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Posted on 3/1/18 at 10:39 pm to LSURussian
quote:
Trade is a way to encourage efficiencies in production with those efficiencies allowing mutual wealth building not wealth redistribution. Tariffs distort those efficiencies just like big government interference in the economy always distorts efficiency.
That's not true with a nation who is creating an unfair practice. You are either avoiding the topic or purposefully lying.
You can't say that jobs were not lost here and gained there. It's dishonest. It happened and is a fact.
quote:
You are now firmly in bed with all the big international labor unions. They've been demanding tariffs for decades. Congratulations on your new found partnership.
And that's even a lie. Reagan used Tariffs. Used them very effectively.
One can agree with tariffs and not unions.
Posted on 3/1/18 at 10:43 pm to Jjdoc
quote:
And that's even a lie. Reagan used Tariffs. Used them very effectively.
Not all tariffs are equal.
Posted on 3/1/18 at 10:43 pm to Jjdoc
quote:
There is a reason why communist countries wanted that. Because the nations that it disproportionately helps is the communist nations.
That’s way too broad of a generalization. Why not settle on a more accurate assessment, that free trade helps any nation with a comparative advantage for a particular commodity?
Do you disagree or do you enjoy professing wildly inaccurate statements?
Posted on 3/1/18 at 10:49 pm to cave canem
quote:
Your not so simple that you can't comprehend that the US consumer is the one paying the tarrif are you?
You are not so simple that you can't comprehend globalism and the moving of jobs hurt the consumers even more are you?
quote:
Protectionist tarrif are socialism by definition plain and simple, there is no way around it.
No... they are not. That's just a lie. It is in fact, as in the OP, a tactic used by socialist is trade with communist countries.
quote:
Everybody pays more so someone else who could not compete has a job = socialism.
So much wrong in that. But let's again follow that. Everybody pays even MORE when people don't have jobs and a welfare class is created and expanded.
So which do you prefer?
1- Americans working and supporting themselves and paying that 100 dollars more for a washing machine over a 5 year period. More jobs added which drives up wages....
vs
2- Jobs still leave, not because they can't compete in fair free trade, but because they cheat to an extent you can't because they are Communist country. That creates less jobs and wages goes down..... and taxes go up. Gotta pay for people who have no jobs.
So now Reagan.... he was a socialist! Got it!
This post was edited on 3/1/18 at 11:18 pm
Posted on 3/1/18 at 10:53 pm to Jjdoc
quote:So, you believe there are fewer Americans employed now than were employed 30 years ago? No? Then jobs have INCREASED in the U.S.
You can't say that jobs were not lost here and gained there. It's dishonest. It happened and is a fact.
THAT is a fact.
You have sworn such complete fealty to Trump that you will defend anything he says. If Obama had proposed tariffs you would have opposed the idea. But since Trump says it it's a good idea.
As you so frequently put it: BREAKING NEWS: Tariffs will hurt our economy. Period.
The stock market's reaction today immediately after Trump proposed the aluminum & steel tariffs is an accurate reflection of the harm tariffs will do to our economy.
Stop doubling down on stupidity.
Posted on 3/1/18 at 10:56 pm to Jjdoc
quote:If you want tariffs then you ARE agreeing with the big labor unions. Enjoy.
One can agree with tariffs and not unions.
Posted on 3/1/18 at 11:03 pm to stuntman
quote:
Restricting trade is never good for an economy.
It's done a hell of a job for China! Come on. Get real!
Which is the point that you need to realize. It's the point being made in this thread.
quote:
Let's say the Chinese government was subsidizing 100% of the steel they produce and sell to us and that we are able to buy it for 50% of what we'd pay for steel produced here.
How are we worse off?
1- Job loss. From June 2015 to june 2016 around 18K jobs lost.
2- No capacity to produce yourself and therefore at the mercy of another nation. This is a direct effect of #1.
quote:
It's actually the Chinese that are worse off, because the subsidies used by China were taken from their taxpayers....money those taxpayers would have spent in more efficiently than their government.
Really worse off? You are talking about a nation that just started grading the population via social media to keep them in line. They just decided to make XI a friggin emperor. They just told people they are not allowed to use words like 1984.... Punishable.
So no.. China isn't going to be worse off. They do not operate under the same liberty rules that the USA.
Posted on 3/1/18 at 11:12 pm to Jjdoc
You are brainwashed by slogans.
18k jobs lost over a year? Even if that's true, and since you refused to provide a link no one can check your source, the economy added 2 million jobs in that time period. 18,000 jobs don't even represent a rounding error.
18k jobs lost over a year? Even if that's true, and since you refused to provide a link no one can check your source, the economy added 2 million jobs in that time period. 18,000 jobs don't even represent a rounding error.
Posted on 3/1/18 at 11:14 pm to Jjdoc
quote:
It's done a hell of a job for China!
Not really.
Posted on 3/1/18 at 11:16 pm to Jjdoc
quote:
2- Jobs still leave
You need an Econ refresher.
Posted on 3/1/18 at 11:17 pm to Willie Stroker
quote:
That’s way too broad of a generalization. Why not settle on a more accurate assessment, that free trade helps any nation with a comparative advantage for a particular commodity?
It's not broad.
Posted on 3/1/18 at 11:20 pm to LSURussian
quote:
You are brainwashed by slogans.
Nah, he is just a Trump stooge to dim to think for himself. No self thinking adult can be in such lock step with any other individual.
OP is either a paid shill or a stooge.
Posted on 3/1/18 at 11:25 pm to Jjdoc
quote:China has over a billion reasons it changed its economy from strict communistic to a form of capitalism. A billion unemployed Chinese would be a revolution in waiting.
It's done a hell of a job for China! Come on. Get real!
And stop using the word "communism" as meaning a political system. Communism is an economic system not a political system.
Communism in China transitioned away 30 years ago. It now has a quasi-capitalistic economic system with an authoritarianism form of government, just like Vietnam has.
Posted on 3/1/18 at 11:32 pm to Jjdoc
quote:
1- Job loss. From June 2015 to june 2016 around 18K jobs lost.
You'll have continued job loss in the industry even if production picks up. The process of making steel has greatly automated over the years
Posted on 3/1/18 at 11:34 pm to LSURussian
quote:
So, you believe there are fewer Americans employed now than were employed 30 years ago? No? Then jobs have INCREASED in the U.S.
Now that's a very dishonest.
1- Our population was at 244 Million then vs 324 Million now.
2- Comparable unemployment rate. Within a percent.
quote:
THAT is a fact.
What is a fact is you are trying to pass off the fact that we have more people, thus more working is some how proof that we have not lost jobs.
The Rust belt still feels that effect.
quote:
You have sworn such complete fealty to Trump that you will defend anything he says.
I voted for Trump for THIS very reason. Feel free to look that up during the election.
quote:
The stock market's reaction today immediately after Trump proposed the aluminum & steel tariffs is an accurate reflection of the harm tariffs will do to our economy.
No
Posted on 3/1/18 at 11:37 pm to Jjdoc
quote:
The Rust belt still feels that effect.
It's never returning to 1970 levels again, regardless of whatever political gimmicks are tried
Posted on 3/1/18 at 11:43 pm to Jjdoc
quote:Yes.
No
You are truly ignorant, bless your heart.
Posted on 3/1/18 at 11:45 pm to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
Not really.
So they have not become the 2nd largest economy in the world?
In 1990, China wasn't even top 10. Every 5 years they jumped 2 people. In 2010, they became #2 in the world.
From 2010, china went from a GDP 5,812.464 to 11,226.186 just 5 years later.
Forbes stated they will pass the USA in 2018. Bloomberg says they have already done so.
The largest economy in the world is now ran by a dictator.
Posted on 3/1/18 at 11:55 pm to Jjdoc
Now who's being dishonest?
And why are you so scared of the Chinese? I thought you said we can compete with anybody.
And why are you so scared of the Chinese? I thought you said we can compete with anybody.
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