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re: Argument shifts of the left

Posted on 12/17/18 at 2:36 pm to
Posted by AggieHank86
Texas
Member since Sep 2013
44345 posts
Posted on 12/17/18 at 2:36 pm to
quote:

quote:

AggieHank86
Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez.. is this you??
And within only a handful of posts, someone obligingly demonstrates the point for me.

Not a mindless Trump supporter? Must be a socialist.

It is almost too predictable to still be funny ... but not quite.
Posted by ShortyRob
Member since Oct 2008
82116 posts
Posted on 12/17/18 at 2:36 pm to
quote:

I certainly agree that I am hostile to those who seem to think that the man can do no wrong
The problem I see is that you seem to assume that anyone defending him on anything falls into this camp. It's sort of a self-fulfilling view.
quote:

Bandit and Shorty are just two examples of Trump supporters with whom I have NEVER had a cross word

Now, I like to pat myself on the back here and there, but I feel relatively confident we've had a cross word or two.
Posted by AggieHank86
Texas
Member since Sep 2013
44345 posts
Posted on 12/17/18 at 2:44 pm to
quote:

The problem I see is that you seem to assume that anyone defending him on anything falls into this camp. It's sort of a self-fulfilling view
Maybe. But the posters toward whom I am most-hostile are uniformly the type of posters who start threads about getting on their knees at bedtime to thank God and Baby Jesus for sending us Donald J. Trump.
quote:

I like to pat myself on the back here and there, but I feel relatively confident we've had a cross word or two.
We have certainly disagreed, but I do not recall either of us ever being rude about it.
Posted by 93and99
Dayton , Oh / Allentown , Pa
Member since Dec 2018
14400 posts
Posted on 12/17/18 at 2:46 pm to
quote:

I don't associate myself with any group other than, "American".


If you have ever voted for a Democrat you are anti-American.
Posted by TbirdSpur2010
ALAMO CITY
Member since Dec 2010
134141 posts
Posted on 12/17/18 at 2:52 pm to
quote:

you bend over backwards to be contrarian on anything Trump-related

Someone has to do it


No. No one "has to do it." That's as silly as the folks on here who think Trump walks on water.

quote:

I give Trump props on something or agree with something he is doing.


Yes, at a MUCH lower rate than someone who contends libertarians agree with the right as much as they disagree. That's what I'm saying. You've regularly been busting out inane drivel like "trumpettes" for crying out loud. Come off it.

quote:

I certainly agree that I am hostile to those who seem to think that the man can do no wrong


I'm hardly in that camp, but you are hostile to Trump supporters across the board as a rule, not an exception.

quote:

Blind sycophancy annoys me as much among GOP voters as among Dems (who were just as bad about Obama).


On this we most certainly agree.

quote:

I find it highly entertaining to see that the posters who deride blind adherence to Dem dogma are UNIFORMLY the worst about blind adherence to "conservative" dogma.


I have no problem with calling out hypocrisy on both sides of the aisle in that regard. I'm calling you out for yours as well, though, sir.

quote:

This is always entertaining to me


Yes, I'm sure it's great sport. We're all just blowing hot air on here at the end of the day. But you're a bit of a charlatan when it comes to the "I'm just a right of center libertarian" guy, and people see through that as easily as you see through the dogma-dedicated on the right and the left.

You keep doing you, though. No skin off my nose either way
Posted by ShortyRob
Member since Oct 2008
82116 posts
Posted on 12/17/18 at 2:57 pm to
quote:

No. No one "has to do it." That's as silly as the folks on here who think Trump walks on water.

Yeah. Agreed. It turns in to just playing a role.

If you see me type something, you can take it to the bank that it's because it's a position I hold. I don't oppose anyone just to oppose them. I don't hold a position today because Trump holds it or because Hillary didn't. I see no point in posting for effect unless it's to derail one of these frickers on the board who set out to set fire to threads they don't like.

quote:

Yes, at a MUCH lower rate than someone who contends libertarians agree with the right as much as they disagree. That's what I'm saying.
Honestly Hank, you probably have to agree this is the case.

There do seem to be a few people on here who have this attitude of, "there's a bunch of conservatives here, so, I need to be contrary".

I honestly don't understand that because it always comes off as non-genuine. Just talk about what interests you and take positions you believe in. There's no crime in agreeing with most people........or disagreeing with them. But filtering it to ensure a particular weighting seems silly to me.
Posted by TbirdSpur2010
ALAMO CITY
Member since Dec 2010
134141 posts
Posted on 12/17/18 at 3:18 pm to
quote:

I honestly don't understand that because it always comes off as non-genuine. Just talk about what interests you and take positions you believe in. There's no crime in agreeing with most people........or disagreeing with them. But filtering it to ensure a particular weighting seems silly to me.


Exactly. That's the reason I never look at upvotes or downvotes on my own posts. Just speak my mind and let the chips fall where they may. The same folks who are my allies in a thread about abortion may be diametrically opposed to me when it comes to civil war discussion.

I don't feel the need to "balance" out the board or just be different for the sake of being different.
Posted by Vacherie Saint
Member since Aug 2015
47544 posts
Posted on 12/17/18 at 3:23 pm to
The dude made a completely valid observation of a popular and effective narrative management tactic of the left. He used the example of trans-rights, which may very well be the looniest position of the modern SJW - a position most libertarians make fun of more than conservatives do.

And you ran here like a moth to a flame to remind us that "both sides do this", which is the level 1 excuse for the left's assholery. Notice you are the only "libertarian" here scolding the OP for daring to criticize the left.
Posted by AggieHank86
Texas
Member since Sep 2013
44345 posts
Posted on 12/17/18 at 4:41 pm to
Shorty, I think what we have here is a bit of a hybrid situation.

I can honestly say that I have never argued a position that is not actually a position I hold, but I certainly admit that it would be fair to say that my… tone… varies significantly, dependent upon the identity of the poster with whom I am interacting.

With you or other posters who have never been rude to me, I am always polite. With the posters that follow me around and call me names, simply because they disagree with my last-conservative views, I certainly admit to being a bit .... confrontational.
Posted by AggieHank86
Texas
Member since Sep 2013
44345 posts
Posted on 12/17/18 at 4:51 pm to
quote:

The dude made a completely valid observation of a popular and effective narrative management tactic of the left.
But that is not what he did
quote:

A lesson that hardly anyone on the right ever seems to learn is is how the left operates and frames arguments. The second they achieve any stated goal they instantly move the goal line and begin the struggle anew.
implicit in those two sentences is the assumption that only “the left“ engages in such behavior… A proposition which is entirely false.

I called out his hypocrisy. Perhaps I did so and more strident terms that I would’ve done with a poster who is not routinely rude to me, but I did nothing other than what is previously been discussed in the last few posts

you gentlemen have given me some things to think about, and I do think that I will try to be somewhat less… confrontational … In my writing style. But I am cofident that it will not be reciprocated.
This post was edited on 12/17/18 at 5:31 pm
Posted by ShortyRob
Member since Oct 2008
82116 posts
Posted on 12/17/18 at 5:35 pm to
quote:

implicit in those two sentences is the assumption that only “the left“ engages in such behavior… A proposition which is entirely false.


Well, I think it's not actually false "entirely" and here's why.

If you think of government as ranging from zero government and moving towards more and more government, you realize that you sort of have the math infinity problem.

Namely, at the one end(approaching no govt), the increments get smaller and smaller because there's a floor. ZERO government.

At the other end, there is no ceiling. And, given that there are exceedingly few people who are pure anarchist...…..you then realize that the space between no govt and where a small c conservative would like to be...……..or...……..the space between current govt and where a small c conservative wants to be is MUUUUUUUCH smaller than the space between where we are now and where a continually expanding govt with no limits can go.
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