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Started By
Message
re: WSJ: The High-School Juniors With $70,000-a-Year Job Offers
Posted on 5/8/25 at 11:52 am to lsu777
Posted on 5/8/25 at 11:52 am to lsu777
quote:
sure but the definition of a good living is dependent on your POV. IMO anything less than 200k household isnt a good living but my view is skewed.
IMO anything working 12 hour shifts, more than 100 hours of OT a year, not sleeping in my own bed does not provide a good living.
imo a good living is being able to pick my kids up at 3 without having to ask permission at the same time being able to cook and eat breakfast with them daily. Being able to attend school functions during the day, sporting events without having to ask off, putting them to bed every night, not risking my health all while making a minimum of 3x the amount the OP is talking about is a good living imo.
but again my view is skewed as is mingos so our definition is not what much of the OT has. Many on the OT are ok with mediocrity with a 70k a year job and very little chance for advancement.
i have done the trades and am a certified pipefitter and did it for years....the trades fricking suck. All good in march but in the august heat or the january cold all while risking health....frick that.
I agree with pretty much all of that. I personally would not be a welder. My point was that I saw first hand that you do not have to do all of that to make good money. There is not just one type of welding job like most seem to think
As I said, I saw it first hand. My dad started out as a welder, probably not that unsimilar to what these kids in the OP are doing, but for a good company. By the time I was born my parents were set up financially with a house on 30 acres. My dad was involved as a baseball and football coach. Though this biggest thing going against your view is he was gone 2 months out of the year training in Russia and Africa. But he loved it because of the life experiences. His stories from those times are great.
By 40ish he had his own big business with contracts from Haliburton, Celexion, and Baker. For years he took home 500k+. Later sold his business and like I mentioned earlier before retiring he had a cush $70 dollar an hour job. By that point he had close to a million dollar home... all starting out as just a welder.
I have an 20 year old brother in law that I tried to talk out of going into the oil field work until I was blue in the face because he was starting out with a back breaking job instead of going about it in a smarter way. I'm not on here pushing kids into welding instead of college. But a good living, by your definition, can be had, that's just a fact.
2
Posted on 5/8/25 at 11:52 am to iwyLSUiwy
quote:
And even more obtuse saying they make virtually the same thing their entire career.
This is a dirty little fact that no one wants to discuss but it takes a couple of years to get pretty proficient at welding. To get really good at it takes most people another couple of years, say 4 years total. Most people's progress starts to slow considerably after about 5-6 and many never progress much beyond what they could do with 4. Regardless of how good one becomes short of mastering a new technique after about 6-8 years into ones career most people start to lose wages and will actually be making substantially less when they reach retirement age than they were when they were 3-4 years into their career when adjusted for inflation.
US median wages for welders in 1978, 47 years ago so someone just starting that year would be full retirement age now, was around $16,640. That number is now around 51,000. $16,640 in 1978 adjusted for inflation in 2025 is about $78,000. So a welder earning the median income for a welder in the United States 47 years ago is no earning about 65% of what they were earning in 1978. And that is why no one is going in the trades. At that rate someone who goes into the trade in 2025 will be earning the equivalent of what a McDonald's employee earns in 2025 when they reach retirement age.
Ironically a search of Welding Jobs within 100 miles of Baton Rouge that list a salary of $100K a year posted on any job board I can find (indeed, zip, etc) turns up exactly none. It is well understood that every welder in Louisiana is earning $150K but there are no job openings now and have been none posted in the last 10 years on any site I can find....
This post was edited on 5/8/25 at 12:06 pm
Posted on 5/8/25 at 11:56 am to TigersHuskers
quote:
Yea having a good paying union job
Why did you join a union? Can't hack it on your own two feet?
Posted on 5/8/25 at 12:01 pm to iwyLSUiwy
quote:
I agree with pretty much all of that. I personally would not be a welder. My point was that I saw first hand that you do not have to do all of that to make good money. There is not just one type of welding job like most seem to think
As I said, I saw it first hand. My dad started out as a welder, probably not that unsimilar to what these kids in the OP are doing, but for a good company. By the time I was born my parents were set up financially with a house on 30 acres. My dad was involved as a baseball and football coach. Though this biggest thing going against your view is he was gone 2 months out of the year training in Russia and Africa. But he loved it because of the life experiences. His stories from those times are great.
By 40ish he had his own big business with contracts from Haliburton, Celexion, and Baker. For years he took home 500k+. Later sold his business and like I mentioned earlier before retiring he had a cush $70 dollar an hour job. By that point he had close to a million dollar home... all starting out as just a welder.
I have an 20 year old brother in law that I tried to talk out of going into the oil field work until I was blue in the face because he was starting out with a back breaking job instead of going about it in a smarter way. I'm not on here pushing kids into welding instead of college. But a good living, by your definition, can be had, that's just a fact.
100% it can but you understand that its the exception big time right? just like your dad was and he was going to be successful no matter what. the people that are capable of running an actual business in the trades is less than 1% and something like your dads is less than 0.01% of those in the trades.
to be honest your brother in law has better chance of moving up in the oil business than most in the trades do.
if you are going to go into the trades do instrumentation, but that requires book smarts and school, but provides a lot better chance at advancement.
operations would be much preferred to the trades. but again now that requires at aleast 2 years of school.
Posted on 5/8/25 at 12:04 pm to iwyLSUiwy
quote:
I agree with pretty much all of that. I personally would not be a welder. My point was that I saw first hand that you do not have to do all of that to make good money. There is not just one type of welding job like most seem to think
As I said, I saw it first hand. My dad started out as a welder, probably not that unsimilar to what these kids in the OP are doing, but for a good company. By the time I was born my parents were set up financially with a house on 30 acres. My dad was involved as a baseball and football coach. Though this biggest thing going against your view is he was gone 2 months out of the year training in Russia and Africa. But he loved it because of the life experiences. His stories from those times are great.
By 40ish he had his own big business with contracts from Haliburton, Celexion, and Baker. For years he took home 500k+. Later sold his business and like I mentioned earlier before retiring he had a cush $70 dollar an hour job. By that point he had close to a million dollar home... all starting out as just a welder.
I have an 20 year old brother in law that I tried to talk out of going into the oil field work until I was blue in the face because he was starting out with a back breaking job instead of going about it in a smarter way. I'm not on here pushing kids into welding instead of college. But a good living, by your definition, can be had, that's just a fact.
Curious what you dad thought of his kids going into the trades. I would bet that he dreamed of them getting an education.
I have a GOOD friend, old and decrepit now and living in an assisted living facility where he hardly knows anyone. who dug ditches for a living. From the late 1960s until sometime around 2020 or so he dug ditches for a living. Wore out a Vermeer trencher / backhoe every 12 months for about 50 years. If you saw him in his prime you'd thought he was a homeless person....never drove a truck that wasn't more than about 20 years old, always wore the same dark blue Dickey's pants and shirts....and they were mostly old and stained from digging ditches 'cause the man dug ditches for a living. He also managed to pay cash for 3 kids to earn degrees at UGA, he has a home on Lake Oconee which is probably worth around a million $ and he has about 150 acres he farmed in Athens Clarke County that is probably worth 3-4 million $. He dug ditches for a living, Tried everything he could to keep his kids from doing it....but the youngest son wouldn't listen...broke his Daddy's heart although he worked with him for years and is now digging ditches himself. I know this story first hand, that man dug miles and miles of ditches for me in the 90's and early 2000's....but anyone who suggested that a ditch digger typically makes that kind of money or even 1% of them make that kind of money is simply lying....most of them barely make minimum wage.....
Posted on 5/8/25 at 12:05 pm to GeauxTigers123
STEM types should aim for college and beyond but other types can do better in the trades.
Posted on 5/8/25 at 12:08 pm to JohnnyKilroy
quote:
quote:
Yea having a good paying union job
Why did you join a union? Can't hack it on your own two feet?
Most people join a union to make 175% of their non-union counterparts, have better benefits, working conditions and work for financially viable companies whose sole business model is not low prices and fricking their employees to make ends meet....but who knows what lies in the heart of man?
Posted on 5/8/25 at 12:10 pm to rd280z
quote:
STEM types should aim for college and beyond but other types can do better in the trades.
There is some truth to this however business majors, finance majors, a sizeable host of majors can enable a persons earning a good living without breaking their body.
If a kid is dumb enough to study music theory or dead languages he probably ain't gonna hack it in the trades either.....
Posted on 5/8/25 at 12:11 pm to Mingo Was His NameO
quote:
There’s a lot wrong with it, which is why it shouldn’t be your first choice if possible, no matter how many lies the OT tells. Better than retail or fast food or some shite, absolutely, but nothing to strive for if you have other options
look im all for people going into the trades, especially those that cant hack college or a white collar job, especially when it means less competition for my kids and future grandkids but the ot has got to stop glamourizing it. its always the ones who got shite college degrees and hate their job doing it too
to the above quoted...to be fair a manager as a retail store in the mall was making 75k 20 years ago when i was at LSU and working as an assistant manager. the aisstant manager were making what the median salary of most of the trades in LA and it was in the AC all day. Im sure its much more now. Im sure the managers now make 100k plus...i know they do at wal mart. better benefits than most trades too.
hell bucees pays the GM between 175-225k. Assistant GM is 125k+, food service manager is 150k+ and department managers are like 25-33 an hour plus good benefits.
like mentioned i have worked in the trades....they are fun AF....when you are in your 20s...not so fun when you are 52 in the august heat 85' in the air and trying to turn pipe or weld under a pipe or when crawling in shite water under a house or in an attic in august....that shite sucks.
Posted on 5/8/25 at 12:11 pm to AwgustaDawg
quote:
Most people join a union to make 175% of their non-union counterparts, have better benefits, working conditions and work for financially viable companies whose sole business model is not low prices and fricking their employees to make ends meet....but who knows what lies in the heart of man?
careful baw, you'll get this thing going another 20 pages, and most of it ignorant, uninformed spewings like this thread is already full of
Posted on 5/8/25 at 12:15 pm to lsu777
quote:
100% it can but you understand that its the exception big time right? just like your dad was and he was going to be successful no matter what. the people that are capable of running an actual business in the trades is less than 1% and something like your dads is less than 0.01% of those in the trades.
to be honest your brother in law has better chance of moving up in the oil business than most in the trades do.
if you are going to go into the trades do instrumentation, but that requires book smarts and school, but provides a lot better chance at advancement.
operations would be much preferred to the trades. but again now that requires at aleast 2 years of school.
All that is fair enough. You are right that he is the exception to the rule and could have been successful in a lot of things. Can't tell you how many patents my dad has
I guess I am just a little defensive of that profession because I saw what it provided for our family when I was growing up so people talking down on it bothers me. Similar to how I am with bus drivers. My mom didn't need the job but she drove a special ed bus for 20 years because she liked helping kids in need. The two fights I got into in middle school were because it was kids making fun of a bus driver.
Anyway, it's a good debate.
Posted on 5/8/25 at 12:17 pm to AwgustaDawg
quote:
Curious what you dad thought of his kids going into the trades. I would bet that he dreamed of them getting an education.
I have a GOOD friend, old and decrepit now and living in an assisted living facility where he hardly knows anyone. who dug ditches for a living. From the late 1960s until sometime around 2020 or so he dug ditches for a living. Wore out a Vermeer trencher / backhoe every 12 months for about 50 years. If you saw him in his prime you'd thought he was a homeless person....never drove a truck that wasn't more than about 20 years old, always wore the same dark blue Dickey's pants and shirts....and they were mostly old and stained from digging ditches 'cause the man dug ditches for a living. He also managed to pay cash for 3 kids to earn degrees at UGA, he has a home on Lake Oconee which is probably worth around a million $ and he has about 150 acres he farmed in Athens Clarke County that is probably worth 3-4 million $. He dug ditches for a living, Tried everything he could to keep his kids from doing it....but the youngest son wouldn't listen...broke his Daddy's heart although he worked with him for years and is now digging ditches himself. I know this story first hand, that man dug miles and miles of ditches for me in the 90's and early 2000's....but anyone who suggested that a ditch digger typically makes that kind of money or even 1% of them make that kind of money is simply lying....most of them barely make minimum wage.....
nope you are wrong....90% of the OT who has never been in the trades will tell you that and the ones that have been in them will tell the trades are the greatest and those of us, like me and you, who have done both are just wrong and we have wrong think....
the problem with the OT is they work on a Saturday for like 3 hours doing a project with their hands and they think its awesome and would love to do it all day everyday and they see these articles with inflated salaries, many of which include the overall cost of benefits, and think....man I could do that, my kids should do that.
im at the point of whatever now, just less competition. They can continue to push their boys not to go to college and kill their body, that is on them.
go ask any grandparent that did it for 30-40 years though and they will tell you it would break their heart to see their grandkids going into the trades if they are smart enough to do white collar work.
Posted on 5/8/25 at 12:21 pm to iwyLSUiwy
quote:
All that is fair enough. You are right that he is the exception to the rule and could have been successful in a lot of things. Can't tell you how many patents my dad has
I guess I am just a little defensive of that profession because I saw what it provided for our family when I was growing up so people talking down on it bothers me. Similar to how I am with bus drivers. My mom didn't need the job but she drove a special ed bus for 20 years because she liked helping kids in need. The two fights I got into in middle school were because it was kids making fun of a bus driver.
Anyway, it's a good debate.
all good. to be fair...i worked in the trades...i realized real quick i needed to take my arse back to school and it took meeting a great women that is now my wife to get me to reach my full potential. So im speaking having done both sides
and i can promise if you asked your dad and he was truthful....he would never want you to go into welding or your kids to go into welding. he busted his arse so you and future generations wouldnt need to kill themselves.
good thing is your dad was exceptional so like exceptional people do....he won and figured out a way to make even more without killing himself
you should tell him thank you every chance you get. My dad was similar and i tell him thank you for not accepting me just being whatever and pushing me wiht the help of my now wife.
:cheers:Posted on 5/8/25 at 12:21 pm to lsu777
quote:
nope you are wrong....90% of the OT who has never been in the trades will tell you that and the ones that have been in them will tell the trades are the greatest and those of us, like me and you, who have done both are just wrong and we have wrong think....
“BuT I kNoW A pLuMBeR tHaT MaKeS $250k”
Well I know attorneys, accountants, and finance people that make WELL north of a million dollars a year. It’s a pointless antecdotes.
Most attorneys aren’t going to make a million dollars. But most attorneys aren’t going to make a hell of a lot more than a tradesmen
Posted on 5/8/25 at 12:45 pm to lsu777
quote:
and i can promise if you asked your dad and he was truthful....he would never want you to go into welding or your kids to go into welding. he busted his arse so you and future generations wouldnt need to kill themselves.
Yea I honestly can't ever recall him telling me to do what he did or to pursue that type of career. He definitely busted him arse. I knew when I was 13 or 14 years old it wasn't for me. I went one Saturday to "work", which was basically push a broom around the shop so I could go play golf after and I sat and talked with one of his employees while the guy welded and I watched him weld on and off for 30 minutes or so. Later that night I woke up with the biggest pain in my eye ever and thought I was going blind. Had to put potatoes over my eyes to help them heal and the whole time all I could think was "God don't let me go blind I haven't even gotten laid yet"
quote:
good thing is your dad was exceptional so like exceptional people do....he won and figured out a way to make even more without killing himself
you should tell him thank you every chance you get. My dad was similar and i tell him thank you for not accepting me just being whatever and pushing me wiht the help of my now wife.
That's awesome man. I try to but probably not enough
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