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re: So to all the posters who were on the "Trump committed fraud to get his loans" crowd
Posted on 12/1/23 at 12:30 pm to Ex-Popcorn
Posted on 12/1/23 at 12:30 pm to Ex-Popcorn
quote:
In every example you have tried to present, there is a victim. That's implicit in the word "fraud"...meaning, you created a victim through deceptive means.
He thinks he can be a victim on someone else’s behalf, even though that someone else has stated they aren’t a victim.
2
Posted on 12/1/23 at 12:43 pm to thebigmuffaletta
quote:Can you point out where in Section 63(12) does it require the government to prove that financial losses were incurred or that someone must be declared “a victim”?
He thinks he can be a victim on someone else’s behalf, even though that someone else has stated they aren’t a victim.
This post was edited on 12/1/23 at 12:44 pm
Posted on 12/1/23 at 12:43 pm to thebigmuffaletta
That's what I don't understand. If the person who the judge is alleging was defrauded testified that they weren't in fact defrauded, then what exactly is the point of contention?
Posted on 12/1/23 at 1:46 pm to RoosterCogburn585
What they are charging Trump with is not Fraud. New York has specific fraud laws and Trump didn’t commit fraud.
This is an example of an intrusive unnecessary law about inflating values. It makes no sense because a thing’s value is only that which an actual buyer is willing to pay.
In real estate offers are made above and below the seller’s price. Often drastically different. Does that make the sellers criminals. Items are auctioned at ridiculous prices compared to what I think they are worth. That some one would pay that much for Dorothy’s shoes is their business.
Murders can destroy a home’s value while a famous connection can bring value. Fixer upper homes in Waco are a prime example.
If hundreds of these cases were being prosecuted in NY, ok. These were highly successful international bankers not little old ladies. This is selected prosecution biased on a law that is wasting space in a law library.
I wonder how much longer it took to dust this one off compared to the Logan act.
This is an example of an intrusive unnecessary law about inflating values. It makes no sense because a thing’s value is only that which an actual buyer is willing to pay.
In real estate offers are made above and below the seller’s price. Often drastically different. Does that make the sellers criminals. Items are auctioned at ridiculous prices compared to what I think they are worth. That some one would pay that much for Dorothy’s shoes is their business.
Murders can destroy a home’s value while a famous connection can bring value. Fixer upper homes in Waco are a prime example.
If hundreds of these cases were being prosecuted in NY, ok. These were highly successful international bankers not little old ladies. This is selected prosecution biased on a law that is wasting space in a law library.
I wonder how much longer it took to dust this one off compared to the Logan act.
Posted on 12/1/23 at 1:57 pm to RoosterCogburn585
He stiffed Deutche Bank ....twice
They are not that smart
He had loans everywhere ---maybe no fraud with theirs
Just a uniquely bad business record says
Tucker Carlson
They are not that smart
He had loans everywhere ---maybe no fraud with theirs
Just a uniquely bad business record says
Tucker Carlson
Posted on 12/1/23 at 1:58 pm to Tmcgin
quote:
He stiffed Deutche Bank ....twice
Link? Not holding my breathe on a response.
This post was edited on 12/1/23 at 2:00 pm
Posted on 12/1/23 at 2:00 pm to TigerIn2023
quote:
Can you point out where in Section 63(12) does it require the government to prove that financial losses were incurred or that someone must be declared “a victim”?
How can you be this dumb? Fraud, by definition, requires there be a victim of fraud.
There is NO victim here, hence, there is no fraud.
Posted on 12/1/23 at 2:00 pm to BBONDS25
Why are they shitting on and tearing down our Republican candidate!? It’s an outrage and unforgivable!!
Posted on 12/1/23 at 2:07 pm to TigerIn2023
quote:
Can you point out where in Section 63(12) does it require the government to prove that financial losses were incurred or that someone must be declared “a victim”?
Can you produce the valuation that proves the values supplied by trump were fraudulent?
Posted on 12/1/23 at 2:11 pm to BBONDS25
quote:
Can you produce the valuation that proves the values supplied by trump were fraudulent?
No, he can’t. He’ll just continue to stamp his feet and say fraud isn’t necessary.
Posted on 12/1/23 at 2:13 pm to RoosterCogburn585
Liberals don’t like capitalism and certainly don’t understand it so anything that makes money is considered illegal in their mind
Posted on 12/1/23 at 2:24 pm to BBONDS25
quote:Mar-a-Lago, the Trump Organization's private club in Florida, was valued at over $600 million, despite being assessed by the Palm Beach County tax assessor at only $27.6 million. Trump Tower's triplex apartment, where Donald Trump lived, was claimed to be over 32,000 square feet, when in reality it was only 11,000 square feet.
Can you produce the valuation that proves the values supplied by trump were fraudulent?
This post was edited on 12/1/23 at 2:25 pm
Posted on 12/1/23 at 2:38 pm to TigerIn2023
Wrong. Trump’s financials gave a valuation range between $425 and $600 million for MAL specifically, so the exaggeration you employ here doesn’t work out. Additionally, Forbes estimated the value in the neighborhood of $325 million “after reviewing its financial history and consulting eight real estate experts.”
So you will note that there is a great deal of legitimate debate to be had on the subject. But without a doubt, the “$22 million” claim is by far the furthest from rational estimates.
So you will note that there is a great deal of legitimate debate to be had on the subject. But without a doubt, the “$22 million” claim is by far the furthest from rational estimates.
This post was edited on 12/1/23 at 2:39 pm
Posted on 12/1/23 at 2:38 pm to TigerIn2023
quote:
Was only 11000
And the bank knew that when they did their valuations. They didn’t need you or Tishy to protect them.
Posted on 12/1/23 at 2:39 pm to TigerIn2023
quote:
Mar-a-Lago, the Trump Organization's private club in Florida, was valued at over $600 million, despite being assessed by the Palm Beach County tax assessor at only $27.6 million.
That’s what I was hoping you were going to say. You are a complete moron that doesn’t understand assessed values for property taxes and fair market values. quote:
Trump Tower's triplex apartment, where Donald Trump lived, was claimed to be over 32,000 square feet, when in reality it was only 11,000 square feet.
Which trump tower? There are towers in many of americas large cities. Are you talking about the square footage he owned for his personal residence or the square footage he owned that was unleased? Or some other measure. Or are you just regurgitating what CNN told you.
Your citing if a tax assessment tells me all I need to know. You’re a real estate and financial moron.
This post was edited on 12/1/23 at 2:41 pm
Posted on 12/1/23 at 2:44 pm to davyjones
quote:So you concede he valued it $100-$175million higher than rational estimates.
Trump’s financials gave a valuation range between $425 and $600 million for MAL ... Additionally, Forbes estimated the value in the neighborhood of $325 million “after reviewing its financial history and consulting eight real estate experts.”
Posted on 12/1/23 at 2:45 pm to BBONDS25
quote:…
You are a complete moron
quote:
Your citing if a tax assessment
Posted on 12/1/23 at 2:48 pm to TigerIn2023
Typing on my phone. Typos will happen. You actually think a tax assessors value for a property is relevant to fair market value. That isn’t a typo. That’s being completely financially illiterate. Know how I know you’ve never owned property?
The apostrophe in assessor’s didn’t auto fill on my phone. Make sure to point that out while you cite the tax assessor’s valuation!
You dumb idiot. This post was edited on 12/1/23 at 2:50 pm
Posted on 12/1/23 at 2:51 pm to BBONDS25
quote:No comment here huh?
You actually think a tax assessors value for a property is relevant to fair market value.
Posted on 12/1/23 at 2:53 pm to TigerIn2023
That’s a negative, Ghost Rider. I am proposing two theories: (1) that the judge’s opinion/valuation clearly leaves much room for debate and understandable disagreement; and (2) a mere superficial look at the numbers having been presented tends more towards substantial error and undervaluation on the part of the judge than they do overvaluation by the Trump people, or put another way, the glaring gap between one of the three referenced figures is to the extreme far end of the “spectrum,” while two of those three are much more comparable to each other. At least much, much more so than to the judge’s numbers. What does that translate to, possibly? That the judge has shown himself to be comically biased against Trump. That’s this fella’s opinion anyway.
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