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re: Chile voted out Pinochet’s constitution 78%-21%

Posted on 10/26/20 at 11:16 am to
Posted by RollTide4Ever
Nashville
Member since Nov 2006
18324 posts
Posted on 10/26/20 at 11:16 am to
This proves the cold war was futile and folks like Murray Rothbard were correct. If I'm Chilean, Uruguay is more appealing at this point.

Democracy is a horrible system.
Posted by RollTide4Ever
Nashville
Member since Nov 2006
18324 posts
Posted on 10/26/20 at 11:23 am to
I think the US breaks up at that point.
Posted by IceTiger
Really hot place
Member since Oct 2007
26584 posts
Posted on 10/26/20 at 11:29 am to
quote:


Democracy is a horrible system.


It's terrible at protecting the individual
Posted by Penrod
Member since Jan 2011
39703 posts
Posted on 10/26/20 at 11:33 am to
quote:

His "economic miracle" influenced many western countries including the U.S.

It was the other way around. Pinochet’s economic miracle was engineered by the University of Chicago School of Economics led by Milton Friedman.
Posted by Fat Bastard
coach, investor, gambler
Member since Mar 2009
73210 posts
Posted on 10/26/20 at 11:33 am to
quote:

Did what he had to do in the cold war struggle.


yep. OP is too dumb to get it. cold war was fought through proxies and removing communist/socialits government threats or the threat of such all over from iran(tudeh party)/afghanistan(soviet occupation) to central and south america (guatemala, nicargua, el salvador, chile etc.

Posted by Penrod
Member since Jan 2011
39703 posts
Posted on 10/26/20 at 11:36 am to
quote:

I am guessing the 78% of Chileans doing what they want for their country to erase the years of a brutal and corrupt dictatorship aren't taking enough account what American Pinochet supporters think.

This is not some new cycle we have to evaluate; they are starting down a path similar to that which was followed by Chavez/Madura, Allende, and Castro. It’s a path to capital flight and abject penury.
Posted by Penrod
Member since Jan 2011
39703 posts
Posted on 10/26/20 at 11:38 am to
quote:

And I say that as an ethnic Slav.

I would never have read your treatise had I know you were a dirty slav!
Posted by crazy4lsu
Member since May 2005
36311 posts
Posted on 10/26/20 at 11:53 am to
People are reading quite a lot into this (i.e. it is Marxists) when a constitutional referendum was always likely because of the way the 1980 constitution was ratified. Not only that, the Pinochet regime violated the constitution it drafted numerous times, undermining the entire exercise other than to ensure that Pinochet remained in power. Otherwise the document itself is quite further left than what one would expect for a "right-wing" government, as it codifies the right to education until I believe people are 21, the right to health protection, the right to live in a clean environment, and the right to social security.

My expectation is that things like Article 19-1, which explicitly protects the rights of the unborn, which lead to the most restrictive policies toward abortion in the entire world, will be amended. From the demographic perspective, that restrictive abortion policy did not counter the downward trend of Chile's TFR; my expectation is that the country's elite might try to offer direct payments of some type to try to increase the birth rate. I do not think the neoliberal regime developed in the 90's (or rather continued and built upon by Aylwin) will be dismantled, as the growth from the end of Pinochet's reign to now has been twice the growth that Chile saw from 73-90. I expect some presidential authority will be stripped and given to legislative bodies, as well as possibly some written protections for the Mapauche.
This post was edited on 10/26/20 at 11:54 am
Posted by RollTide4Ever
Nashville
Member since Nov 2006
18324 posts
Posted on 10/26/20 at 12:33 pm to
Only saving grace is Chile doesn't have oil for some enterprising populist to utilize for free lunches.
Posted by Wtodd
Tampa, FL
Member since Oct 2013
67506 posts
Posted on 10/26/20 at 12:36 pm to
quote:

What did the polls say?

Hillary and Biden both up big
Posted by RD Dawg
Atlanta
Member since Sep 2012
27305 posts
Posted on 10/26/20 at 3:05 pm to
quote:

was the other way around. Pinochet’s economic miracle was engineered by the University of Chicago School of Economics led by Milton Friedman


But Pinochet and Chile actually implemented his policies in real practice. LINK

quote:

The first country in the world to make that momentous break with the past—away from socialism and extreme state capitalism toward more market-oriented structures and policies—was not Deng Xiaoping’s China or Margaret Thatcher’s Britain in the late 1970s, Ronald Reagan’s United States in 1981, or any other country in Latin America or elsewhere. It was Pinochet’s Chile in 1975.
Posted by RD Dawg
Atlanta
Member since Sep 2012
27305 posts
Posted on 10/26/20 at 3:19 pm to
quote:

Remember, Allende was democratically elected


This is a dubious claim at best but unfortunately taught in our worthless public school text books LINK

quote:

In 1970, Allende won 36.2 percent of the popular vote, less than the 38.6 percent he had taken in 1964 and only 1.3 percent more than the runner-up. According to the constitution, the legislature could have given the presidency to either of the top two candidates. It chose Allende only after he pledged explicitly to abide by the constitution. “A few months later,” Whelan reports, “Allende told fellow leftist Regis Debray that he never actually intended to abide by those commitments but signed just to finally become president.” In legislative and other elections over the next three years, Allende and his Popular Unity (UP) coalition, dominated by the Communist and Socialist parties, never won a majority, much less a mandate
Posted by momentoftruth87
Member since Oct 2013
71687 posts
Posted on 10/26/20 at 3:20 pm to
quote:

Just last week, the socialist party won in Bolivia in an election with 88% turnout


RIP
Posted by RollTide4Ever
Nashville
Member since Nov 2006
18324 posts
Posted on 10/26/20 at 3:40 pm to
Who knows, I've seen socialists do pro market reforms. People forget that socialist still has a cache to it in that part of the world the way conservative does in America.
Posted by chalmetteowl
Chalmette
Member since Jan 2008
47834 posts
Posted on 10/26/20 at 6:59 pm to
quote:




RIP
you could just say they’re fading into Bolivian
Posted by the808bass
The Lou
Member since Oct 2012
111617 posts
Posted on 10/26/20 at 7:01 pm to
You’re skipping over the fact that the protests which have led to the call for reform are centered around economic inequality.
Posted by Auburn1968
NYC
Member since Mar 2019
19720 posts
Posted on 10/26/20 at 7:08 pm to
They want to be more like Venezuela?



Or maybe the good old USSR?



If Russians of the Soviet era saw long line they would join it not knowing what was at the other end because whatever it was, it was something they needed.

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