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Started By
Message
re: FCC to free Internet From Obama's “Net Neutrality” Rules
Posted on 11/21/17 at 1:30 pm to Dirtman16
Posted on 11/21/17 at 1:30 pm to Dirtman16
quote:
How exactly? We can't make more at some point?
No, I meant the physical ability to keep bundling it. You can run out of space to run the increased fiber count. Especially when we're talking outside plant situations due the increased physical protection required.
quote:
I'd be lying if I said I knew the intricacies of fiber technology, but I do know that light is fast. Like universal speed limit fast.
Light is fast and nearly without limit. But the physical ability to pulse it is not.
This post was edited on 11/21/17 at 1:31 pm
1
Posted on 11/21/17 at 1:34 pm to OMLandshark
quote:
Remind me where the competition is with 6 media companies buying themselves and their competition out, to where the end of it is inevitably Buy-N-Large from WALL-E?
Don't we already have monopoly and anti-trust laws?
Posted on 11/21/17 at 1:34 pm to Centinel
quote:No it doesn't, especially not after you get throttled after running out of the tiny data cap.
No it's not. It's still fits the criteria of a broadband ISP.
quote:But, you know, I can drive down the street to the next car dealership. I can't just move my house into another ISP's service area.
There isn't one car company. Just like there isn't one ISP.
quote:No shite. You're not answering the question.
Electricity is not an ISP.
quote:And I can transmit data via smoke signals, too. I fail to see your point.
You want to have a discussion about quality of service, that's fine. But that's irrelevant to the discussion of monopolies.
1s and 0s still travel, no matter if you're using wireless, satellite, fiber, or copper.
My point is simple: current-gen satellite internet, as well as cell service, do not at all compete with cable and fiber internet. The data caps are too small, and the overage fees too high, for them to even be in the same discussion. If I can't stream one hour of TV per day without incurring additional fees, then my ISP is not a competitor to cable internet.
Posted on 11/21/17 at 1:34 pm to bonhoeffer45
Red Herring argument?? which would that be?
My arguments are about restrictions to competition that exists today and cannot be denied and should be ended. Yours are about creating a government bureaucracy for problems that might arise.
Study up on the powers the FCC have once they decide to regulate an industry as a utility. You might be interested in their censorship powers and their industry specification powers ect. I am sure since you have been in support of these powers on TD they will call you up and get your feedback.
My arguments are about restrictions to competition that exists today and cannot be denied and should be ended. Yours are about creating a government bureaucracy for problems that might arise.
Study up on the powers the FCC have once they decide to regulate an industry as a utility. You might be interested in their censorship powers and their industry specification powers ect. I am sure since you have been in support of these powers on TD they will call you up and get your feedback.
This post was edited on 11/21/17 at 1:40 pm
Posted on 11/21/17 at 1:39 pm to Centinel
We've already exceeded what would be the limits of the pulsing. These signals are now multiplexed through a variety of means which results in a quantum leap each time a new method of multiplexing is introduced.
Wavelength Division Multiplexing
Phase-shift Keying
Wavelength Division Multiplexing
Phase-shift Keying
This post was edited on 11/21/17 at 1:45 pm
Posted on 11/21/17 at 1:39 pm to bonhoeffer45
quote:
How the frick are you so thick headed you don’t feel ashamed for making this argument while knighting for the dismantling of the neutral conditions that made that market space possible in the first place?
Nothing the federal government has done has made these things possible.
You are really reaching.
If shark doesn't believe there has been a proliferation of lower cost media than the big 6 companies have provided he is just blind.
Posted on 11/21/17 at 1:39 pm to Korkstand
quote:
No it doesn't, especially not after you get throttled after running out of the tiny data cap.
Where in the FCC definition of broadband ISP does it mention full speed at all times the entire time?
quote:
But, you know, I can drive down the street to the next car dealership. I can't just move my house into another ISP's service area.
You don't have access to just one ISP. Hughes covers the entire lower 48. I guarantee you have Verizon and TMobile coverage, if not more.
quote:
No shite. You're not answering the question.
Your question had nothing to do with the subject at hand.
quote:
And I can transmit data via smoke signals, too. I fail to see your point.
You can transmit IP packets via smoke signal? Impressive.
quote:
My point is simple: current-gen satellite internet, as well as cell service, do not at all compete with cable and fiber internet.
And a Honda doesn't compete with a Ferrari, but they'll both get you to work.
quote:
If I can't stream one hour of TV per day without incurring additional fees, then my ISP is not a competitor to cable internet.
This is your subjective requirement. And it's irrelevant.
Posted on 11/21/17 at 1:41 pm to I B Freeman
quote:As you "pointed out" by simply stating it?
As I pointed out ISP services are more profitable than content delivery services.
No link, no data, no nothing... in I B Freeman's world he can just say something and say you're wrong if you don't agree or believe him. quote:And here I was thinking they'd prefer to have your business in BOTH. How silly of me!
Charter, I suspect, would MUCH rather your ISP business than your TV business.
quote:So? That's the way it should work, at least. With no net neutrality rules, they will be allowed to sell you shite they didn't even pay for! Actually, they'll be able to sell you shite that they already got paid to acquire!
They have to pay for content and resell it to you.
quote:I'm more than sure they want you to pay them for any and everything they can get you to pay for. At the end of the day.
At the end of the day they want you to use them for ISP services more so than for content services.
quote:Real world experience has proven otherwise. Multiple ISPs have been caught throttling Netflix in the past. Given the A-OK from the government, you don't think they'll do it again?
They are not going to cause you to have bad experiences with NetFlix because of their ISP service.
Posted on 11/21/17 at 1:43 pm to biggsc
quote:
Didn't know this thread would go 7 pages
the last one went 30
Posted on 11/21/17 at 1:43 pm to Centinel
quote:
Except that I can still get 1s and 0s transmitted to me via satellite or mobile.
So no, internet access is not a utility.
And like I said earlier when you ignored my question:
I claim that my electric company is not a utility because I can install solar panels.
See how that works? Now knock it off with this bullshite argument.
Posted on 11/21/17 at 1:43 pm to I B Freeman
quote:
Red Herring argument?? which would that be?
My arguments about restrictions to competition that exists today and cannot be denied and should be ended. Yours are about creating a government bureaucracy for problems that might arise
A red herring is simply presenting a point or argument that itself may be true, like the need to repeal crony state laws that prevent completion or municipal broadband investments, as an answer to an unrelated question of discussion.
I.E. the present day need for maintaining neutrality on the internet given the reality we currently live in, not the one we hope to have eventually.
quote:
Study up on the powers the FCC have once they decide to regulate an industry as a utility. You might be interested in their censorship powers and their industry specification powers ect. I am sure since you have been in support of these powers on TD they will call you up and get your feedback
Makes appeals to phantom demons that have not come from net neutrality regulation, knights for legislation that let oligopoly ISP’s collect your data and sell it without consent.
Once again, I implore you to retrace your steps because you lost the plot a long time ago and your are simply floundering now.
This post was edited on 11/21/17 at 1:48 pm
Posted on 11/21/17 at 1:43 pm to biggsc
Posted on 11/21/17 at 1:45 pm to I B Freeman
quote:
problems that might arise.
Datacaps and throttling are already here. There is no MIGHT about it.
Posted on 11/21/17 at 1:45 pm to jawnybnsc
quote:
We've already exceeded what would be the limits of the pulsing. These signals are now multiplexed through a variety of means which results in a quantum leap each time a new method of multiplexing is introduced.
Yes, I know. Just like modulation improvements on the wireless side.
I was speaking to the base physical limitations of fiber in terms of them existing because they other guy brought up the physical limitations of wireless.
I didn't go in to every detail of the tech because I assumed that you two would understand what I was getting at based on your previous responses.
Posted on 11/21/17 at 1:47 pm to I B Freeman
quote:
Nothing the federal government has done has made these things possible
LINK
You might have lost the plot a lot further back than I thought. It’s gonna be quite the March for you I fear.
Posted on 11/21/17 at 1:47 pm to Centinel
So, yes . . . the potential is not infinite, but we are nowhere near the limits now AND we are still expanding the horizon.
Posted on 11/21/17 at 1:49 pm to bonhoeffer45
quote:
Countries have made this work. Like England. But it requires a mix of consumer focused government intervention and investment(like municipal broadband) all built on consumer focused regulation. Which you are also aghast and against. Since in England where competition is strong and options plenty, they also enforce net neutrality laws and even enforce price caps in some areas where competition is not as robust.
From personal experience, the UK its all up to that ISP if they want to offer a service in the area. Since the infrastructure for the most part is shared, most ISPs jumping almost all areas. My ISP had their own infrastructure and I had fiber right to my door. The price point was amazing. 100 down fiber to the door for around $30 a month. No one has data caps.
Also a prime example of new companies entering the game and changing the market. ISPs in the UK would charge a line rental fee to your bill every month. They tried to claim it was bc you had a land line and you had fight to get it removed if you didn't use a landline. So Vodafone decided to enter the ISP game and said no line rental charges. With in I shite you not two months all major ISPs had removed line rental charges, saying some people around $15 a month in extra fees.
This post was edited on 11/21/17 at 1:51 pm
Posted on 11/21/17 at 1:49 pm to SG_Geaux
I have no clue why people think Comcast and AT&T won’t have a giant cock down most American’s throats after this.
Most Americans have 2 or fewer options for high speed Internet. That’s a free market to some people though.
Most Americans have 2 or fewer options for high speed Internet. That’s a free market to some people though.
Posted on 11/21/17 at 1:50 pm to Korkstand
quote:
I claim that my electric company is not a utility because I can install solar panels.
Your local power company is a utility because they are the only provider of consistent grid power you can purchase in your area.
I can set up a point to point network with my neighbor but that doesn't make me an ISP.
And setting up a generator or using solar panels doesn't make you a power company.
Posted on 11/21/17 at 1:50 pm to bonhoeffer45
This tired argument again? Because government researchers invented the internet, the possibility that it could have come into being in any other way is precluded. That's brilliant. Really.
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