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re: For those who are pro choice: At what point do you feel a fetus becomes a human being?
Posted on 5/15/19 at 11:12 pm to AggieHank86
Posted on 5/15/19 at 11:12 pm to AggieHank86
quote:ehh, this still fails the sled test. and it's kind of smarmy that you think you introduced a gotcha by using that slippery term
If such organism is not sapient, however, that act is not "murder."
0
Posted on 5/15/19 at 11:17 pm to Dr Hawkenbush
quote:who is arguing AGAINST abortion in these rare, rare cases?
Your 35 year old wife finds our that she is 6 weeks pregnant, but has Ovarian Cancer that will kill her and the unborn child in 8 weeks if left untreated. If a hysterectomy and removal of the ovaries is performed and with aggressive Chemotherapy she has a 95% survival rate
quote:the rape and demographic qualifiers are irrelevant. the less than ideal condition of the person does not preclude murder. it would still be murder
Your 12 year old daughter was raped by (insert your most hated ethnic/racial/national/sports team person here). She is 6 weeks pregnant but genetic and ultrasound test predict that the infant will be horribly deformed and exist in a vegetative state
quote:there is NO medical advice that makes murder for convenience moral
This should be based upon medical advice from your Physician
quote:morality is not relative. it is equally true for all people. murdering a baby for convenience is wrong in every situation
while right for those people, aren't right for you
Posted on 5/16/19 at 2:47 am to bfniii
In many states where abortion is legal, riddle me this. A woman is four months in, she is attacked by someone causing her to lose the whatever it is.
What can and in a lot of places will said perp be charged with? And should your answer be manslaughter, just how can that be? During said act, she sure won't be crying, My fetus my fetus, now will she?
When they get that bastard in court. they won't be talking about she lost her fetus.
Can you say contradiction?? I KNEW you could! It's either a baby or it is not, yet the law is trying to have it both ways. If Mom decides to take the little tyke out, why that's fine. It's not a human being anyway. But you let someone else cause problems and it's My baby!
What can and in a lot of places will said perp be charged with? And should your answer be manslaughter, just how can that be? During said act, she sure won't be crying, My fetus my fetus, now will she?
When they get that bastard in court. they won't be talking about she lost her fetus.
Can you say contradiction?? I KNEW you could! It's either a baby or it is not, yet the law is trying to have it both ways. If Mom decides to take the little tyke out, why that's fine. It's not a human being anyway. But you let someone else cause problems and it's My baby!
This post was edited on 5/16/19 at 2:59 am
Posted on 5/16/19 at 3:15 am to JuiceTerry
quote:
Do hardcore anti-abortionists believe Plan B is abortion? Just curious
The Morning after pill is an "emergency birth control pill"
Taken within 72 hours it prevents pregnancy.
Isn't really different than being on birth control pills already.
So you question should actually be addressed to those who oppose contraceptives not to those who oppose abortions.
Posted on 5/16/19 at 3:19 am to antibarner
quote:
Can you say contradiction?? I KNEW you could! It's either a baby or it is not, yet the law is trying to have it both ways. If Mom decides to take the little tyke out, why that's fine. It's not a human being anyway. But you let someone else cause problems and it's My baby!
When NY passed there abortion up to the moment of birth law this year, they modified an existing law which now makes the above not a crime.
Under their new law you can stab the woman in the stomach killing the baby and as long as the woman lives you only get charged for the crime against the woman.
This post was edited on 5/16/19 at 3:32 am
Posted on 5/16/19 at 4:42 am to AggieHank86
quote:
As I understand them, Plan B options interrupt or prevent ovulation, so no pregnancy ever occurs. this is not accurate. Plan B does not prevent ovulation. Ovulation predates fertilization. Plan B prevents implantation of the fertilized ova (the zygote) on the wall of the uterus.
You are not understanding it accurately.
From the FDA website:
3. How does Plan B work?
Plan B works like other birth control pills to prevent pregnancy. Plan B acts primarily by stopping the release of an egg from the ovary (ovulation). It may prevent the union of sperm and egg (fertilization). If fertilization does occur, Plan B may prevent a fertilized egg from attaching to the womb (implantation). If a fertilized egg is implanted prior to taking Plan B, Plan B will not work.
Not sure why you thought otherwise, but the main use for it is to prevent ovulation as stated by the FDA. Also research has shown that there’s only a slight chance it will actually prevent implantation. If a woman told her doctor she took plan b and is still pregnant, the doctor would reply it is because you already ovulated before you took it.
Posted on 5/16/19 at 7:55 am to Tygra
My question is when is it life and when is it the potential for life. They aren't the same thing. Women miscarry all the time. Nobody ever suggests they should be charged with manslaughter so I can't buy the "all abortion is murder" argument. To me it is only a life if it is able to function biologically on its own and does not require a connection to the mother in the form of an umbilical cord to survive. Until then it may end up being a life, it may not. No one can know exactly what the future would hold without the abortion.
Posted on 5/16/19 at 12:29 pm to Huge Richard
quote:
Have you ever been pregnant or thought about how pregnancy and a child could change your life forever?
Have you ever had a young child die? I haven't, but I sure can imagine what it must be like. Likewise, I can imagine what it must be like to be a single mom or to be pregnant when life isn't the greatest. Life is tough sometimes. That never excuses killing an innocent.
Posted on 5/16/19 at 1:20 pm to mouton
This argument makes no sense. I am pro choice because I believe that a person should have the ability to decide if they want a child or not. I’m also pro choice because allowing abortion alleviates strain on a society. More children born into poverty is a shitty situation.
You all seem to be looking at a fetus in terms of its future. The fact is a fetus has no future because it’s a fetus. You aren’t denying a person of life because that person doesn’t exist. In fact, it’s not even a fetus until about 2 months in, so even if you’re arguing that there’s no distinction between a fetus and a human it’s still illogical to outlaw abortion.
The sad reality of the situation is that most of you are stuck in shitty situations and think you know the answers to life and the difference between right and wrong, and it’s just not true. You don’t like people that don’t abide by your way of living and you see it fit to impose other ways of life on those around you because of your miserable existences.
It makes me very fricking glad I don’t live in the south anymore. Even up here in red idaho people are more open minded.
Posted on 5/16/19 at 1:35 pm to mouton
You'll be shocked to learn that there's a legal document, valid in all 50 states, that tells you the exact day that a fetus becomes a human being.
Posted on 5/16/19 at 3:09 pm to ShortyRob
quote:
quote:yall have been on about abortion since the 1960's....yall have never said a word about making men support their kids both financiallyAre you somehow asserting that conservatives oppose child support laws?
facts are what they are my friend...conservatives run what, 28 of 50 states? You'd think those states would be free of dead beat dads or moms....but they aren't. In fact, the redder the state the poorer the population and the harder it is to imagine that kids are bing taken care of as they should be...
Posted on 5/16/19 at 3:13 pm to germandawg
quote:Why would one think this?
facts are what they are my friend...conservatives run what, 28 of 50 states? You'd think those states would be free of dead beat dads or moms.
One cannot extract blood from a turnip.
If you have suggestions for government approaches that would somehow make loser men not be losers, I'm all ears.
quote:Liberals love to talk about "state" colors and act as if they apply to all individuals in the state.
In fact, the redder the state the poorer the population and the harder it is to imagine that kids are bing taken care of as they should be.
Alas, for example, while Alabama is a red state, we most certainly have LARGE population of absolutely dedicated blue voters who are indigent as frick.
Posted on 5/16/19 at 3:13 pm to germandawg
"Then the LORD God formed a man from the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living being." Genesis 2:7 (NIV)
It's not at conception.
It's not at conception.
Posted on 5/16/19 at 4:35 pm to bfniii
quote:
who is arguing AGAINST abortion in these rare, rare cases?
Alabama
Posted on 5/16/19 at 4:35 pm to antibarner
quote:
If Mom decides to take the little tyke out, why that's fine. It's not a human being anyway. But you let someone else cause problems and it's My baby!
It's her body, her choice.
Posted on 5/16/19 at 4:40 pm to Odysseus32
quote:
The sad reality of the situation is that most of you are stuck in shitty situations
Listen to this sanctimonious crap
Posted on 5/16/19 at 4:41 pm to BamaAtl
Does the female fetus gets to choose what happens to her body?
This post was edited on 5/16/19 at 6:33 pm
Posted on 5/16/19 at 4:45 pm to mouton
age 18
This post was edited on 5/16/19 at 4:46 pm
Posted on 5/16/19 at 4:56 pm to Loserman
NY , laughing, so all those years they were charging manslaughter, but all of a sudden now they are not?? And what other states does the perp still
quote:get hammered for manslaughter?
When NY passed there abortion up to the moment of birth law this year, they modified an existing law which now makes the above not a crime. Under their new law you can stab the woman in the stomach killing the baby and as long as the woman lives you only get charged for the crime against the woman.
Posted on 5/16/19 at 4:58 pm to BamaAtl
BS. It does not matter who kills the baby . It is either a baby or it is not. You cannot charge someone for manslaughter for killing a zygote. That woman won't be screaming Muh Fetus! or Muh Zygote! or Muh Clump of Cells!
Gotcha, chuckles. 38 states have fetal homicide laws and 29 have them that apply to the earliest stages of pregnancy. Now how can you be charged with a crime for killing a clump of cells?
If this ever gets to SCOTUS nowadays...they are trying to portray the mother as the victim but a successful argument could be made that all these states recognize human life in the womb by law.
Gotcha, chuckles. 38 states have fetal homicide laws and 29 have them that apply to the earliest stages of pregnancy. Now how can you be charged with a crime for killing a clump of cells?
If this ever gets to SCOTUS nowadays...they are trying to portray the mother as the victim but a successful argument could be made that all these states recognize human life in the womb by law.
This post was edited on 5/16/19 at 5:47 pm
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