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Started By
Message
re: Italy's national health care: Those over 80 to be denied intensive care
Posted on 3/16/20 at 3:27 pm to TigerChief10
Posted on 3/16/20 at 3:27 pm to TigerChief10
(in medical use) the assignment of degrees of urgency to wounds or illnesses to decide the order of treatment of a large number of patients or casualties.
save who you can
save who you can
4
Posted on 3/16/20 at 3:28 pm to Ag Zwin
I linked that last night in the big thread. As of the time of the writing, it said that they hadn't had to do that yet. It's further down in the article.
The plan is in place though.
The plan is in place though.
Posted on 3/16/20 at 3:30 pm to Usafgiles
quote:
(in medical use) the assignment of degrees of urgency to wounds or illnesses to decide the order of treatment of a large number of patients or casualties. save who you can
they aren’t deciding based on urgency...
This post was edited on 3/16/20 at 3:31 pm
Posted on 3/16/20 at 3:31 pm to Ag Zwin
Why don’t they just not treat politicians or lawyers?
At least some of the old folks would be good people.
At least some of the old folks would be good people.
Posted on 3/16/20 at 3:31 pm to Usafgiles
On a battlefield, I'm assuming you help the most injured first, partly because well, they're most injured BUT partly because you likely have limited supplies.
In this case, I pray that they aren't delaying treatment "in case" younger pts come in .. if you're old and you need a vent and a vent is available you should get it. Sorry for the 40 yo who comes in next needing it.
I HATE that any of this is happening BUT if you don't have adequate supplies (in this case icu beds/vents) how do you help everyone? Serious question? What is the solution? I don't know what that solution is.
In this case, I pray that they aren't delaying treatment "in case" younger pts come in .. if you're old and you need a vent and a vent is available you should get it. Sorry for the 40 yo who comes in next needing it.
I HATE that any of this is happening BUT if you don't have adequate supplies (in this case icu beds/vents) how do you help everyone? Serious question? What is the solution? I don't know what that solution is.
This post was edited on 3/16/20 at 3:33 pm
Posted on 3/16/20 at 3:32 pm to Wtxtiger
quote:
Why don’t they just not treat politicians or lawyers? At least some of the old folks would be good people.
If you can decide based on age, then they can decide based on race/ethnicity/income level/sex..
Posted on 3/16/20 at 3:32 pm to Usafgiles
Italy has almost 3x fewer ICU beds than the USA per capita.
You people
You people
Posted on 3/16/20 at 3:32 pm to Dawgfanman
they arent doing anything right now, only if the numbers continue to climb.
they would be deciding on likelihood of survival.
they would be deciding on likelihood of survival.
Posted on 3/16/20 at 3:32 pm to Ag Zwin
Does that equally apply to government employees? Such as elected officials?
Posted on 3/16/20 at 3:32 pm to OchoDedos
quote:
It's called a social welfare state saving money.
Salesmen of "socialized medicine" sell it by suggesting that we will get an infinite amount of care. It's a con job. Will never happen. Keep in mind that our government is $23,000,000,000,000 in debt and decide if expecting adequate (muchless unlimited) care is likely to happen.
Second, by definition.... socialized medicine is tasked with doing what's best for society not any individual patient. If letting old people die is deemed "better" for society... you're left to die.
It's hard to believe anyone would fall for this. Yet many do. It's scarier than this virus .
Posted on 3/16/20 at 3:33 pm to Ag Zwin
Bernie,” People will die!”
Posted on 3/16/20 at 3:33 pm to Ag Zwin
They'll have a waiver list for the rich and famous.
Posted on 3/16/20 at 3:33 pm to tiger91
quote:
I HATE that any of this is happening BUT if you don't have adequate supplies (in this case icu beds/vents) how do you help everyone? Serious question? What is the solution? I don't know what that solution is.
Why age? “They’ve lived long enough” is that really where we are as a planet?
Posted on 3/16/20 at 3:34 pm to Dawgfanman
Why age?
IDK and I don't like it or agree with it.
I work in a nursing home and I promise you we have some 80+ year old that I would miss more than some much younger people. Sad but true. So again, yes, why age?
IDK and I don't like it or agree with it.
I work in a nursing home and I promise you we have some 80+ year old that I would miss more than some much younger people. Sad but true. So again, yes, why age?
Posted on 3/16/20 at 3:35 pm to Usafgiles
quote:
they arent doing anything right now, only if the numbers continue to climb. they would be deciding on likelihood of survival.
So a kid with cancer and covid..let em rot? A politician age 50 with aids, not treatment? Or just you’re old, frick you?
Posted on 3/16/20 at 3:35 pm to TideCPA
quote:
You can't triage a "human right", bro. It either is or it isn't.
Healthcare is a human right*... unless you're old and expensive, then it's apparently revocable.
Posted on 3/16/20 at 3:36 pm to The Maj
quote:
It is called socialized medicine and many in this country want that same system here...
If you think we're not already rationing care, I have a bridge to sell you.
Posted on 3/16/20 at 3:36 pm to tiger91
quote:
On a battlefield, I'm assuming you help the most injured first, partly because well, they're most injured BUT partly because you likely have limited supplies.
In this case, I pray that they aren't delaying treatment "in case" younger pts come in .. if you're old and you need a vent and a vent is available you should get it. Sorry for the 40 yo who comes in next needing it.
I HATE that any of this is happening BUT if you don't have adequate supplies (in this case icu beds/vents) how do you help everyone? Serious question? What is the solution? I don't know what that solution is.
Well, it could be that an industry not being run with a civil servant mentality would have a better allocation of resources in place BEFORE they hit an event that exacerbated shortages.
I'm just spitballing here, though.
Posted on 3/16/20 at 3:37 pm to BamaAtl
quote:
If you think we're not already rationing care, I have a bridge to sell you.
Show me the link because no, I do not believe you and I know good and well you don't own anything that I would be interested in purchasing.
Posted on 3/16/20 at 3:37 pm to Dawgfanman
If I have only one bed to give and One is an otherwise healthy 40 yr old, and one is 87. Sorry but I'm giving it to the 40 year old. It's harsh, and I pray it doesn't come to that, but you have to be realistic on who has the best chance to survive.
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