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re: Finland says debate on NATO membership 'will change' after Russian invasion
Posted on 2/24/22 at 7:15 pm to BohicaBob
Posted on 2/24/22 at 7:15 pm to BohicaBob
quote:
As someone who thinks the US should leave NATO, what makes you say this?
They are both all talk and no action. And I agree NATO should be dissolved. If Europe refuses to take appropriate steps to defend itself, why should we help them.
0
Posted on 2/24/22 at 7:23 pm to cokebottleag
quote:
Even so, she’s breaking the balance of trust Finland has maintained since 1945. For what? To “pressure” Putin? That’s AOC level thinking.
Example #83628172. Women “think” with emotion, men think with logic.
Posted on 2/24/22 at 7:25 pm to j1897
Finland and Sweden should be immediately in preparation for a future invasion. They are both non-NATO and both part of the former Russian Empire. Helsinki is a 3 1/2 hr train ride to St Petersburg.
Listen again to Biden's speech today and you will hear a consistent theme that the US and NATO only intend a full military defense if a NATO member is invaded. We have already shown our cards to Putin...other than Cold War style sanctions, NATO isn't going to war unless NATO is invaded.
Listen again to Biden's speech today and you will hear a consistent theme that the US and NATO only intend a full military defense if a NATO member is invaded. We have already shown our cards to Putin...other than Cold War style sanctions, NATO isn't going to war unless NATO is invaded.
Posted on 2/24/22 at 7:27 pm to cokebottleag
quote:
Even so, she’s breaking the balance of trust Finland has maintained since 1945. For what? To “pressure” Putin? That’s AOC level thinking.
And thinking Putin won't be aggressive towards Finland b/c the USSR embarrassingly failed at occupying it is smart?
Although this post is also an excuse to post pics of The White Death
Posted on 2/24/22 at 7:30 pm to tigeraddict
Europeans should have listened to president Trump.
Posted on 2/24/22 at 7:36 pm to cokebottleag
Invading Ukraine vs Finland are very different. Ukraine has Russians living there and historical ties to them. Finland and Russia might as well be apples and oranges. For them to invade and try to install a pro Russian government would be nearly impossible.
Posted on 2/24/22 at 7:36 pm to cokebottleag
quote:
What a dumb count.
This is exactly what caused Russia to attack Ukraine.
Finland never joined NATO or the Warsaw Pact. They never had to, because they knew how to act as a border state.
This dumb count thinks the west will come and save her. We won’t. And Russia cannot abide the possibility of NATO so close to St Petersburg.
If Putin wants Finland, he will take it regardless of Finland showing a desire to join NATO. When Biden implied in his speech today that the NATO military won't get involved unless NATO is attacked, he left Finland and Sweden out to dry. NATO membership is their only hope if Putin wants them.
Some of you are still naive to the fact that Putin intends to become the dominant superpower in Europe. You don't full scale invade Ukraine and wreck your own economy and world standing unless your end game is so large that you don't need the rest of the world's approval to dominate the region.
Posted on 2/24/22 at 7:38 pm to MillerLiteTime
quote:
Some of you are still naive to the fact that Putin intends to become the dominant superpower in Europe. You don't full scale invade Ukraine and wreck your own economy and world standing unless your end game is so large that you don't need the rest of the world's approval to dominate the region.
Exactly
This is not about NATO. That's just Putin's excuse that people are lapping up.
Posted on 2/24/22 at 7:40 pm to SlowFlowPro
C'mon, man. You really buying this Neville Chamberlain thing that he needs to be stopped now or he will remake the Soviet Union?
Posted on 2/24/22 at 7:47 pm to Bunk Moreland
quote:
C'mon, man. You really buying this Neville Chamberlain thing that he needs to be stopped now or he will remake the Soviet Union?
I'm not promoting military intervention by the US.
I'm saying that the NATO issue is a diversionary tactic by Russia. Finland isn't going to make Russia target it by trying to join NATO. Russia will target Finland if they want to target Finland. NATO would, however, likely thwart any advance.
Posted on 2/24/22 at 7:53 pm to SlowFlowPro
Would be interesting if Putin was told to leave or anyone who wants it can be given NATO membership 
Hell if you folks want answers as to what he really wants to do just ask Crimea and Ukraine.
And the cautionary tale of 'don't provoke Russia they may invade' was thrown out the window by Putin himself.
Hell if you folks want answers as to what he really wants to do just ask Crimea and Ukraine.
And the cautionary tale of 'don't provoke Russia they may invade' was thrown out the window by Putin himself.
Posted on 2/24/22 at 8:07 pm to Pettifogger
People don't seem to know or want to talk about this but Ukraine was not getting into NATO because a lot of NATO countries did not want to agitate Russia.
I would not be surprised if the same NATO countries do not quietly make sure Finland does not get into NATO. In that respect, it really doesn't matter what the Finns want to do.
And NATO countries are not going to start spending more on defense. They don't believe in it. Instead, look for them to count on, and probably get, more US protection.
All that being said, Finland has a good military. Their air force is legit and there is an outdoor culture in Finland that is ingrained in the people. There is a lot of outdoor sport and shooting for sport. Hunting is present too. And they gave the Russians hell in past conflict.
I would not be surprised if the same NATO countries do not quietly make sure Finland does not get into NATO. In that respect, it really doesn't matter what the Finns want to do.
And NATO countries are not going to start spending more on defense. They don't believe in it. Instead, look for them to count on, and probably get, more US protection.
All that being said, Finland has a good military. Their air force is legit and there is an outdoor culture in Finland that is ingrained in the people. There is a lot of outdoor sport and shooting for sport. Hunting is present too. And they gave the Russians hell in past conflict.
Posted on 2/24/22 at 8:10 pm to j1897
Another country that won’t pay their share
Posted on 2/24/22 at 8:15 pm to MillerLiteTime
Putin might want that but he doesn’t have the goods to pull it off. Most of y’all way overestimate their military strength.
Posted on 2/24/22 at 8:17 pm to SlowFlowPro
Russia has no reason to be aggressive to Finland. Putin is a lot of things, but he is not unreasonable.
Posted on 2/24/22 at 8:24 pm to keakar
quote:
ok, so they will now vote to let a country that no longer exists into nato.
She is talking about the vote of Finland for Finland to join NATO.
Posted on 2/24/22 at 8:29 pm to SlowFlowPro
The blue swastika made the reds pay.
Posted on 2/24/22 at 8:37 pm to cokebottleag
quote:
Russia has no reason to be aggressive to Finland
Same applies to Ukraine
Posted on 2/24/22 at 8:41 pm to LuckyTiger
quote:
And NATO countries are not going to start spending more on defense. They don't believe in it. Instead, look for them to count on, and probably get, more US protection.
This is where the problem is.
The Euro countries look at NATO as the US protecting them.
Posted on 2/24/22 at 9:08 pm to Smokeyone
quote:
You know china owns Nokia and uses Finnish electronics companies as shells to sell their products where made in china is a liability right? And the Finlands other major export is oil that is also controlled by China.
Finland has no oil... Not one single field... Doh...
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