re: Rand Paul never recovered

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Except when a libertarian joins with DIMs to undermine a Republicans efforts to get a fairer deal on tariffs, right?

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You left out the "by enacting new/higher tariffs"

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I mean thats what libertarians would never do, would they? Join with DIMs to undermine tariff strategies?

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If they strategy violated their principles and supported bigger government, why would you expect them to become hypocrites?

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The problem is that the reality is the practical options don’t match the idealistic desire Rand has.

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More government it is, then.

The "conservatives" who actually support smaller government have sure become an endangered species since 2016.

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More government it is, then.

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As I mentioned, Rand will accidentally enable more government…maybe total government.

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The "conservatives" who actually support smaller government have sure become an endangered species since 2016.

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Nah. They have just accepted the reality that the fed gov is too far gone and the only method of change is a slow one where piece by piece we get it back.

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As I mentioned, Rand will accidentally enable more government…maybe total government.

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How will he do that by opposing the actual "more government" we are seeing with tariffs?

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Nah. They have just accepted the reality that the fed gov is too far gone

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All you're doing is explaining the emotional talking points they invested in as NPCs to justify their reversal of support of small government. You're not actually making a logical point in reality.

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and the only method of change is a slow one where piece by piece we get it back.

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Vague NPC talking points: continued

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huh? Rand has always stated the primary function of the federal gov according to the constitution is national defense and has stated many times that the open border policy is the number 1 threat to that.

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Rand was the deciding vote on the 5 billion for a border wall back in Trump's first term, which is why we don't have a wall finished now.

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And you're trying to make some illogical connection between the 2, invalidating your point.

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I know it hurts your head to when someone tries to reign in your liberal side, but if you hate tariffs, then that has to go both ways

For you and Rand and Roger, it somehow doesnt

Lets look at some key stats for Rand Paul and see how well his approach has been working. He became a Senator in 2011. People need houses, they need to be making babies and they need to be able to pay for the things they need:

2011 Median House Price: $166100
~2025 Median House Price:$416,900

From 2011 to Q1 2025:

Nominal: House prices (151.0%) outpaced wages (44.9%) by 106.1 percentage points, growing ~3.36 times faster.
Real: House prices (83.2%) outpaced wages (7.3%) by 75.9 percentage points, growing ~11.4 times faster.
Affordability: Homes went from ~3.32 times median income to ~4.96 times, a ~49.4% increase in the price-to-income ratio, confirming a significant affordability decline.

Birth Rates:

2011: Crude birth rate: 12.7 per 1,000; TFR: 1.89 children per woman. Births: ~3.95 million.

2023(latest data): TFR estimated at 1.62, continuing the downward trend. Births: ~3.6 million (provisional CDC data). Below replacement level (2.1).

Debt per citizen

Personal Debt Per U.S. Citizen:
2011: ~$37,666 (total debt: $11.65T, population: 309.3M).
2024 (Q4): ~$52,873 (total debt: $18.04T, population: 341M).
2025 (Q1, projected): ~$53,509 (total debt: ~$18.3T, population: 342M).
Growth: 40.4% nominal (2.6% annualized), 4.0% real from 2011–2024.

Judging from this, we can make one of two assumptions:
1) Rand Paul's approach is ineffective
2) Rand Paul's policy ideas MIGHT be effective, but they are impractical at winning elections.

We can also 100% see that the lives and financial health of US citizens has only gotten MUCH worse during his time as a Senator

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I know it hurts your head to when someone tries to reign in your liberal side, but if you hate tariffs, then that has to go both ways

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I don't vote for China's leaders. If I did, then I'd support less government (which means lower tariffs)

I actually vote for US leaders. I vote supporting less government (which means lower tariffs)

You trying to devolve your argument into ad homs shows you have no actual response to this.

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I know it hurts your head to when someone tries to reign in your liberal side, but if you hate tariffs, then that has to go both ways

For you and Rand and Roger, it somehow doesnt

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Exactly

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Rand was the deciding vote on the 5 billion for a border wall back in Trump's first term, which is why we don't have a wall finished now.

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so....was it a stand alone bill?

was there equal cuts in spending?

would the wall have helped any during biden admin?

let me answer that for you...

no
no
no


so why are you surprised when the guy who says no new spending and wants stand alone bills votes no on a huge bill that increases spending and contains no off set cuts?

so the guy who says we spend too much and we are broke is suddenly wrong for not supporting new spending?


i dont understand why this is so hard for trump and johnson....just cut god damn spending, get congress to pass an actual budget and get congress to pass single issue bills

that is what the american people want. We do want border security and we want lots of deportations and a good economy but we also want spending cuts