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re: So what is the point of the Covid vaccine?
Posted on 4/7/21 at 11:05 am to drdoct
Posted on 4/7/21 at 11:05 am to drdoct
quote:
The problem with this big 95% claim is that they have no idea of the people tested would have had any issues whatsoever.
This is why there is something called randomized double-blind placebo controlled trials. They are the gold standard in medical science.
In these trials they took 40,000 people and randomized them into two groups: placebo and vaccine. Neither group knew whether they were in placebo or vaccine group (and neither did the pharma company).
They gave the placebo people a saline shot and the vaccine people the real shot. They then told them to go on with their daily lives. At the end of the trial they found something like 160 had COVID in the placebo group while only 8 in the vaccine group did. This is statistically significant with a high confidence interval. Not only that, but the 8 who got COVID in the vaccine group were not severe cases. All were mild. In the placebo group people died. I think this is a pretty convincing trial.
Now you may say "how do we know there wasn't some sort of behavioral bias in the two groups? What if the vaccine group was not exposed to COVID as much?" Well the answer to that is randomization and sample size. When you have a large enough sample size (and picked at random) these biases go away.
Is it perfect? No. The best way to do this would be a "challenge trial", but those are largely illegal. This is where you vaccinate half and give placebo to half. Then you infect both groups on purpose with the live virus. These are highly unethical because there's a good chance someone will die in your trial from the virus. China might do them, but I doubt America ever will.
1
Posted on 4/7/21 at 11:07 am to Seldom Seen
quote:
So what is the point of the Covid vaccine?
Mass vaccination is the only practical way to reach herd immunity.
Posted on 4/7/21 at 11:57 am to Seldom Seen
There was an interesting story about how the government of England tried to give televisions to every home. The lad telling the story said before that people would go to their local pubs and/or coffee shop (have to remember these type of things were more local to the neighborhood there than we have setup here with zoning laws at the time) and they would talk about the going ons of news, community, etc. After the tvs came people didn't communicate anymore, they just stayed home to watch their shows. I imagine the covid stuff isolates people quite a lot so that they don't communicate or organize as freely.
Posted on 4/7/21 at 9:26 pm to WeeWee
Fauci has an M.D. behind his name also.
I will just agree to disagree with both of you.
I will just agree to disagree with both of you.
Posted on 4/7/21 at 9:41 pm to Seldom Seen
quote:
So what is the point of the Covid vaccine?
Posted on 4/7/21 at 9:50 pm to TBoy
quote:
Mass vaccination is the only practical way to reach herd immunity.
Sweden says you don't know what the frick you talking about. The only country that gave the C19 scare the middle finger and reach herd immunity many months ago
No lock downs, no mask mandates.
Posted on 4/8/21 at 9:00 am to AUstar
quote:so far. And is that percentage better than your odds of surviving the virus? Maybe for seniors with comorbidities but not for everyone else
The Moderna and Pfizer vaccines showed 95% efficacy in trials.
quote:not from what I've read, according to what's been published regarding virus morbidity vs vaers
it does give a very statistically significant better chance of survival
quote:I would be interested to know how they can say that with any certainty.
they also showed that it was almost 90% effective at stopping spread
quote:this is a ridiculous statement. The vaccines have had a typically bumpy road in being produced. There have been several, serious problems for vaccinated people. More than enough to warrant serious skepticism about the vaccine
It's going to come to a point where the vaccinated just go on with their lives and the non-vaccinated continue to get it and die
quote:who made them rulers of our daily lives? We've grievously injured American livelihoods implementing a response nowhere near the threat. The cdc has constantly changed their recommendations. Their recommendations have been at times downright silly. Fauci's ties to big pharma have been exposed. Doctors who dissented were shouted down or ignored. What we've allowed these people to do is just insane.
At some point CDC is going to have to just decide that a certain percentage of non-vaccinated people getting the disease is acceptable
Posted on 4/8/21 at 9:03 am to CelticDog
quote:neither of those are known with any certainty.
symptoms are greatly reduced.
few hospitalizations
quote:? Have you checked vaers? The number of people who died from anaphylaxis alone after being vaccinated is cause for serious concern. Nevermind any other issues that have occurred.
no deaths
quote:you might want to brush up on the facts before you say something else stupid
how did you manage to not know this?
Posted on 4/8/21 at 9:10 am to WeeWee
quote:this is blatantly not true. There have been serious complications with this vaccine. Enough to avoid it.
Plus a subject population of 63,000,000 Americans that proves it is safe
quote:says who?
The best way to counter that unidentified genetic component is to get the vaccine
quote:does that include all of the asymptomatic cases? No
~29,450,000 Americans have recovered from laboratory confirmed covid
quote:naive.
achieve herd immunity which will shut Fauci and his fear mongering disciples up
Posted on 4/8/21 at 9:12 am to OMLandshark
quote:
Joe said fricking twice today that if we’re lucky we’ll be able to hang out in our backyard with like 8 people on the 4th of July. How is no one else not more pissed off about this?
He can say whatever the frick he wants, not going to stop me from doing the usual on 4th of July
Posted on 4/8/21 at 9:15 am to AUstar
quote:if it weren't for an unknown, possibly astronomical number of asymptomatic cases, maybe. And that's real life, not a trial
In the placebo group people died. I think this is a pretty convincing trial
Posted on 4/8/21 at 9:15 am to TBoy
quote:has there ever been a topic you weren't wrong about? I mean, ever.
Mass vaccination is the only practical way to reach herd immunity
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