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The Two Deadliest Behavior Assaults On America: Why is one trashy and not the other?

Posted on 3/3/18 at 3:20 pm
Posted by TurkeysAndBees
Member since Jan 2017
651 posts
Posted on 3/3/18 at 3:20 pm
To clarify, I'm not a smoker, never have been... and although I've raised four children, worked hard until recent early retirement, I've been responsible with my personal eating, exercise habits, and can say I'm "in shape". I've noticed a disturbing disconnect in awareness when it comes to smoking and obesity. Cigarette smoke is said to offend the "senses" (smell sight, and sound) of many. Personally, I'm neither terribly offended by cigarette smoke or the obese but may give the nod to the smell of smoke over the sight of gluttony at the dinner table. My point is not that either smoker or glutton be shamed but since BOTH were/are the MOST DEADLY ASSAULTS by individual habit on our county's health and economy, one has already been shamed successfully, why not the other? Don't try the "genetic" excuse, some are disposed to more body mass but obesity is a recent behavioral epidemic that did not plague over half of our nation 50 years ago. We know cigarettes kill but turned out after bans that "second hand smoke" had been wrongly "accused". It was, however, used as a ploy to shame smokers and successfully instituting legal bans. In the aftermath, politicians, scientists, and doctors consider the assault on smoking and smokers a two-fold success by reducing smoking and removing the "offense" to our senses.


If you've kept up, I think you'll find these quotes to be typical from anti-smoking researchers and politicians.

"...although the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention will tell you that "secondhand smoke causes an estimated 3,400 lung cancer deaths among U.S. nonsmokers each year," scientists have long understood that the actual number might be closer to zero.."


Even though proven false:

"...The warning that "secondhand smoke kills," with lung cancer as the paradigmatic example, played an important role in the debate over government-imposed smoking bans..."


The bottom line:

"...because the main goal of smoking bans was "to change societal behavior" by stigmatizing smoking, making it less convenient and less socially acceptable..."

So smokers were and are shamed, plain and simple...and if it gets them to stop and saves their lives, this has been perfectly acceptable among the knowing researchers, doctors, and politicians. Now that obesity kills more Americans than smoking and costs our economy and health care more than smoking ever did, what is wrong with making being overweight unacceptable in the same fashion by stigmatizing as "trashy"?
Posted by Scruffy
Kansas City
Member since Jul 2011
78045 posts
Posted on 3/3/18 at 3:25 pm to
quote:

Now that obesity kills more Americans than smoking and costs our economy and health care more than smoking ever did, what is wrong with making being overweight unacceptable in the same fashion by stigmatizing as "trashy"?
You are preaching to the choir.

Obesity is a worse crisis than smoking and the opioid situation, but we can’t “hurt feelings”.
Posted by notiger1997
Metairie
Member since May 2009
61801 posts
Posted on 3/3/18 at 3:26 pm to
quote:

So smokers were and are shamed, plain and simple..


Good.

And while we are discussing stupid stuff, some of the liberal parents on my social media are so upset and worried that little Jane might me the 1 in 10 million a chance kid that gets shot and they are demanding action, none of them seem to give a shite about how fat our kids are and where that is going to lead them to later in life.

No problem I guess. The government will take care of all of the people with diabetes, liver, and heart problems.
Posted by PrivatePublic
Member since Nov 2012
17848 posts
Posted on 3/3/18 at 3:33 pm to
I think addressing either is pointless. If we are going to be a free country, let's be a fricking free country, and if people want to kill themselves with sugar, KFC, and cigarettes, let them fricking do it.
Posted by drunkenpunkin
Louisiana
Member since Dec 2011
7662 posts
Posted on 3/3/18 at 3:38 pm to
Smoking has been successfully shamed because it can affect other people. You can kill someone else with second hand smoke. Being fat just affects you. I really don't understand the obsession with the fatness of other people. The only time I've been aggravated by fatness is when they take up handicap spaces because they're too fat to walk. That affects other people. Other than that, I don't give a shite if someone eats themselves to death.
Posted by Marlbud
Member since Jun 2017
964 posts
Posted on 3/3/18 at 3:42 pm to
I agree as long as my tax dollars aren't used to fatten them up and pay for their healthcare, all the while my BCBS skyrockets every year.
Posted by notiger1997
Metairie
Member since May 2009
61801 posts
Posted on 3/3/18 at 3:42 pm to
quote:

I don't give a shite if someone eats themselves to death.


In general I don't either, but the amount of tax dollars we spend taking care of the "poor" obese who have no insurance is probably an insane number.

I know I have a great uncle who was warned over and over by his doctor to lose weight and stop eating so much sugar. Dumbass ended up having his leg removed, ended up on dialysis, and spent his final few years in a "free" special care nursing home place.
Posted by drunkenpunkin
Louisiana
Member since Dec 2011
7662 posts
Posted on 3/3/18 at 3:46 pm to
Yeah, but the amount of money we spend on "poor" able bodied people who choose not to participate in society is greater. It is supposed to be difficult to be determined as disabled, but I see people all the time who can work but choose not to who are "disabled" and carry Medicaid. I don't know how most of these people are able to get away with it.
Posted by jimbeam
University of LSU
Member since Oct 2011
75703 posts
Posted on 3/3/18 at 3:50 pm to
quote:

smoke. Being fat just affects you. I really don't understand the obsession with the fatness of other people
bullshite. Do you not pay taxes? Health insurance?
Posted by Blob Fish
Member since Mar 2016
3091 posts
Posted on 3/3/18 at 3:50 pm to
quote:

scientists have long understood that the actual number might be closer to zero.."


Fake news
Posted by notiger1997
Metairie
Member since May 2009
61801 posts
Posted on 3/3/18 at 3:53 pm to
I know one thing, I stopped going into any bar that allowed smoking a few years back, especially if I'm going to eat something.
Stopped by a place the other night and all four of the people near me were smoking. Fck that. I had one beer and left.

And I am of the thought that the bar owner should be able to make the decision on if he allows it or not.
I just forgot how much I hate being around smokers.
Posted by just1dawg
Virginia
Member since Dec 2011
1495 posts
Posted on 3/3/18 at 3:53 pm to
quote:

My point is not that either smoker or glutton be shamed but since BOTH were/are the MOST DEADLY ASSAULTS by individual habit on our county's health and economy, one has already been shamed successfully, why not the other?


My understanding is that obese people, particularly morbidly obese people, actually save the country money because they die sooner. The last six months of their lives are substantially cheaper (healthcare-wise) than the last six months of seniors 80+ in age.
Posted by TurkeysAndBees
Member since Jan 2017
651 posts
Posted on 3/3/18 at 3:55 pm to
quote:

Smoking has been successfully shamed because it can affect other people. You can kill someone else with second hand smoke.


Wrong, that is just old anti-smoke propaganda. This has been thoroughly squashed over the past 10 years with research. Even the Surgeon General issued a report with findings from States with smoking bans that second hand smoke has not only never killed anyone, it was wrongly "accused", period. The only evidence from second hand smoke found was a marker in workers previously exposed to smoke before ban but the marker had nothing to do with cancer. It was just a byproduct of the smoke environment much like you get the smell of grease on your clothes at a seafood restaurant... the only determination or difference in smoke free environments that was found in all research to date. No one has been killed by second hand smoke.
Posted by drunkenpunkin
Louisiana
Member since Dec 2011
7662 posts
Posted on 3/3/18 at 3:58 pm to
This can be said about a number of poor choices. Drinking, smoking, drugs, obesity. And some people have horrible liver enzymes or cholesterol or diabetes and aren't fat. They may have bad genetics and make poor choices related to those conditions. Following that logic, those people should piss you off too. But they are harder to identify and more difficult to shame The real reason obesity bothers people is the aesthetics of it. People like to feel superior. Can't be racist or sexist anymore. So, this is the new group to hate that is socially acceptable.
Posted by cj35
Member since Jan 2014
6153 posts
Posted on 3/3/18 at 3:58 pm to
Smoking causes a number of other health issues besides cancer. Obesity is not entirely a behavior-based disorder. Shaming people with metabolic issues is cruel.
Posted by GeauxxxTigers23
TeamBunt General Manager
Member since Apr 2013
62514 posts
Posted on 3/3/18 at 3:59 pm to
quote:

Shaming people with metabolic issues is cruel.
frick off fatass
Posted by upgrayedd
Lifting at Tobin's house
Member since Mar 2013
139229 posts
Posted on 3/3/18 at 4:06 pm to
No one dies from second hand smoke. Deal with it.
Posted by TurkeysAndBees
Member since Jan 2017
651 posts
Posted on 3/3/18 at 4:10 pm to
quote:

And I am of the thought that the bar owner should be able to make the decision on if he allows it or not. I just forgot how much I hate being around smokers


You do know this is just your social conditioning from the anti-smoke / pro-ban propaganda days. You would be saying something totally different if you were here 50 years ago. The "second hand smoke" threat has now been debunked. Until the mid 1970's smoking was not only everywhere and no one noticed...in public, all department stores, indoor sport events, all restaurants and nobody even noticed then... it was fashionable and even admirable.. the majority of Hollywood's icons and sex symbols smoked openly on television, talk shows, award shows, etc. The trends are just different today, that's all. Don't get me wrong, smoking cigarettes heavily will kill you, but the whole "second-hand smoke" scare that made even the smell "repulsive" was good-old American political brainwashing at its finest. Very rarely did anyone give a crap or even notice before the campaign.
Posted by airfernando
Member since Oct 2015
15248 posts
Posted on 3/3/18 at 4:13 pm to
quote:

Obesity is not entirely a behavior-based disorder. Shaming people with metabolic issues is cruel.
bs. obesity is always the result of smothering metabolism with loads of food. When metabolism slows, intake must slow.
Posted by High C
viewing the fall....
Member since Nov 2012
62193 posts
Posted on 3/3/18 at 4:14 pm to
We need some SI models smoking a joe in the magazine.
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