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Started By
Message
re: Aereo: How can anyone argue this is anything other than theft?
Posted on 4/22/14 at 1:30 pm to Taxing Authority
Posted on 4/22/14 at 1:30 pm to Taxing Authority
quote:
Not at all. The DVR is allowed by agreement. Totally different animal.
Actually, the case relied upon by the 2nd Circuit presently was a suit about DVRs.
1
Posted on 4/22/14 at 1:40 pm to BBONDS25
People still arguing are just doing it for the sport. We are all positive the Aereo has lawyers who know way more than any and all of us combined. They will be found perfectly legal. Why the networks have sand in their pussies about this is surprising to me.
Networks obviously only want the free signal to be used one way, not at the convenience of the consumer...too bad!
Networks obviously only want the free signal to be used one way, not at the convenience of the consumer...too bad!
Posted on 4/22/14 at 1:54 pm to GeeOH
quote:
Why the networks have sand in their pussies about this is surprising to me.
Perhaps, the networks have lawyers who know way more than us also.
The networks/cable companies pay for the content to be produced. Aereo doesn't. I think it's pretty straight-forward. What do you think will happen to the content if the content providers aren't getting paid?
quote:
People still arguing are just doing it for the sport.
I thought that about you the whole time.
Posted on 4/22/14 at 1:55 pm to GeeOH
quote:
Why the networks have sand in their pussies about this is surprising to me.
it's because this opens up a whole new world for streaming and destroys their hard work with DMCA and SOPA and PIPA to regulate the web.
freedom baby...it always wins.
Posted on 4/22/14 at 1:58 pm to BBONDS25
quote:
Aereo characterizes itself as a technology platform, rather than a service, and argues that it is not liable because it is the user, rather than Aereo, that controls the operation of Aereo's system and "makes" the performances at issue.
Isn't this the napster defense?
Posted on 4/22/14 at 2:05 pm to BBONDS25
quote:Thanks for that!
I gotta go with Aero here. The Second Circuit opinion explains it pretty well.
That's a very different argument than presented here. I don't think there is a problem with the DVR conceptually as a first use. I agree with most of that opinion. But the argument is too narrow.
There are other questions.
Who is liable to the performers, writers, and copyright holders?
When licensing a work for TV, this use is not included. And including it... would conceivably cost broadcaster a lot of money. Does the originating broadcaster now become liable for those fees, even though they don't provide the service? Clearly the copyright holders could (and will) hold them to liable. How does Aereo reconcile there liability?
Secondly, how does the venue issue work? For instance I cannot show the Super Bowl on a giant screen, then say "patrons are paying for to sit in my chairs, not the Super Bowl".
It would seem to me Aereo is providing a venue to view content, otherwise not available to its users.
This post was edited on 4/22/14 at 2:11 pm
Posted on 4/22/14 at 2:09 pm to CptBengal
quote:I'm all for more diversity. I've probably got more reason to hate big media companies than anyone else here. (long story).
freedom baby...it always wins.
But... I also support the freedom of copyright holders to choose how their work is used. There is a reason it was included in the Constitution.
Posted on 4/22/14 at 2:11 pm to Taxing Authority
quote:
econdly, how does the venue issue work? For instance I cannot show the Super Bowl on a giant screen, then say "patrons are paying for to sit in my chairs, not the Super Bowl".
It would seem to me Aereo is providing a venue to view content, otherwise not available to its users.
no they arent. You are providing YOUR own screen, and PROVIDING your OWN antennae, and providing YOUR own dvr.
to tongue in cheek mock your argument from earlier...who would buy their service from them, they dont offer a screen to watch it on!
Posted on 4/22/14 at 2:14 pm to a want
quote:
Isn't this the napster defense?
Its the Cablevision defense. And it appears to be working.
Posted on 4/22/14 at 2:15 pm to Taxing Authority
quote:
I also support the freedom of copyright holders to choose how their work is used.
they have chosen.
They chose to broadcast it freely, and openly over the air.
Posted on 4/22/14 at 2:15 pm to CptBengal
Another area that helps there argument is that it is geo locked.
Posted on 4/22/14 at 2:15 pm to CptBengal
quote:Sure. Just as the theatre only provides the SuperBowl for your own eyes.
no they arent. You are providing YOUR own screen, and PROVIDING your OWN antennae, and providing YOUR own dvr.
quote:You're arguing delivery method. I'm arguing content. Two different things.
to tongue in cheek mock your argument from earlier...who would buy their service from them, they dont offer a screen to watch it on!
Posted on 4/22/14 at 2:17 pm to Taxing Authority
quote:
But the argument is too narrow.
Agreed...but I didn't want to get into the procedural issues. It is also a preliminary injunction that is being ruled upon. Higher standard than normal. If the supreme court rules in favor of aero on the injunction issue...the suit will continue.
Posted on 4/22/14 at 2:18 pm to CptBengal
quote:
They chose to broadcast it freely, and openly over the air.
That will change if they don't Win. This case will change the market!
Posted on 4/22/14 at 2:19 pm to CptBengal
quote:Nope. They have agreed to have it broadcast in exchange for a licensing fee. Broadcasting does not include a right to reproduce. Those are two different actions. The second requiring a mechanical license--which broadcasters typically do not possess.
They chose to broadcast it freely, and openly over the air.
This is a bit like saying "well you put it on the internet, so it's Ok to copy it." Not so. Public display never implies right to reproduce.
Posted on 4/22/14 at 2:23 pm to Taxing Authority
quote:
no they arent. You are providing YOUR own screen, and PROVIDING your OWN antennae, and providing YOUR own dvr.
Sure. Just as the theatre only provides the SuperBowl for your own eyes.
but the Super Bowl is the ONLY portion that is copyrighted. Come on man, you're better than that weak argument.
quote:
You're arguing delivery method. I'm arguing content. Two different things.
based on the 2nd court we are talkign delivery method....the content has been freely and openly broadcast. So long as the method doesnt alter the content, as the 2nd said...this is a loser.
Posted on 4/22/14 at 2:26 pm to Taxing Authority
quote:
Broadcasting does not include a right to reproduce
I dont know how else to explain it to you...nobody is reproducing anything. This is no different than me buying a roof of a building, putting up my own antennae and sending the open air transmissions I can freely receive to myself for viewing.
Now, in this instance3, due to my busy schedule, I have hired a maintenance man to care for my antennae. maybe even the building super....
Is that maintenance man now rebroadcasting? No, he isnt.
Posted on 4/22/14 at 2:27 pm to Taxing Authority
quote:But the content IS available to users, FOR FREE. It's just not available on their computers.
It would seem to me Aereo is providing a venue to view content, otherwise not available to its users.
A slingbox will do the same thing this service does, but it requires a network connection in proximity to a cable feed. This does not exist in my house and according to the cable company can not exist (though I doubt that but I can't get them to set it up that way).
So why can't I pay for a service to get me the same functionality as folks who are lucky enough to have network ports in their house that are near their television screens?
This post was edited on 4/22/14 at 2:30 pm
Posted on 4/22/14 at 2:28 pm to Taxing Authority
quote:
This is a bit like saying "well you put it on the internet, so it's Ok to copy it." Not so. Public display never implies right to reproduce.
this isnt what its like it all. There are exceptions to reproduction...but again, NOBODY IS REPRODUCING ANYTHING.
Posted on 4/22/14 at 2:29 pm to CptBengal
Either way, this is beginning of the end of his company. If the networks lose or if they win, they will cease ota signals. They Will offer it themselves via Internet access for a small fee.
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