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The Partition of India 1947 (long read, violence, etc)

Posted on 12/6/18 at 6:44 am
Posted by celltech1981
Member since Jul 2014
8139 posts
Posted on 12/6/18 at 6:44 am
I knew a little about this but didnt realize how many people had died. I knew that Britain had separated India and Pakistan in the 40s and left them as sovereign nations. I guess that all the crap happening after wwII with America, Russia, nukes, etc overshadowed this.

A couple million people is the high estimate of how many folks were killed. There are a few documentaries on YouTube.



The Partition of India was the division of British India in 1947 which created two independent domains, India and Pakistan. It resulted in the dissolution of the British Raj, and the two self-governing countries of Pakistan and India legally came into existence in August of 1947.


The partition displaced 14 million people along religious lines and created a huge refugee crisis. The large scale violence resulted in the estimated deaths between several hundred thousand and two million. There are still shaky relations between India and Pakistan today.

LINK


quote:


“Sikhs, Hindus and Muslims in Punjab and Bengal legislative assemblies would meet and vote for partition. If a simple majority of either group wanted partition, then these provinces would be divided.” Muslim demands for a separate state were conceded, Pakistan was created.



quote:

The population of undivided India in 1947 was approx 390 million. After partition, there were 330 million people in India, 30 million in West Pakistan, and 30 million people in East Pakistan (now Bangladesh)."[92] Once the lines were established, about 14.5 million people crossed the borders to what they hoped was the relative safety of religious majority. The 1951 Census of Pakistan identified the number of displaced persons in Pakistan at 7,226,600, presumably all Muslims who had entered Pakistan from India. Similarly, the 1951 Census of India enumerated 7,295,870 displaced persons, apparently all Hindus and Sikhs who had moved to India from Pakistan immediately after the Partition.[2] The two numbers add up to 14.5 million. Since both censuses were held about 3.6 years after the Partition, the enumeration included net population increase after the mass migration.



quote:

“A study of the total population inflows and outflows in the districts of the Punjab, using the data provided by the 1931 and 1951 Census has led to an estimate of 1.26 million missing Muslims who left western India but did not reach Pakistan.[102] The corresponding number of missing Hindus/Sikhs along the western border is estimated to be approximately 0.84 million.[129] This puts the total of missing people, due to Partition-related migration along the Punjab border, to around 2.23 million.[129] Another study of the demographic consequences of partition in the Punjab region using the 1931, 1941 and 1951 censuses concluded that between 2.3 and 3.2 million people went missing in the Punjab”



Violence



LINK


quote:

“Bungalows and mansions were burned and looted, women were raped, children were killed in front of their siblings. Trains carrying refugees between the two new nations arrived full of corpses; their passengers had been killed by mobs en route. These were called “blood trains”: “All too often they crossed the border in funereal silence, blood seeping from under their carriage doors,” Hajari wrote in his book.”



quote:


Sudershana Kumari, an 8-year-old Hindu girl who witnessed a massacre in her home town in Pakistan. From the holes in the roof, Kumari saw her uncle and his family being killed by men with spears in the street. Her uncle was a tax collector who had made the error of filling their suitcases with cash — unnecessary weight that had kept his family from running fast enough, Kumari said. “My aunt was wearing white trousers, I remember,” she says. “She was crying, ‘Don’t kill my son, don’t kill my son.’ Then they took her daughter from her. They took her, and they pierced the spear through her body. She died like that, a 1-year-old girl.”
The townspeople were ushered out to a playground, where the previous day’s captives had been doused with oil and burned alive. Corpses lay strewn across the streets. “One dead body here, one dead body there. All people we know,” Kumari said.



quote:

Sarjit Singh Chowdhary, a Sikh soldier who helped Muslim refugees reach safety in Pakistan
“The news reports from his home town disturbed him deeply. “In a village just 12 kilometers from mine called Thoha Khalsa, women drowned themselves to save their honor. When the army found them, their bodies were swollen and had come up to the surface. That was the state at the time. Men were shooting their own wives and daughters because they feared what would happen if they were taken away by attackers,” he said.”




quote:

But outside southern Asia, the brutalities of partition were not widely broadcast. Partly, Hajari says, that may be because of how the events were depicted by British sources. “At the time, there was an impetus to portray the moment of independence as a triumph — that after 200 years of colonial rule, the British could part as friends. If you emphasize the death and violence, that tarnishes the achievement,” he said.
Posted by USEyourCURDS
Member since Apr 2016
12059 posts
Posted on 12/6/18 at 7:01 am to
Have a good Thursday, y’all!
Posted by GetCocky11
Calgary, AB
Member since Oct 2012
51235 posts
Posted on 12/6/18 at 7:03 am to
Gandhi was opposed to a religious division of British India. If there were to be a partition, he wanted it decided after the British had left.

Jinnah and the Muslim League demanded the division so the Muslims could have their own country. They feared life in a Hindu-majority country.

The British decided to go along with the partition with Pakistan existing in both the west and the east (modern day Bangladesh).

The violence of the partition ranks up there with the Holocaust as one of the 20th century's darkest moments. If the British had remained for a while the population transfers were happening, it probably wouldn't have been as violent.
Posted by Bamboozles
BR
Member since Jul 2008
2302 posts
Posted on 12/6/18 at 7:03 am to
Also created Bangladesh the muthafriggin Brits.....blame for partition goes to Brits and to a certain extent Gandhi.
Posted by celltech1981
Member since Jul 2014
8139 posts
Posted on 12/6/18 at 7:07 am to
quote:

The violence of the partition ranks up there with the Holocaust as one of the 20th century's darkest moments.


Yup, I was pretty shocked I had never heard about it
Posted by GetCocky11
Calgary, AB
Member since Oct 2012
51235 posts
Posted on 12/6/18 at 7:10 am to
quote:

blame for partition goes to Brits and to a certain extent Gandhi.


The Brits didn't handle it well. But Jinnah is the #1 reason for Pakistan.
Posted by Bamboozles
BR
Member since Jul 2008
2302 posts
Posted on 12/6/18 at 7:23 am to
Agree Jinnah is in the mix too. The west only knows Gandhi as the leader of the fight for indepence (and he was great in doing that) but what he did post independence rightfully got him assassinated. From partition to getting Nehru to be PM over Sardar Patel etc etc etc.
This post was edited on 12/6/18 at 7:24 am
Posted by GetCocky11
Calgary, AB
Member since Oct 2012
51235 posts
Posted on 12/6/18 at 7:31 am to
quote:

but what he did post independence rightfully got him assassinated.


It was Jinnah's Direct Action Day that started the violence. It was Gandhi who started the fast to see it end.

Are you some kind of supporter of Hindu nationalism? One of the primary motivations for the assassination was that Gandhi was seen as a Muslim supporter. The assassination of Gandhi killed the Hindu nationalist movement in India.
Posted by Bamboozles
BR
Member since Jul 2008
2302 posts
Posted on 12/6/18 at 7:45 am to
I don't support Hindu nationalism. That is like saying all Trump supporters are white nationalists. I have spent enough time in India to know what is going on. You should look at the other side of what Gandhi was rather than what he is portrayed as in general media. I give Gandhi all due credit in helping India gain independence. But he was not the same post that Imho. Gandhi supported Nehru over Sardar and the Nehru family has run Indian politics since that day till Modi came to power, with their main vote bank being minorities just like the Democrats do over here.

Full disclosure: Am a Hindu and a trump supporter.
This post was edited on 12/6/18 at 7:46 am
Posted by GetCocky11
Calgary, AB
Member since Oct 2012
51235 posts
Posted on 12/6/18 at 7:52 am to
quote:

Nehru family has run Indian politics since that day till Modi came to powe


With Nehru's descendants coincidentally carrying the last name of Gandhi if I recall correctly.

quote:

But he was not the same post that Imho


Assassination elevated Gandhi to martyr status and Nehru used Gandhi's death to entrench himself and his family's grip on Indian politics.
Posted by Bamboozles
BR
Member since Jul 2008
2302 posts
Posted on 12/6/18 at 7:54 am to
quote:

With Nehru's descendants coincidentally carrying the last name of Gandhi if I recall correctly. 


How the last name came to be Gandhi is something you may find intriguing ... May want to read up on that, again not in mainstream media, not even in India
Posted by glorymanutdtiger
Baton Rouge
Member since Jun 2012
3786 posts
Posted on 12/6/18 at 8:02 am to
It was Brits idea to divide and rule. It helped them that religious beliefs are strong. British empire has burnt people alive by thousands in india.

Don't see a reason why they are celebrated in this generation.
Posted by cave canem
pullarius dominus
Member since Oct 2012
12186 posts
Posted on 12/6/18 at 8:10 am to
quote:

It was Brits idea to divide and rule. It helped them that religious beliefs are strong. British empire has burnt people alive by thousands in india.


Divide and conquer was the Brits strategy wherever they went and it worked for them very well no matter which continent they were on.
Posted by Bamboozles
BR
Member since Jul 2008
2302 posts
Posted on 12/6/18 at 8:11 am to
Actually Brits are getting a heavy dose of what they started. Over time, England has become heavily saturated with people from the Indian subcontinent....few more years and they may lose their identity at this rate.
Posted by GetCocky11
Calgary, AB
Member since Oct 2012
51235 posts
Posted on 12/6/18 at 8:14 am to
quote:

It was Brits idea to divide and rule.


Disagree. At least according to the accepted history, Mountbatten went into it with the instructions to keep India united if possible. The changing situation in India just led to unification being thrown out.
Posted by deltaland
Member since Mar 2011
90476 posts
Posted on 12/6/18 at 8:14 am to
A lot of the reason for the violence in the ME today is due to the British/USA creating countries out of thin air with no regards to different religious sects or cultures. We royally screwed it up
Posted by GetCocky11
Calgary, AB
Member since Oct 2012
51235 posts
Posted on 12/6/18 at 8:19 am to
quote:

creating countries out of thin air with no regards to different religious sects or cultures


Except in the context of this thread, that is exactly how Pakistan came into existence.
Posted by Lsupimp
Ersatz Amerika-97.6% phony & fake
Member since Nov 2003
78328 posts
Posted on 12/6/18 at 8:32 am to
This is the history of mankind. Violence and death. It’s one of the many reasons I hate identity politics. It totally undervalues the human commonalities we have in this area. For instance my wife fled Vietnam and lived in a tent for a year, one step ahead of the Communists. My grandfather fled the pogroms of Russia as a kid, a generation later his entire family that stayed behind was killed by the Nazis. Less than a century before that my mother’s family fled Ireland starving during the potato famine.

My point is not that my family has uniquely suffered, but in fact the opposite. That’s the norm for people. All of us have these stories. This is what humanity is. We are all in this soup together.
Posted by Barbellthor
Columbia
Member since Aug 2015
8633 posts
Posted on 12/6/18 at 8:35 am to
Sounds like a religious-fueled, Muslim-inspired massacre filled the void left by the iron-footed British empire.
Posted by celltech1981
Member since Jul 2014
8139 posts
Posted on 12/6/18 at 8:39 am to
Eh, dont think you can blame this one on the muslims.
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