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Message
1
Posted on 7/18/15 at 1:50 pm to Agforlife
Thanks man, I hope so too 
How were you able to recover?
How were you able to recover?
This post was edited on 7/18/15 at 1:52 pm
Posted on 7/18/15 at 1:51 pm to RLDSC FAN
quote:
He was a very popular kid, star football player at his high school. He never really hung out with his jock buddies thou, he was always hanging around the party people. He says he was given meth at parties, one time turned into two, and the rest is history. It really does grab you quickly if you're not careful
Pretty much how every episode of Intervention starts. So sad.
Posted on 7/18/15 at 1:51 pm to SabiDojo
quote:
I'm sorry but this makes no sense.
Maybe that's why you're not an addict. Because it makes sense to me and happens to be how I view the 1st part of step 1 which is admitting that I am powerless over alcohol/meth.
Posted on 7/18/15 at 1:53 pm to SabiDojo
Everyone from intervention has some terrible thing that happened to them tho
Posted on 7/18/15 at 1:53 pm to Agforlife
Reading back over this, its pretty clear how dofferent the alcoholic/addict and non alcoholic/addict minds work. To be completely honest, this has helped me a lot.
Posted on 7/18/15 at 1:54 pm to SabiDojo
quote:
I'm sorry but this makes no sense
It makes sense to me but I'm a recovering addict
Posted on 7/18/15 at 1:55 pm to GreatLakesTiger24
quote:
Everyone from intervention has some terrible thing that happened to them tho
Yeah, death of a family member, sexual abuse, and the like.
Posted on 7/18/15 at 1:56 pm to LesMiles BFF
Lol its like it tells us in the book, if someone can quit on will power alone then by god more power to them. Thats fricking awesome, but the experience of my entire life has proved ad nauseum that i cant do that.
Posted on 7/18/15 at 1:56 pm to Festus
quote:
So what you're saying is that the others are powerless, and have no ability to choose?
In a way, I suppose. Choosing, in itself, is a function of the brain.
quote:
Thus, are by definition victims of their addiction, with no culpability to change? I mean, they can't. They have no choice but to keep using
Right. Just as some psychopaths can't choose to be non-psychopathic. It takes away ultimate responsibility, but not repercussion.
Posted on 7/18/15 at 1:58 pm to TxTiger82
quote:
This Ted Talk might give you some answers. Not sure if he is 100% right or not, but he has a very interesting premise.
LINK
Posted on 7/18/15 at 1:59 pm to RLDSC FAN
quote:
How were you able to recover?
I finally decided the consequences of my actions weren't worth it and I found a group of guys in AA that were sober and happy so I latched on to them and asked for help. I worked and continue to work the steps daily. The first couple of years were hard but it's gotten easier the longer I keep doing it. The thing you need to understand is that he's not going to quit (if he's a true adfict) for anyone or any reason except himself. I spent a lot of time even to this day trying to fix and restore the damage I have done to the people I love the most. I will pray for your brother and your family. Good luck. Go buy and read an Al Anon book it might help you and your parents to cope with this better.
This post was edited on 7/18/15 at 2:01 pm
Posted on 7/18/15 at 1:59 pm to Agforlife
quote:
happens to be how I view the 1st part of step 1 which is admitting that I am powerless over alcohol/meth.
And the point is that you have a choice to make this admission, or a choice to not admit it. It all begins with making a choice.
Posted on 7/18/15 at 2:02 pm to Festus
quote:
And the point is that you have a choice to make this admission, or a choice to not admit it. It all begins with making a choice
Exactly.
You choose to confront your addiction. You choose to go to counseling. You choose to pursue sobriety. All choices.
I think addicts don't want to realize this because, if they do, they fear the whole structure comes down.
So, they just say, "Well, our minds just work differently."
Posted on 7/18/15 at 2:04 pm to SabiDojo
quote:
I think addicts don't want to realize this because, if they do, they fear the whole structure comes down.
Yes, this is very true not even to mention the perverse incentive for the counselors and rehab people have to keep people dependent on them rather than actually getting them well.
Posted on 7/18/15 at 2:07 pm to SabiDojo
quote:
I think addicts don't want to realize this because, if they do, they fear the whole structure comes down.
So, they just say, "Well, our minds just work differently."
Agree.
But most RECOVERING addicts readily admit that when they reflect, they did in fact have choices. I'm still baffled by recovering addicts that allege they had NO choice in the process. To me, it goes against every tenet of sobriety.
Posted on 7/18/15 at 2:08 pm to Festus
quote:
And the point is that you have a choice to make this admission, or a choice to not admit it. It all begins with making a choice.
Dude you are talking about different choices. You aren't going to ever understand and it's a shame because of that misunderstanding a lot of addicts and alcoholics die. There is something different with us I wish I knew just what it was so I could fix it in others but I don't. All I can tell you is until I admitted I was powerless over alcohol / meth and that my life had become unmanageable (which simply means that when I made the decision [choice] to stop I couldn't manage that decision) I was able to do something about changing my life. So let's just agree to disagree and get on with our lives
Posted on 7/18/15 at 2:11 pm to Festus
quote:
But most RECOVERING addicts readily admit that when they reflect, they did in fact have choices.
This is the illusion of free choice talking. To say that one could have done differently, upon reflection, is to also say the universe (and all its influences) could have been different. This is simply an illusion.
Posted on 7/18/15 at 2:12 pm to Festus
quote:
And the point is that you have a choice to make this admission, or a choice to not admit it. It all begins with making a choice.
I like to quantify things a lot so I'm going to think through what you're saying.
I'm guessing what you are saying is that there is ALWAYS a choice even if if it's minuscule and I'd have to say I agree with you. Let's say a normal person has a 50/50 chance of deciding to get high. It would seem they truly have a free choice and I'd agree.
Brain scans have shown that a person addicted doesn't have this 50/50 shot. I don't know what the number truly is, but with out a 12 step program if guess its somewhere in the range of 99 .5 to .5 in favor of getting high. And the percentages change with where you are in your addiction.
So everybody has a choice, but an addict has a shitty chance of making the right choice because of his/her biology.
Maybe they'll get lucky and hit that lucky .5% one time. Better get to rehab QUICK FAST AND IN A HURRY because the next time you get cash you probably won't be so lucky.
A physicist would say that .5 is significant. An engineer would say take your arse to rehab now. I'm a recovery engineer.
Posted on 7/18/15 at 2:13 pm to LesMiles BFF
quote:
Now, there are addicts that do get clean strictly by willpower but their numbers are extremely small. They quit cold turkey and never go back. It makes true addict wonder if those people ever were truly addicts or just the lucky ones that are genetically stronger when it comes to addiction.
I did strictly by willpower but I had just met a great girl that I wanted to get clean for since she gave me a better feeling than the pills. I told her about them and told her I was going to be sick for awhile but she was great, although understandably very upset and not happy at all about the situation since she really didn't even drink, and she helped me get through that week. Once the physical stuff was over the mental part wasn't bad at all since I wanted to stay clean and I never wanted to be sick like that again. If I hadn't met her and really wanted to stop, and have her there to help me, there is no way I would have at that point.
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