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re: Bill HB4 by Representative Tony Bacala - relative to the crime of criminal trespass

Posted on 4/27/23 at 4:54 pm to
Posted by OGhunter777
Member since Mar 2012
917 posts
Posted on 4/27/23 at 4:54 pm to
(no message)
This post was edited on 4/27/23 at 5:04 pm
Posted by jcdogfish
Member since Apr 2022
125 posts
Posted on 4/27/23 at 7:07 pm to
2017 Louisiana Laws
Revised Statutes
TITLE 9 - Civil Code-Ancillaries
RS 9:2795 - Limitation of liability of landowner of property used for recreational purposes; property owned by the Department of Wildlife and Fisheries; parks owned by public entities

Liability is limited. Taxes(if you call it taxes) is very low because they use a marshland/wasteland classification. Sometimes 40 cents per acre. The water by statute belongs to the public. It was taken by landowners that dug canals for oil and gas exploration. They have the option to fill in the canals and then it is their land without question. Til then they are stealing the public's water and everything in the water for and charging the public or stopping public access to the resources the public owns. Fill up your canals you dug and the problem is solved. Take the public's assets access should be allowed.
Posted by ForLSU56
Rapides Parish
Member since Feb 2015
5582 posts
Posted on 4/27/23 at 10:30 pm to
quote:

Tony Bacala


One of AP's finest....has come a long way from the shadow Harold Tridico.
Posted by Ron Cheramie
The Cajun Hedgehog
Member since Aug 2016
5645 posts
Posted on 4/28/23 at 4:58 am to
quote:

operating a watercraft on running waters of the state.


Really changes nothing

Doesn’t mention hunting, fishing, trapping

Just says you can traverse it
Posted by Dock Holiday
Member since Sep 2015
2031 posts
Posted on 4/28/23 at 6:22 am to
quote:

running waters of the state


This part will need to be hashed out.
The fact they used "running" instead of "navigable" is curious.
Posted by jcdogfish
Member since Apr 2022
125 posts
Posted on 4/28/23 at 9:57 am to
It at least keeps someone from being a felon and all that goes with that for crossing an invisible line in open water. But the old saying goes...How do you eat an elephant.....One bite at a time For 40 years no one has given a good answer as to why this marshland is classified as wasteland for tax reasons. According to the constitutional convention transcripts from the "70s it started as a move to save family farms. The taxes on the farmland was getting too high due to urban expansion so they proposed a lower tax to keep family farming operation from having to sell out. In typical louisiana fashion, to get it passed the North LA timber companies jumped on with a timber exemption, then not to be outdone, South louisiana added the Marshland/wasteland classification. There is language in the transcripts that fishing and hunting was mentioned in these discussions. So here we are today giving major tax breaks, almost exemptions to corporations around the country that own the marsh now. A good start would be if you don't allow public access over the water bottoms you own you forfeit the marshland classification and pay tax the same way every other taxpayer in the parishes pay it,,tax based on value and assess it properly.
Posted by Icansee4miles
Trolling the Tickfaw
Member since Jan 2007
32261 posts
Posted on 4/28/23 at 9:59 am to
With the expansion by President PotatoHead’s regime of “waters of the US”, this bill could allow environmental nut jobs to run boats up drainages into industrial plant sites and do what whackos do. And the same administration is giving these organizations millions upon millions of dollars right now aimed at disrupting industrial expansion and operations.

It’s obvious what it was aimed at, as posters have noted above, but the Bill needs some serious work.
Posted by jcdogfish
Member since Apr 2022
125 posts
Posted on 4/28/23 at 11:59 am to
If you read through the code of federal regulations that the COE uses and other feds we are already there. Its just not recognized in La.because of a couple (one in particular) court rulings that are totally different situations. Another big issue is the ruling puts a date, I think 1812 as the maps used for navigation which is really silly. But, if using an 1812 map is ok why is not using 1812 rules of commerce? A normal mode of commerce back then was a canoe? Pirogue?. So if you can canoe it it should be open for commerce, hence navigable water. This is a very interesting subject, and I think both sides of it has good arguments.
Posted by SoFla Tideroller
South Florida
Member since Apr 2010
41046 posts
Posted on 4/28/23 at 12:52 pm to
If the taxes are miniscule, then the state should eliminate them. Why are some state residents obligated to pay for land they don't even own? Couldn't we just as easily arbitrarily decide that Big Bill is on the hook to pay taxes for 500 acres valued at $4 or $5/acre? Come on, the amount is miniscule. You should have no reservations about chipping in.
Posted by Dock Holiday
Member since Sep 2015
2031 posts
Posted on 4/28/23 at 12:55 pm to
quote:

jcdogfish


Did you find the word navigable anywhere in HB4? It's an honest question, I have not read the whole thing, so I'm being lazy and defaulting to you.
Posted by jcdogfish
Member since Apr 2022
125 posts
Posted on 4/28/23 at 1:12 pm to
I don't think its anywhere in the original bill. That's probably by design as there is no definition of navigable water in the statutes (or so they say). There is a different section that clearly defines navigable water as just that, water that is navigable but they say that does not apply. Too many lawyers.........
Posted by Dock Holiday
Member since Sep 2015
2031 posts
Posted on 4/28/23 at 1:41 pm to
quote:

I don't think its anywhere in the original bill. That's probably by design


Yup!
Posted by OGhunter777
Member since Mar 2012
917 posts
Posted on 4/28/23 at 1:48 pm to
Highly unlikely that this passes. They postponed until another date that is currently unknown.
Posted by Big Bill
Down da Bayou
Member since Sep 2015
1651 posts
Posted on 4/28/23 at 3:36 pm to
I agree, eliminate them. Your example of 500 acres valued at $4/acre generates about a single dollar of tax revenue based on St Mary Parish present millages.
Posted by jcdogfish
Member since Apr 2022
125 posts
Posted on 4/28/23 at 8:12 pm to
Marshland, timber land and agriculture land is not taxed by the market value, they are taxed @ 15% of the use value.
This post was edited on 4/28/23 at 9:23 pm
Posted by White Bear
Homeless
Member since Jul 2014
17645 posts
Posted on 4/28/23 at 8:34 pm to
quote:

The taxes paid are miniscule with the millages involved. You can't own tidal water. Period. Our friends all along the Gulf Coast recognize this. It's mind boggling a few land owners grease a few pockets and the vast majority gets screwed. But we are talking about Louisiana.
If those riparian owners give in to the state on the erosion, they stand a chance to lose the associated minerals to the state. (Maybe?)
Posted by White Bear
Homeless
Member since Jul 2014
17645 posts
Posted on 4/28/23 at 8:38 pm to
quote:

Marshland, timber land and agriculture land is not taxed by the millages, they are taxed @ 15% of the use value.
Use value ag and timber, horticulture and marsh land, fmv x10% UV x 10% = assessed value x millage = tax due.
Posted by jcdogfish
Member since Apr 2022
125 posts
Posted on 4/28/23 at 9:11 pm to
Rate and basis for assessing property values
The rate used in determining assessed value differs depending on the type of property. The
following types of property are assessed based on fair market value: residential 10%, commercial
15%, and public service 25%. Agricultural, horticultural, marsh and timber lands are assessed
at 15% of use value.

Straight from La gov site...........

The 15% of use value is the assessed value used to calculate the tax due from what we were told, not 10% of FMV. I could be wrong but that's how I remember it explained.
This post was edited on 4/28/23 at 9:20 pm
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