- My Forums
- Tiger Rant
- LSU Recruiting
- SEC Rant
- Saints Talk
- Pelicans Talk
- More Sports Board
- Coaching Changes
- Fantasy Sports
- Golf Board
- Soccer Board
- O-T Lounge
- Tech Board
- Home/Garden Board
- Outdoor Board
- Health/Fitness Board
- Movie/TV Board
- Book Board
- Music Board
- Political Talk
- Money Talk
- Fark Board
- Gaming Board
- Travel Board
- Food/Drink Board
- Ticket Exchange
- TD Help Board
Customize My Forums- View All Forums
- Show Left Links
- Topic Sort Options
- Trending Topics
- Recent Topics
- Active Topics
Started By
Message
re: How do I convince my parents (specifically my mom) that Israel is not some great ally
Posted on 10/22/24 at 10:47 am to Hawgnsincebirth55
Posted on 10/22/24 at 10:47 am to Hawgnsincebirth55
Fairly simple.
1. Stay off of Reddit, Democratic Underground, and Daily Kos.
2. Grow the frick up and join the real world
3. Apologize to your parents for being a brainwashed dildo
1. Stay off of Reddit, Democratic Underground, and Daily Kos.
2. Grow the frick up and join the real world
3. Apologize to your parents for being a brainwashed dildo
1
Posted on 10/22/24 at 10:47 am to Riverside
quote:
Your mom is right. Israel is our only true ally in the Middle East. Downvote away.
This is true, but it’s also extremely one-sided
Posted on 10/22/24 at 10:47 am to ABearsFanNMS
quote:where I did I ever fricking say this? Are you fricking delusional? I never mentioned nato once and never said Israel wasn’t an ally.
So in your mind Israel isn’t an ally but NATO is……please explain the hypocrisy?
Posted on 10/22/24 at 10:48 am to riccoar
quote:I voted for Trump. Get the kosher cock out of your mouth dickweed
1. Stay off of Reddit, Democratic Underground, and Daily Kos. 2. Grow the frick up and join the real world 3. Apologize to your parents for being a brainwashed dildo
Posted on 10/22/24 at 10:49 am to ABearsFanNMS
quote:
So in your mind Israel isn’t an ally but NATO is……please explain the hypocrisy?
Turkey is legally an ally, Israel however is not
Posted on 10/22/24 at 10:49 am to Hawgnsincebirth55
Would the USA, or the world for that matter, be better or worse off if Israel was wiped out and displaced by the surrounding Middle Eastern countries?
There in-lies your answer.
There in-lies your answer.
Posted on 10/22/24 at 10:49 am to Hawgnsincebirth55
God: in His own words.
Those who bless Israel I will bless those who curse Israel I will curse.
Now, if you want to call God a liar. be my guest.
Those who bless Israel I will bless those who curse Israel I will curse.
Now, if you want to call God a liar. be my guest.
Posted on 10/22/24 at 10:52 am to Hawgnsincebirth55
I thin you're the one that needs convincing that they are.
Posted on 10/22/24 at 10:53 am to Cajun Cricket
quote:perhaps I chose my words poorly. My point was israel doesn’t give a frick about Americans, or Christians, they care about their Jewish state and the best way to protect it happens to be with American weaponry. Now I happen to believe our interests align here in that they are the best possible rulers of the Middle East currently, but it isn’t because the Jews are gods chosen people, and have some long lost bond with Christians. It’s because the rest of the people over there still live in the Middle Ages and are bat shite crazy. But that being said, we shouldn’t just give them a frickload of supplies they should have to pay for it, and if they want our military support they should allow us to have bases in their country, and if they want our help in conflicts they should send their soldiers to support in our conflicts too. Something they don’t do. For it to be some great alliance it sure seems pretty one sided.
Would the USA, or the world for that matter, be better or worse off if Israel was wiped out and displaced by the surrounding Middle Eastern countries?
Posted on 10/22/24 at 10:53 am to Hawgnsincebirth55
quote:
. How can I get her to understand how stupid she sounds?
Of the things going on right now, this is your complaint?
But hey...
Just be glad she's not MY biological mother. The absolute definition of dumbocrat. To the core.
Posted on 10/22/24 at 10:54 am to Cajun Cricket
quote:
Would the USA, or the world for that matter, be better or worse off if Israel was wiped out and displaced by the surrounding Middle Eastern countries? There in-lies your answer.
Except Israel would be just fine without all our money and weapons
Posted on 10/22/24 at 10:54 am to Hawgnsincebirth55
Explain the issue with Israel then?
Those people are just trying to exist. US involvement and support is merely keeping them from turning their foes into a vast wasteland.
Palestine if given every demand would still be trying to kill Israelis. People are so damn blind to believe those folks are displaced. They aren’t.
They are just like trans gender people. Living a fabricated lie.
They never had possession of any of the land they lay claim to.
Those people are just trying to exist. US involvement and support is merely keeping them from turning their foes into a vast wasteland.
Palestine if given every demand would still be trying to kill Israelis. People are so damn blind to believe those folks are displaced. They aren’t.
They are just like trans gender people. Living a fabricated lie.
They never had possession of any of the land they lay claim to.
Posted on 10/22/24 at 10:54 am to TTOWN RONMON
quote:well Israel wasn’t a fricking thing for damn near 2000 years so how did that work out. And the people who destroyed Israel became the first state to adopt Christianity as its state religion. So history doesn’t support that tiny scripture.
Those who bless Israel I will bless those who curse Israel I will curse.
Posted on 10/22/24 at 10:55 am to Hawgnsincebirth55
Romans 9:6-8 “It is not as though God’s word had failed. For not all who are descended from Israel are Israel. Nor because they are his descendants are they all Abraham’s children. On the contrary, “It is through Isaac that your offspring will be reckoned.” In other words, it is not the children by physical descent who are God’s children, but it is the children of the promise who are regarded as Abraham’s offspring.”
“The jews” are not God’s chosen people even the Bible states this. Rather those who have faith in Christ are God’s chosen people Jew and gentile alike. The jews can be part of the chosen people but it is because of their faith in Christ not because of their ethnicity. Also the modern state of Israel is not the Israel of the Bible so Christians owe it no support. Maybe this will help.
“The jews” are not God’s chosen people even the Bible states this. Rather those who have faith in Christ are God’s chosen people Jew and gentile alike. The jews can be part of the chosen people but it is because of their faith in Christ not because of their ethnicity. Also the modern state of Israel is not the Israel of the Bible so Christians owe it no support. Maybe this will help.
Posted on 10/22/24 at 10:56 am to riccoar
Idgaf about the Palestinians. Jews can wipe them off the face of the earth for all I care. I’ll quote myself from above to explain my stance.
quote:
perhaps I chose my words poorly. My point was israel doesn’t give a frick about Americans, or Christians, they care about their Jewish state and the best way to protect it happens to be with American weaponry. Now I happen to believe our interests align here in that they are the best possible rulers of the Middle East currently, but it isn’t because the Jews are gods chosen people, and have some long lost bond with Christians. It’s because the rest of the people over there still live in the Middle Ages and are bat shite crazy. But that being said, we shouldn’t just give them a frickload of supplies they should have to pay for it, and if they want our military support they should allow us to have bases in their country, and if they want our help in conflicts they should send their soldiers to support in our conflicts too. Something they don’t do. For it to be some great alliance it sure seems pretty one sided.
Posted on 10/22/24 at 10:56 am to Hawgnsincebirth55
Christian Zionism has no foundation in the Bible. It was fabricated by a guy named Darby in the 1800s. I posted about that, from a link, earlier (see below). Our relationship with Israel ought to be viewed very simply: through the lens of US national interests.
Tell your mom about the USS Liberty and how AIPAC works on behalf of Israel to buy off Congress and that AIPAC has transferred classified data to Israel in the past.
Israel does not give two shits about the United States. Doesn't mean we should wish anything bad on Israel, but we shouldn't kid ourselves about that relationship. We're just two nations. There is no biblical connection that places either in a special relationship with the other.
A key concept, unique to Darby, is that the prophecies of the Old Testament that speak of an eternal Israel, such as those found in Isaiah 60, require the physical re-establishment of the nation of Israel on earth, that this is separate from the establishment of the Church, and that this must happen before the “end times.” This idea was strongly advocated by Darby, who travelled much of continental Europe and North America to spread this idea. It has caught on in a number of Protestant circles, and is as good as Gospel for them: Israel must be re-established and fully recognized before Christ can return.
Darby separated the ideas of Fatherhood and Kingship in God, saying, “The same person may be king of a country, and father of a family; and this is the difference between God’s actings towards us and the Jews. Towards the church, it is the character of Father; towards the Jews, it is the character of Jehovah, the King.” (See “Israel’s Restoration: The Manner of Its Accomplishment,” in Collected Writings of J.N. Darby.)
Darby saw this in the many prophecies of the Old Testament, where kingship seems to always be applied to Israel, but salvation would be open to all. These kinds of prophecies exist all across the Old Testament in Isaiah, Daniel, Amos, the Psalms, and other places. He even used the words of Christ Himself to find assurance that the nation of Israel would be restored: ‘O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, killing the prophets…your house is forsaken and desolate…until you say, ‘Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord’” (Mt 23:37-39). This prediction, delivered by Jesus Himself, gives us the assurance—so Darby thought—of the coming of Christ to restore Israel and to reign in her midst.
To explore such texts as this is outside of the scope of this particular article, but I would encourage anyone interested in Darby’s perspective to compare his writings to the passages he cites; and most importantly, to hear what the Fathers have to say concerning these prophecies, as there is no basis for this idea before Darby. The Scriptures do not teach it, and it is unknown to all the Fathers of the Church and even to the Protestant Reformers.
St. Paul declares the Church of Christ the New Israel. It has always been understood by all Christians—until Darby—that the Church is the continuation and fulfilment of the nation of Israel. The Holy Apostle speaks of the “Israel of God” (Gal 6:16) and tells us there is “ neither Jew nor Greek…but all are one in Christ Jesus”(Gal 3:18). In fact, the entire Epistle to the Galatians is an apology against the Judaizing heresy that St. Paul faced in the 1st century, explaining that the Body of Christ has become the New Israel, the Old Covenant is fulfilled, and the gates are now open to all. There is no meaningful distinction in the eyes of God between such categories as “Jew” or “Greek” (i.e., gentile), but are all one.
The idea of the Church of Christ being the fulfilment of Israel, or the New Israel of God, is also seen in the Fathers from antiquity. For example, St. Justin the Philosopher writes in the 2nd century, “…[T]hen is it Jacob the patriarch in whom the Gentiles and yourselves shall trust? Or is it not Christ? As, therefore, Christ is the Israel and the Jacob, even so we, who have been quarried out from the bowels of Christ, are the true Israelitic race” (Dialogue with Trypho, CXXXV).
Tertullian, writing in the late 2nd and early 3rd centuries, also sees this clearly in the Scriptures, from the very epistle we ourselves were just reading: “Now, if the Creator indeed promised that ‘the ancient things should pass away,’ to be superseded by a new course of things which should arise, whilst Christ marks the period of the separation when He says, ‘The law and the prophets were until John’” (Against Marcion; Book V, Ch. 2: “On The Epistle to the Galatians”).
The idea that there was some special, divine plan for the nation who had rejected Christ would be completely foreign and bizarre to any Christian who lived more than 200 years ago. This is a new, different teaching from all of Church history, a radical break from what has always been known to be true by Christians the world over. Many would say it is a “different opinion”—the literal meaning of the word heresy—from all of Christianity before it.
And yet, it has gained such traction that a large segment of Evangelicals in America accept as Gospel that which is foreign to 1800 years of all Christian teaching that preceded it.
Tell your mom about the USS Liberty and how AIPAC works on behalf of Israel to buy off Congress and that AIPAC has transferred classified data to Israel in the past.
Israel does not give two shits about the United States. Doesn't mean we should wish anything bad on Israel, but we shouldn't kid ourselves about that relationship. We're just two nations. There is no biblical connection that places either in a special relationship with the other.
A key concept, unique to Darby, is that the prophecies of the Old Testament that speak of an eternal Israel, such as those found in Isaiah 60, require the physical re-establishment of the nation of Israel on earth, that this is separate from the establishment of the Church, and that this must happen before the “end times.” This idea was strongly advocated by Darby, who travelled much of continental Europe and North America to spread this idea. It has caught on in a number of Protestant circles, and is as good as Gospel for them: Israel must be re-established and fully recognized before Christ can return.
Darby separated the ideas of Fatherhood and Kingship in God, saying, “The same person may be king of a country, and father of a family; and this is the difference between God’s actings towards us and the Jews. Towards the church, it is the character of Father; towards the Jews, it is the character of Jehovah, the King.” (See “Israel’s Restoration: The Manner of Its Accomplishment,” in Collected Writings of J.N. Darby.)
Darby saw this in the many prophecies of the Old Testament, where kingship seems to always be applied to Israel, but salvation would be open to all. These kinds of prophecies exist all across the Old Testament in Isaiah, Daniel, Amos, the Psalms, and other places. He even used the words of Christ Himself to find assurance that the nation of Israel would be restored: ‘O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, killing the prophets…your house is forsaken and desolate…until you say, ‘Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord’” (Mt 23:37-39). This prediction, delivered by Jesus Himself, gives us the assurance—so Darby thought—of the coming of Christ to restore Israel and to reign in her midst.
To explore such texts as this is outside of the scope of this particular article, but I would encourage anyone interested in Darby’s perspective to compare his writings to the passages he cites; and most importantly, to hear what the Fathers have to say concerning these prophecies, as there is no basis for this idea before Darby. The Scriptures do not teach it, and it is unknown to all the Fathers of the Church and even to the Protestant Reformers.
St. Paul declares the Church of Christ the New Israel. It has always been understood by all Christians—until Darby—that the Church is the continuation and fulfilment of the nation of Israel. The Holy Apostle speaks of the “Israel of God” (Gal 6:16) and tells us there is “ neither Jew nor Greek…but all are one in Christ Jesus”(Gal 3:18). In fact, the entire Epistle to the Galatians is an apology against the Judaizing heresy that St. Paul faced in the 1st century, explaining that the Body of Christ has become the New Israel, the Old Covenant is fulfilled, and the gates are now open to all. There is no meaningful distinction in the eyes of God between such categories as “Jew” or “Greek” (i.e., gentile), but are all one.
The idea of the Church of Christ being the fulfilment of Israel, or the New Israel of God, is also seen in the Fathers from antiquity. For example, St. Justin the Philosopher writes in the 2nd century, “…[T]hen is it Jacob the patriarch in whom the Gentiles and yourselves shall trust? Or is it not Christ? As, therefore, Christ is the Israel and the Jacob, even so we, who have been quarried out from the bowels of Christ, are the true Israelitic race” (Dialogue with Trypho, CXXXV).
Tertullian, writing in the late 2nd and early 3rd centuries, also sees this clearly in the Scriptures, from the very epistle we ourselves were just reading: “Now, if the Creator indeed promised that ‘the ancient things should pass away,’ to be superseded by a new course of things which should arise, whilst Christ marks the period of the separation when He says, ‘The law and the prophets were until John’” (Against Marcion; Book V, Ch. 2: “On The Epistle to the Galatians”).
The idea that there was some special, divine plan for the nation who had rejected Christ would be completely foreign and bizarre to any Christian who lived more than 200 years ago. This is a new, different teaching from all of Church history, a radical break from what has always been known to be true by Christians the world over. Many would say it is a “different opinion”—the literal meaning of the word heresy—from all of Christianity before it.
And yet, it has gained such traction that a large segment of Evangelicals in America accept as Gospel that which is foreign to 1800 years of all Christian teaching that preceded it.
Posted on 10/22/24 at 10:57 am to Hawgnsincebirth55
quote:
I can tell. This place has been infected with the same mind virus my mother has. Just to be clear I have nothing against Jews but people need to understand the Jews in Israel don’t view us as some great ally. They view us as a we should view them. A strategic ally who provides lots of military and monetary support and they constantly spy and compromise our government
I agree. Absolutely nothing wrong w/ being Jewish religiously/ethnically. It’s just a very one-sided relationship with Israel. Add in years of biblical indoctrination… oh well
Posted on 10/22/24 at 10:57 am to JesusSaves777
Thank you! 
Posted on 10/22/24 at 10:58 am to Riverside
quote:Yup
Your mom is right. Israel is our only true ally in the Middle East.
Posted on 10/22/24 at 11:00 am to Hawgnsincebirth55
I had to register for the draft in 79 because Iran had taken US hostages and Carter was not handling it correctly, and we have been fighting some combination of Iran, Iraq, and Afghanistan for the last thirty years, but not Israel. And after the twin towers, my enemy is their enemy so we are allies.
Page 2 of 7
Popular
Back to top
Follow TigerDroppings for LSU Football News