvious this is done to avoid redtape or propper vetting.
i'm a Christian and much more open borders than most on the right but you can't have a welfare state and open borders. from a pure math perspective, you can't import more takers forever.
i drive on roads that I, my parents, and my grandparents have paid for and my kids go to schools that my family lineage has paid for for as well. I'm not going to pretend like I want roads or school denied to anybody or that I am more deserving, but the current concept of bringing in unsustainable population to get services where there's no previous pay in is going to break something.
This post was edited on 2/21/24 at 11:16 am
Posted on 2/21/24 at 11:17 am to 3nOut
quote:there is
There's propbably some conflation.
quote:this is not being done by the church - this is being done by the Annunciation house - there are many Catholic entities that do the right thing
Where it goes awry is when they coach them how to break the law and get around proper immigration rules set up by their government and then set up the immigrants to be supported by the tax payer dime afterwards.
quote:in Louisiana an illegal alien cannot get Medicaid/Food stamps, resident aliens have to be in the state 5 years before getting state aid, any children born here are citizens and entitled
the current concept of bringing in unsustainable population to get services where there's no previous pay in is going to break something
This post was edited on 2/21/24 at 11:21 am
Posted on 2/21/24 at 11:26 am to GreenRockTiger
quote:
in Louisiana an illegal alien cannot get Medicaid/Food stamps, resident aliens have to be in the state 5 years before getting state aid, any children born here are citizens and entitled
that's in Louisiana. You can't wave away the stories in NYC or Boston where hotels, schools, and rec centers that are shut down to citizens to host migrants. Or flights for that matter. My government has never paid for me to fly anywhere ever.
If a Catholic organization is footing ALL of that, then it's on them and I accept that. I just don't know any Catholics that are willing to put untold millions into flying entire caravans inland.
If I'm wrong, I'm wrong.
Posted on 2/21/24 at 11:36 am to Lightning
quote:
Every study ever conducted says that illegal immigrants commit crime at rates lower than native citizens and that immigration (both legal and illegal) is great for our economy.
Well that's blatantly false. Here's one study that shows the exact opposite.
Misuse of Texas Data Understates Illegal Immigrant Criminality
This study shows how all of the other studies that I assume* you are referencing use incorrect data interpretation to reach their conclusions.
*Assumed because you didn't cite anything.
quote:
These studies do not appreciate that it can take years for Texas to identify convicts as illegal immigrants while they are in custody. As a result, the studies misclassify as native-born a significant number of offenders who are later identified as illegal immigrants.
At any given time, each arrestee or convict falls into one of four categories in the DPS data:
- Legal immigrants identified by DHS upon intake/arrest;
- Illegal immigrants identified by DHS upon intake/arrest;
- Illegal immigrants identified by DCJ in prison; and
- Other/unknown (including both the native-born and yet-to-be-identified immigrants).
Oh look at that - if you group the "unknowns" with the native-born population, that group ends up being the largest. Shocker!
Once you correct for that misinterpreted data:
quote:
Illegal immigrants in Texas appear to be convicted of crimes such as homicide, sexual assault , and kidnapping at higher rates than the state average. By contrast, they appear to be convicted at lower rates for crimes such as robbery and drugs.
Thank you!
Posted on 2/21/24 at 11:39 am to 3nOut
quote:Texas’ rules are similar. Illegals can go to New York or California and qualify for anything
that's in Louisiana.
quote:I don’t know any organizations that are doing that. I do know that catholic organizations have always helped the illegals once they get here.
I just don't know any Catholics that are willing to put untold millions into flying entire caravans inland.
Posted on 2/21/24 at 11:46 am to GreenRockTiger
so are you just arguing the semantics of Catholic charities (little C) and TX/LA vs CA/NY law?
my point is that it's an unsustainable model moving forward regardless of who's doing what where from a pure economic standpoint.
my point is that it's an unsustainable model moving forward regardless of who's doing what where from a pure economic standpoint.
This post was edited on 2/21/24 at 11:48 am
Posted on 2/21/24 at 11:58 am to EKG
Good.
Now do the Red Cross.
Now do the Red Cross.
Posted on 2/21/24 at 12:03 pm to 3nOut
No, not really arguing. Its disappointing that the Catholics get sued first when there are plenty of other religious organizations doing the same. I’d like to see the proof that they are ‘encouraging’ illegal immigration.
However, this is not sustainable. It hasn’t been for 40 years. Texas and the rest of the border states should be allowed to defend their land.
However, this is not sustainable. It hasn’t been for 40 years. Texas and the rest of the border states should be allowed to defend their land.
Posted on 2/21/24 at 12:10 pm to GreenRockTiger
quote:
quote:Catholic Charities is a straight up leftist, activist political org. Nothing Christian about itexcept for all the adoptions they do and social services they provide
There is plenty of need for this. There is zero reason to be involved in immigration. Its run by leftist activists(which id bet a pretty penny you support)
Posted on 2/21/24 at 12:28 pm to scottydoesntknow
quote:Catholic charities has immigration lawyers on staff - they help people from all nations apply and get residency and eventually citizenship
There is zero reason to be involved in immigration.
quote:
Its run by leftist activists(which id bet a pretty penny you support)
I work with Catholic charities - not sure if that’s supporting or not Posted on 2/21/24 at 12:39 pm to GreenRockTiger
quote:
No, not really arguing. Its disappointing that the Catholics get sued first
gotcha. just wanted to make sure we weren't talking past each other.
quote:
’d like to see the proof that they are ‘encouraging’ illegal immigration.
if it's known that you'll help give them a place to stay, feed you, coach you, and provide legal services.
Those last two go above and beyond what i think our Biblical responsibilities are and wade into harming your fellow countrymen
quote:
when there are plenty of other religious organizations doing the same
i've shared this before, but i do a lot of work in the RGV in Texas. one time i was in brownsville and I finished up before i could go check into my hotel so i went to an adjoining Starbucks. In the parking lot was a bunch of Impeach Trump, Pro Choice Christian, Notorious RBG, I'm with Her, rainbow, etc. bumper stickers.
The valley votes democrats, but not those type of democrats. Went inside and it was a who's who of reeing white they/thems.
got my coffee (black, because i'm not a bitch) did some work and went to the hotel. Same bumper stickers.
Lobby is full of very obviously leftist people. I find the sign that it's the "River Conference" for FUMC Austin. After gym, i went and had a beer in the lobby to sightsee the group. I heard a table next to me talk about how to legally get people across (illegally) and then what to coach them to say to avoid deportation.
They're basically doing what squatters and first amendment auditors do. Using the system to get what they want in a legal but very shady way.
This post was edited on 2/21/24 at 12:40 pm
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