re: Arbery case - Father and Son perspective

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And if he yanks it from you and kills you then what?

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Well he’d have to be a monster for that to happen (I am former D-1 wrestler, Marine Infantry Officer and describing me as “big” would be an understatement)

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Yea, I'm not saying they were hunting him down with intent to kill, but when you fire a shot before the victim actually makes physical contact with you, it does show that you had a bit of an itchy trigger finger.

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Damn, I didn’t know he fired before they started wrestling for the shotgun.

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Damn, I didn’t know he fired before they started wrestling for the shotgun.

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You can't see it because they're in front of the truck, but Arbery makes a turn and heads towards the shooter quickly, but it's fairly clear that the shot is fired just before any contact is made.

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You have guns, they don’t, they’ll have to listen.

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They'll have to listen you say? They don't always listen, as my retired Sheriff Deputy friend told me once. His budddy on patrol was shot in the face by a turd during a routine traffic stop. He survived but is disfigured.

Travis McMichael is lucky he was able to wrestle that shotgun away from the deceased Mr. Arbery, and he's lucky that first shot discharged in the palm of Arbery's hand. I imagine that cluster of BB's stunned Mr. Arbery really good. Hummm? Maybe Travis had Number 2 Buckshot? Anyway it stunned the deceased enough so that Travis could gain a slight edge.

You pussies out there have no idea what it's like to face a a criminal in a life or death struggle.

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Damn, I didn’t know he fired before they started wrestling for the shotgun.

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Actually, he did, watch it again, there are 3 shots, at best the 1st goes off AS Arbery turns toward Travis...

Murder

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Multiple vids of this "jogger" (w/ vioIent criminal & mental records) trespassing at property. He's caught again, so they pursue. He flees.

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The first problem is that your very general timeline is full of holes.

1. When they began pursuing him the McMicheals had no idea about the trespass. All they knew was that someone resembling a person they believed to be breaking into homes (description of "black male") was running ("hauling arse down the road" was the quote from the police report) down the street.

2. According to Gregory McMicheal's statement (he's the father and the one who had worked for the DA's office), he saw Arbery running down the street. His response was to tell Travis (the ex-cop and son) about the runner then grab his .357 while Travis grabbed his shotgun.

3. Also according to the statement they tried to block Arbery off once, but he turned and ran "back the direction from which he came".

4. The next confrontation was when the video picks up. Travis McMicheal is outside the driver's door with his shotgun, his father is in the bed of the truck. Travis is already out before Arbery (now being tailed by the videographer) arrives.

5. Arbery sees Travis, Arbery then shifts to go around the opposite (passenger's) side of the truck. This is an attempt to avoid.

6. Travis moves to push the confrontation by moving toward Arbery.

7. Arbery changes course and physically confronts Travis as he tries to take the shotgun from him.

8. During the scuffle, Travis shoots twice and kills Arbery.

That's the totality of the event. Interestingly enough though when you look at the map of the area and try to replay events per McMicheal's statements, the geographics of it are impossible.

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Do you call the cops and hope this fugitive

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He's not a fugitive at this point. At most the McMicheals think he looks like someone they believe has been breaking into homes. Under Georgia law that's not enough to confront someone under scenario of citizen's arrest.

But yes, you call the cops regardless of anything else. What did the McMicheals not do? Call the cops.

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The guns were supposed to make sure things go smoothly, honestly.

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Travis was brandishing his firearm. That rarely works at making things go more smoothly in a situation where you are trying to stop someone who appears to be fleeing.

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The other explanation is guns were brought to better facilitate the murder that was intended.

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Which is just as ridiculous as the stance that Arbery was the aggressor.

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Except all other evidence (jogger running toward truck, cops called, not taking shot until hands are on rifle/punching in the face)

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So much wrong here...

Arbery was only "running toward" the truck because they had purposely placed themselves in his way. Twice, if the report is to be believed.

You completely omit that the McMicheals created the confrontation.

The cops were not called until after the shooting.


Damn dude. Just.... damn.

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This is a point the pro-jogger people are especially struggling with.They keep saying “why would you bring a gun???”

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Negative. Given the dichotomy of rationale you laid out, the question remains “why would you get out of the truck???”

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There’s laws on a citizen’s use of deadly force. They can be on the phone with Chief Justice John Roberts and it would mean nothing.

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I’m talking about intent and you’re talking about how citizens arrest works.