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re: The Advocate finally asks the question: Too many universities in La?

Posted on 1/25/16 at 11:20 am to
Posted by LSULaw2009
Baton Rouge
Member since Feb 2008
1738 posts
Posted on 1/25/16 at 11:20 am to
At the very least every 4 year institution should be paired with one or more LCTCS schools in the area and have all remedial and many entry level courses that are taught at the LCTCS school be done through the LCTCS school, or at least as much as possible, instead of being taught at both schools.

The LCTCS school, when possible, should be using graduate level students from the 4 year university to teach the remedial courses (obviously cannot go wholesale due to acceditation standards requiring sufficient # of master and phds level educators).

This reduces the duplication of services (extra cost to state) in a region and reduces employment costs for both schools.

These are essentially state agencies and not independent entities like municipalities, therefore there is no reason that the State through the Board of Regents shouldn't seek to promote collaboration and avoidance of duplication where possible to reduce the costs to the State.

There should be three higher education boards; one for four year universities and professional schools, LCTCS, and the Board of Regents to coordinate between the two. I'd let LSU BR and its satellite entities (Pennington, etc) be its own deal, but LSU-A, LSU-E, an LSU-S all get moved into LCTCS as 2 year schools. Cut unnecessary administration costs. Southern doesn't need its own system and accompanying administration; Grambling is part of the ULS after all.

Finally, its possible to combine schools without closing campuses by having one set of administration for multiple campuses (ULL and McNeese could share administration for all I care, and as a McNeese and LSU grad, I otherwise loath ULL , but keep both campuses open). The higher administration costs (6-7 Figure Salaries) are the bigger issue rather than faculty and staff duplication costs (which can be addressed as stated above).

Essentially, lets work on making them more efficient before going all out closure.
Posted by slackster
Houston
Member since Mar 2009
91838 posts
Posted on 1/25/16 at 11:22 am to
quote:

Some of the posts in this thread are truly unbelievable. 



Agreed, but your example isn't a good one. While closing Grambling or Southern might be political suicide, it certainly has its merits.

quote:

And "oh, just make this 10K+ student-enrolled 4 year university into a CC". Really?


Meh, convenience is a pretty weak reason to keep a college open IMO. Nicholls is convenient for the bayou parishes and serves its area well, but it is universally included on the chopping block in these threads, and for good reason.

Making college convenient and accessible to the masses is a nice idea, but in practice it creates a huge public burden while effectively watering down the degrees of many who graduated from various universities. The problem would greatly solve itself if you overhauled TOPS and got rid of some of the lower-end awards.

I'm aware that opinion may not be popular, but people need to understand that college isn't for everyone. When there is no risk and/or penalty for trying it out a few semesters on the state's dime before ultimately dropping out, you create the bubble that we're in now.
This post was edited on 1/25/16 at 11:23 am
Posted by hsfolk
Member since Sep 2009
19289 posts
Posted on 1/25/16 at 11:24 am to
get rid of Grambling, McNeese, Nichols, NWSt, ULM, LSU-A & LSU-S
Posted by Hammertime
Will trade dowsing rod for titties
Member since Jan 2012
43031 posts
Posted on 1/25/16 at 11:45 am to
The only school that 100% of people on TD think should close is SUNO. If you take a poll of the entire state, I'd be willing to bet that >90% of people would pick SUNO first to be completely closed down
Posted by SuperSaint
Sorting Out OT BS Since '2007'
Member since Sep 2007
150362 posts
Posted on 1/25/16 at 11:48 am to
Keep LSU, UNO, ULL, Tech.

Close the rest. Those schools could easily serve the population of this state.
Posted by TigerRob20
Baton Rouge
Member since Nov 2008
3733 posts
Posted on 1/25/16 at 11:48 am to
quote:

Essentially, lets work on making them more efficient before going all out closure.




Another idea here is to incentivize online classes or expansion for them. Maybe the schools could find they could offer the same or better courses and save some money.
Posted by hsfolk
Member since Sep 2009
19289 posts
Posted on 1/25/16 at 12:03 pm to
if Grambling students can't cut it where they are at then they won't be able to at Tech and both Grambling and ULM would have to qualify for Tech's higher admission standards
Posted by Havoc
Member since Nov 2015
39269 posts
Posted on 1/26/16 at 12:10 pm to
quote:

LSU has the most dropouts of any LA university, which means the most TOPS money going towards nothing, the most student debt racked up with nothing to show in return.

First-to-Second Retention
LSU:
Part-Time: 50%
Full-Time: 82%

SLU:
Part-Time: 42%
Full-Time: 63%

LINK

LINK



Posted by baseballmind1212
Missouri City
Member since Feb 2011
3401 posts
Posted on 1/26/16 at 12:14 pm to
How dare you bring fact based evidence backed by citations here.

Have an upvote
Posted by quail man
New York, NY
Member since May 2010
41250 posts
Posted on 1/26/16 at 12:20 pm to
quote:

Mississippi has a bigger problem with too many schools than Louisiana. Something like 9 four-year schools.



so that somehow solves Louisiana's problem? just because another state is worse doesn't make the situation any better.
Posted by MadMaxwell
The Motherland
Member since Jul 2009
4600 posts
Posted on 1/26/16 at 1:23 pm to
quote:

First-to-Second Retention
LSU:
Part-Time: 50%
Full-Time: 82%

SLU:
Part-Time: 42%
Full-Time: 63%
Those would be percentages, not actual numbers of student populations. Did they not teach you the difference at LSU? No wonder the graduation rate is so high.
Posted by Hammertime
Will trade dowsing rod for titties
Member since Jan 2012
43031 posts
Posted on 1/26/16 at 1:38 pm to
Percentages measure it better than total values. You can't compare a school with 5000 people to a school with 30000 people
Posted by MadMaxwell
The Motherland
Member since Jul 2009
4600 posts
Posted on 1/26/16 at 1:55 pm to
quote:

You can't compare a school with 5000 people to a school with 30000 people
It's 15,000 and the tuition rate at LSU is significantly higher so yes, yes I can compare them.
Posted by Hammertime
Will trade dowsing rod for titties
Member since Jan 2012
43031 posts
Posted on 1/26/16 at 2:00 pm to
Huh? You said that LSU has more dropouts. A 50% rate at a 15k school is 7500. 50% at 30k is 15k. Apples to oranges.

How much higher is 12hrs at LSU vs SLU?
Posted by MadMaxwell
The Motherland
Member since Jul 2009
4600 posts
Posted on 1/26/16 at 2:03 pm to
75k is less than 15k? Did they already institute common core at LSU?
Posted by RealityTiger
Geismar, LA
Member since Jan 2010
20543 posts
Posted on 1/26/16 at 2:10 pm to
Keep digging in that hole of failure.
Posted by Hammertime
Will trade dowsing rod for titties
Member since Jan 2012
43031 posts
Posted on 1/26/16 at 2:10 pm to
Read again Slow Learners University
Posted by MadMaxwell
The Motherland
Member since Jul 2009
4600 posts
Posted on 1/26/16 at 2:46 pm to
I don't think you understand how apples to oranges works, or basic math for that matter.

You're arguing more dropouts from a school where they spend more money on tuition is somehow less costly than a smaller group of dropouts spending less on tuition.

I get the LSU bias on this site, but Jesus, that's some real impressive logical gymnastics.
Posted by Havoc
Member since Nov 2015
39269 posts
Posted on 1/26/16 at 3:07 pm to
quote:

Those would be percentages, not actual numbers of student populations. Did they not teach you the difference at LSU? No wonder the graduation rate is so high.

Oh so you don't like the rates?

So, we know SLU has a higher dropout rate than LSU. So on that measure, SLU is not as good as LSU on retaining its students.

But based on the pure numbers, it appears you are right about LSU having "more dropouts" because they have more students.

However, LSU graduates much more students than SLU, by rate or gross number.

But I'm sure you'll try to have it both ways on that.
Posted by BayouBengals03
lsu14always
Member since Nov 2007
99999 posts
Posted on 1/26/16 at 3:11 pm to
quote:

I always thought it was weird that LSUHSC didnt have a pharmacy program

Pretty much the only thing LSU doesn't have
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