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Started By
Message
re: Teacher Pay Raises
Posted on 10/28/19 at 11:13 am to cahoots
Posted on 10/28/19 at 11:13 am to cahoots
quote:Um, yes they do.
When I say, pay them more, I mean that generally. I don't support paying every teacher the same amount, but nowhere does that now anyway.
quote:And regardless of field, it applies.
Most areas have scales based on experience and education level.
An Art teacher with a masters gets paid the same thing an English teacher with a masters does. Hell, an art teacher with a masters gets paid MORE than a 4 year degreed English teacher...........which is just comically dumb.
quote:I hate to break it to you, but, the problem STILL goes to my point.
The problem is that the education level of the scale is minor. You get a few more bucks. Not enough to attract better teachers.
Hell, the reality is, SOME teachers are OVER paid. I'm a musician but, your typical band teacher couldn't replace their income if they quit. Not even close.
quote:Why not? Why is this a "perfect world". We DO live in that world. It's ALL AROUND US. The teacher's unions and you lefties simply refuse to acknowledge it.
We don't live in a perfect world where you can pay a HS physics teacher $80k and an elementary teacher $30k.
1
Posted on 10/28/19 at 11:14 am to cahoots
quote:
We don't live in a perfect world where you can pay a HS physics teacher $80k and an elementary teacher $30k.
To add. Yeah. We live EXACTLY in that world.
It's why openings for 4th grade art teacher get lines around the building. Meanwhile, the potentially good physics teacher IS getting paid $80..........he just ain't teaching.
Posted on 10/28/19 at 11:15 am to ShortyRob
(no message)
This post was edited on 1/24/20 at 12:52 pm
Posted on 10/28/19 at 11:15 am to BigJim
quote:
3. Let principals decide. And in turn, make sure the principals get paid on how well the school does.
I always thought principals should be given a budget for teacher pay. They are already making the hiring decisions. Let them make the pay decisions as well.
Maybe one wants to focus more money into certain areas, and less money into others. Maybe they want to hire a teacher away from another school, so they offer more money to lure them.
All the things the private sector does, especially for professionals.
Professionals don't need unions. They need to be treated as professionals.
Posted on 10/28/19 at 11:15 am to cahoots
Sure there are bad teachers, just like any other profession.
But anyone who says most teachers are overpaid doesn't know anything about teaching. At any level, one of the toughest, most underappreciated jobs out there.
But anyone who says most teachers are overpaid doesn't know anything about teaching. At any level, one of the toughest, most underappreciated jobs out there.
Posted on 10/28/19 at 11:16 am to SlidellCajun
quote:
based on merit.
Define merit. What we currently have with school "performance scores" is absolute horseshite. It is based on a terribly flawed equation. I would love a merit based system, but it would have to make sense.
Posted on 10/28/19 at 11:19 am to cahoots
quote:LOL
Because I'm a realist, not an idealist.
It is literally REAL that in the REAL world, the Phsyics teacher commands more pay. So, if you don't pay him more, he will STILL make it.......just not in your school.
Idealism is thinking that isn't the case.
quote:
Yes, some teachers wind up with more money than they should, but at least kids get good teachers in critical subjects too. It's better than the alternative of paying everyone like they're art teachers.
That's not the only alternative. I already told you what the alternative is.
Pay them the same way EVERYfrickINGBODY ELSE pays their employees. Based on how much it takes to get the talent level you need.
If you run a company and your accountants are great, but your marketing team sucks because you can't get any decent ones, you don't increase pay for BOTH the accountants and the marketing team.
Posted on 10/28/19 at 11:19 am to dixiechick
(no message)
This post was edited on 1/24/20 at 12:52 pm
Posted on 10/28/19 at 11:20 am to doubleb
quote:
here is no reason EBR couldn’t review every teacher ever year. The bureaucracy and politics in the parish won’t let it happen though.
My wife teaches in an A / B school (always kinda sits right on that border, some years they are an A, some years they are a B).
Her professional evaluation is a joke.
2x per year, once in the fall and once in the spring, she is told by the AP that is doing it (one AP does all of the evals, over 100 teachers). that the AP will observe her next Wed, 3rd period, or whatever.
Observation occurs.
About 3-4 weeks later, she is called down during her planning period to "chat". She (along with other teachers in the same room, who also recently had their observation) is given a piece of paper with a few remarks on it, asked to sign it, and told if she has any questions to set a meeting with the AP for a later date.
She gets "highly qualified" which entitles her to merit pay (I think it's like $500/yr). Which is cool and she deserves it... but like 99 percent of the teachers are "highly qualified" which makes me wonder what exactly the bar is.
Posted on 10/28/19 at 11:20 am to LSUFanHouston
LSUFanHouston
An actual solution that is measurable and parent friendly!
This is actually the second reason for homework. More practice for learning is first, and feedback for teacher, parent, and student is a highly valuable second.
An actual solution that is measurable and parent friendly!
This is actually the second reason for homework. More practice for learning is first, and feedback for teacher, parent, and student is a highly valuable second.
Posted on 10/28/19 at 11:21 am to cahoots
quote:
To those who support test-based merit pay increases
I already said, I support giving talented teachers raises.
Alas, most "merit" systems are just more centralized bureaucratic bull shite because liberals, unions and governments frickING HATE letting the people who actually SEE the work being done decide.
Posted on 10/28/19 at 11:21 am to ShortyRob
(no message)
This post was edited on 1/24/20 at 12:52 pm
Posted on 10/28/19 at 11:22 am to cahoots
quote:
To those who support test-based merit pay increases - why do you think this is suddenly going to work when it has repeatedly failed in the past?
Because, as I posted above, we now have the data needed to drive such a system. That wasn't the case in the past.
Any time you hear "merit", think "value-added". That's the ONLY way it can work.
Posted on 10/28/19 at 11:23 am to LSUFanHouston
quote:You just described every bureaucratic centralized evaluation system alive.
She gets "highly qualified" which entitles her to merit pay (I think it's like $500/yr). Which is cool and she deserves it... but like 99 percent of the teachers are "highly qualified" which makes me wonder what exactly the bar is.
Workers break down into basically two groups.
Superstars
Complete catastrophes.
Basically, short of doing something unforgivable, you're a superstar
Posted on 10/28/19 at 11:24 am to Gaspergou202
quote:
This is actually the second reason for homework. More practice for learning is first, and feedback for teacher, parent, and student is a highly valuable second.
Correct. Homework is needed to reinforce what is learned during the day, and to allow somewhat real-time, individualized feedback for, as you said, parent, teacher, student.
It should be no more than necessary to achieve that, and should never be used to "teach". A student should never have a homework problem that they haven't seen the concept in a prior lesson.
Posted on 10/28/19 at 11:24 am to cahoots
quote:Well then, there is NO alternative.
I know what your alternative is. Your alternative would never happen, even in a rich Republican area with good public schools.
quote:Which is why schools will continue as they are
it is idealistic because it completely ignores politics. It has a 0% chance of happening.
Because economics works.............ALWAYS. The desire of the left and teacher's unions doesn't change this. And, until you decide to operate in accordance with economic principles, you're pissing up a rope.
Posted on 10/28/19 at 11:24 am to tigerfan0082
quote:
strategies of best practices for teaching,
Big misnomer.
The "strategies" today are to let the kids basically teach themselves and have the teacher facilitate.
These "strategies" are a big reason why our kids don't know the basics and why our education system is getting worse instead of better.
You want a good education system?
Instill discipline.
Go back to fundamentals and don't move on until they are mastered.
Have alternative schools for those who disrupt learning and put them to work as part of their studies. (litter pickup, cleaning public buildings, etc)
Don't count dropouts against school performance scores.
Put as much emphasis on the top 10% as you do the bottom 10%.
You'll have people lining up to be teachers if they don't have to put up with the BS they have to from administrations, kids, parents, and the Department of Education.
Posted on 10/28/19 at 11:24 am to LSUFanHouston
(no message)
This post was edited on 1/24/20 at 12:52 pm
Posted on 10/28/19 at 11:25 am to ShortyRob
quote:
ou just described every bureaucratic centralized evaluation system alive.
Don't disagree. Lot of big companies / govt agencies have eval systems that are totally a joke.
Posted on 10/28/19 at 11:27 am to ShortyRob
(no message)
This post was edited on 1/24/20 at 12:52 pm
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