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re: What was Hitler’s worst blunder?

Posted on 3/9/19 at 8:47 pm to
Posted by Roger Klarvin
DFW
Member since Nov 2012
46671 posts
Posted on 3/9/19 at 8:47 pm to
Trying to conquer the USSR in the middle of the fricking Russian winter is the benchmark by which all terrible military/political decisions should be judged.
Posted by WWII Collector
Member since Oct 2018
8572 posts
Posted on 3/9/19 at 9:33 pm to
My thoughts...

Later in the war, 1944, there was discussion by the allies to try an assassinate Hitler, but it was determined that he was making so many huge blunders that it was better for the war effort that he remain alive than to try and kill him.

I do believe that switching targets in the Battle of Britain was Goering responsibility. Hitler left all that up to him.

In France and Dunkirk... Stopping the German Panzers for three days while they were driving on the British and French today remains a mystery as to why he ordered them stopped. Had he not done that, he most likely would not have let the British Expeditionary Force get away at Dunkirk.

In Russia.. Somewhere in the beginning as Guderian was driving his Panzers on Moscow, Hitler ordered them to turn south and assist with the taking of Kiev I believe instead of advancing on to Moscow... This delayed taking Moscow before the Winter set in... Had that not have happened, Army Group Center may have taken Moscow the first year.

As to Stalingrad being meaningless... All the Oil from the Caucasus' and other supplies were flowing up the Volga to Central Russia.. Holding Stalingrad was critical for both sides.

I think that the big blunder here was not letting Paulus breakout when they became entrapped. I had heard that Germany Army lost 1/4 of all it's equipment in Stalingrad. That's a huge amount.

Another big blunder was not pulling out the Afrika Korp. Upon the Middle East falling to Montgomery and Russia being the Primary focus.. 150,000 men of the Afrika Korp Surrendered in 1943. Those forces should have been evacuated instead of being taken prisoner...

BTW fellas... You see my handle... I enjoy collecting any and all WWII items...

This post was edited on 3/9/19 at 9:35 pm
Posted by doubleb
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2006
41713 posts
Posted on 3/9/19 at 10:29 pm to
Hitler started after the Russian oilfields with an army to guard his eastern flank.

He got relatively close to Stalingrad, he got enthused about capturing it and diverted his panzers away from the oil fields. Then he sent them back South.

He could have cut off the Russisn oil supply and accomplished a huge tactical victory, but he divided his forces and suffered the consequences.
Posted by lsu480
Downtown Scottsdale
Member since Oct 2007
92902 posts
Posted on 3/9/19 at 11:22 pm to
Bombing civilians in retaliation for the massacre at Dresden, he should have kept being the bigger man
Posted by Strannix
C.S.A.
Member since Dec 2012
52826 posts
Posted on 3/10/19 at 3:02 am to
quote:

he tried. That's what the Battle of Britain was about. Blitzkreig to soften up resistance before the invasion. It failed.


The RAF was on their last leg before Goerring quit attacking bases and starting bombing cities, anyway Hitler never seriously considered invading GB, it was always about Russia
Posted by Asharad
Tiamat
Member since Dec 2010
6281 posts
Posted on 3/10/19 at 3:12 am to
quote:

What was Hitler’s worst blunder?
Eating sugar alcohols
Posted by White Roach
Member since Apr 2009
9666 posts
Posted on 3/10/19 at 5:42 am to
GeorgiaTiger:

I'm just seeing your post on page 2. You make several informative and interesting points, but I've got to disagree with you saying the USSR was a Superpower. For that matter, the US should not have been considered to be a Superpower early in tbe war.

Stalin wasn't blind to Hitler's ambition to grow Germany's landmass. But the USSR was so weak in 1939 that they signed the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact agreeing to non-aggression between Germany and the USSR. The also agreed to divided Poland. Germany invaded Poland about 10 days after signing the treaty with the USSR and the USSR occupied "their" portion of Poland about two weeks later, allegedly to protect the Polish people. They kept that territory long after WWII ended.

When Germany invaded Russia in June of '41, the US was supplying almost all of the Soviet motor transport. Soviet motor ndustrial capacity was focused on cranking out T-34s. Not a Superpower.

The US retooled it's plants build tanks and planes and by the end of the war had developed an unparalled industrial capacity. But when WWII broke out, the US had something like the 22nd largest army in tbe world and that army was not well equipped at all. By 1945 the US was the most powerful nation in the world, but not so much in 1939.
Posted by White Roach
Member since Apr 2009
9666 posts
Posted on 3/10/19 at 6:43 am to
quote:

being brainwashed by Margaret Sanger


This is the second Margaret Sanger comment I've noticed in this thread. Did she have some type of Nazi affiliation that I'm unaware of?

Her main thing was birth control, which was illegal in the US in the early/mid 1900s. Her "support" of legal abortion was a method to end back alley abortions, not so much a zeal for killing babies. I know there are people who think Sanger and Planned Parenthood was/are soley focused on providing as many abortions as possible, but that's not really accurate.

She did support eugenics, but she was hardly alone in her viewpoint. Eugenics programs had support across the US in the first half of the 1900s. She was focused primarily on socio-economic eugenics - if you can't afford those kids, you shouldn't have them. (Most OTers seem to agree with that viewpoint today. I know I do.) She did think profoundly retarded people should be sterilized or segregated from the opposite sex to prevent reproduction. That's a stickier issue, but it doesn't quite compare to Nazis gassing God knows how many mental and physical defectives.

And FYI ... Several US states were still running eugenic programs into tbe late '60s, including NC and CA. They weren't gassing people, but they were sterilizing the mentally challenged, often without their knowledge. Margaret Sanger and Hilter were both dead by then.
Posted by Geekboy
Member since Jan 2004
7166 posts
Posted on 3/10/19 at 6:46 am to
Not allowing smoking in the bunker. Nicotine withdrawal fricked up his generals.
Posted by White Roach
Member since Apr 2009
9666 posts
Posted on 3/10/19 at 7:06 am to
You're correct that the Luftwaffe had the RAF on the ropes during the Battle of Britain. If they had continued to attack the airfields, and if they had focused on the RAF radar sites, things might have ended differently with regard air superiority/supremacy. But Sea Lion was never going to happen in 1940. Germany didn't have the landing craft necessary for a successful large scale amphibious assault and Andrew Higgins lived in New Orleans, not Hamburg.
Posted by Volvagia
Fort Worth
Member since Mar 2006
52897 posts
Posted on 3/10/19 at 7:35 am to
quote:

Not the worst, but switching from military targets to civilian targets in the Battle of Britain.


Disagree. They didn’t do that on a whim. Luftwaffe couldn’t sustain operations and they were seeing no real diminishment of the RAF’s combat ability in spite of mission successes.

They had to try SOMETHING different, or call off the attack all together. A more interesting argument is if they should have engaged in the Battle of Britain at all, saving that air power to contest the channel and free up air support assets for Operation Barborossa.

Which would have probably succeeded, if his armored divisions were better designed for handling mud. Even just a few inches of tread width on the tanks probably would have changed everything. But that was a design issue so probably not Hitler’s call itself so....


I’m going to go with having two generals in front of you offering their proposals on how to defend the Atlantic coast from Allied invasion, and rather than picking one (which each had its merits) went with a mixture of the two which inherited the cons of both with no upside.
Posted by Volvagia
Fort Worth
Member since Mar 2006
52897 posts
Posted on 3/10/19 at 7:39 am to
quote:


You're correct that the Luftwaffe had the RAF on the ropes during the Battle of Britain.


By what metric?

Out of the most heavily assaulted airbases, more than 90% of them were able to be brought back online inside of a few hours. When the decision to switch to civilian targets was made, the RAF was actually larger than when the Battle of Britain started.

They were building new planes and training new pilots far far faster than what they were losing.
Posted by White Roach
Member since Apr 2009
9666 posts
Posted on 3/10/19 at 7:46 am to
Battle of Britain was Summer/Fall of 1940. Barbarossa was June of '41. How would air assets be freed up? Are you referring to Luftwaffe losses in the B of B that could have been better used in Barbarossa?
Posted by White Roach
Member since Apr 2009
9666 posts
Posted on 3/10/19 at 7:53 am to
quote:

They were building new planes and training pilots far far faster than what they were losing


Interesting. I was unaware of that fact. How fast was the RAF training pilots?
Posted by stateofplay
Member since Sep 2018
1504 posts
Posted on 3/10/19 at 10:17 am to
Invading North Africa to help the Italians and then not supplying Rommel adequately.

Also, declaring war on USA after Japan attacked. He could've stayed out of it.
Posted by Volvagia
Fort Worth
Member since Mar 2006
52897 posts
Posted on 3/10/19 at 10:53 am to
quote:

Battle of Britain was Summer/Fall of 1940. Barbarossa was June of '41. How would air assets be freed up? Are you referring to Luftwaffe losses in the B of B that could have been better used in Barbarossa?


Yes.

From square one Germany was hindered by her ability to replenish losses. So even if the Luftwaffe has rebuilt in that time, that was that many fewer planes to throw at the Russians or freeing up strategic resources to build other machinery.
Posted by TigersFan64
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Oct 2014
4755 posts
Posted on 3/10/19 at 12:19 pm to
quote:

The USSR was going to attack Germany Hitler and had no choice




Another ill-informed apologist for Nazi Germany's invasion of the USSR. Where do you people come from?

It wasn't a matter of "no choice" for Hitler. He always intended on conquering the Soviet Union. It was even in Mein Kampf - lebensraum in the East and all that jazz.
This post was edited on 3/10/19 at 12:27 pm
Posted by OMLandshark
Member since Apr 2009
119977 posts
Posted on 3/10/19 at 12:29 pm to
quote:

It wasn't a matter of "no choice" for Hitler. He always intended on conquering the Soviet Union. It was even in Mein Kampf - lebensraum in the East and all that jazz.


It’s always astounded me that none of Hitler’s enemies save for Churchill bothered to read Mein Kampf. Hitler warned us what he was going to do.
This post was edited on 3/10/19 at 12:30 pm
Posted by Isabelle81
NEW ORLEANS, LA
Member since Sep 2015
2718 posts
Posted on 3/10/19 at 12:35 pm to
Surviving his birth.
Posted by TigersFan64
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Oct 2014
4755 posts
Posted on 3/10/19 at 12:47 pm to
quote:

It’s always astounded me that none of Hitler’s enemies save for Churchill bothered to read Mein Kampf. Hitler warned us what he was going to do.


+1

It's actually tragic that more leaders at the time didn't read it. Had they been better informed about the pos' intentions, they might have had the wherewithal to grow a pair of balls and stand up to him over his reoccupation of the Rhineland in 1936 and at the Munich talks later.
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