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re: Solve this OT

Posted on 7/23/18 at 3:17 pm to
Posted by PearlJam
NotBeardEaves
Member since Aug 2014
13908 posts
Posted on 7/23/18 at 3:17 pm to
quote:

how can you possibly disagree there are 3 possible outcomes given that ALL we know is that you've chosen a gold ball?
Because 1 ball remains in the box. It can only be gold or silver.
Posted by ell_13
Member since Apr 2013
88451 posts
Posted on 7/23/18 at 3:17 pm to
75%!!
Posted by slackster
Houston
Member since Mar 2009
91873 posts
Posted on 7/23/18 at 3:17 pm to
PearlJam, use ell's example then.

GGG, GGS, GSS, SSS

You've chosen a gold ball. How many possible outcomes are there for your next pull?
Posted by shel311
McKinney, Texas
Member since Aug 2004
112944 posts
Posted on 7/23/18 at 3:17 pm to
quote:

By that logic there is only one outcome remaining - whatever ball is in the box is the only outcome it can be.

Not sure if I'm right, but I feel like you're both right.


Once you choose a gold ball, there are only 2 outcomes left. But you're twice as likely to choose said gold ball.

Right?
Posted by CptRusty
Basket of Deplorables
Member since Aug 2011
11740 posts
Posted on 7/23/18 at 3:17 pm to
quote:

Because 1 ball remains in the box. It can only be gold or silver.




If you had a box with 3 gold balls, and another box with 1 gold ball and two silvers, what are the odds of pulling a second gold ball from the same box if your first pull resulted in gold.
Posted by shel311
McKinney, Texas
Member since Aug 2004
112944 posts
Posted on 7/23/18 at 3:18 pm to
quote:

Explain why, and show your work.

We know you pick a gold ball, simulate picking each of the 3 gold balls:

Call them G1, G2 for the double gold box and G3 for the one with the silver ball. We know we're picking a gold ball first, and it's totally random, so the odds of picking G1, G2 or G3 are equal.

Choose G1 - 2nd ball is G2, gold
Choose G2 - 2nd ball is G1, gold
Choose G3 - 2nd ball is the silver ball

2 outta 3
Posted by CptRusty
Basket of Deplorables
Member since Aug 2011
11740 posts
Posted on 7/23/18 at 3:18 pm to
quote:

75%!!


correct!

But I want Pearl Jam to answer why
Posted by PearlJam
NotBeardEaves
Member since Aug 2014
13908 posts
Posted on 7/23/18 at 3:18 pm to
quote:

Once you choose a gold ball, there are only 2 outcomes left. But you're twice as likely to choose said gold ball.

Right?
exactly
Posted by slackster
Houston
Member since Mar 2009
91873 posts
Posted on 7/23/18 at 3:19 pm to
quote:

Once you choose a gold ball, there are only 2 outcomes left. But you're twice as likely to choose said gold ball.

Right?



It's been 6 pages of semantics.

There are 3 possible pairs involving gold balls.

G1, G2
G2, G1
G3, S1

Once you've pulled a gold ball, there are three possible balls that still remain - G1, G2, or S1. There are two possible colors that still remain.
Posted by CptRusty
Basket of Deplorables
Member since Aug 2011
11740 posts
Posted on 7/23/18 at 3:19 pm to
quote:

Choose G1 - 2nd ball is G2, gold
Choose G2 - 2nd ball is G1, gold
Choose G3 - 2nd ball is the silver ball

2 outta 3


Yep.

2 of the three possible outcomes result in gold.

Correct.
Posted by PearlJam
NotBeardEaves
Member since Aug 2014
13908 posts
Posted on 7/23/18 at 3:19 pm to
Because it is 3 times more likely you picked a gold ball from the box with 3 gold balls than the box with 1.
Posted by shel311
McKinney, Texas
Member since Aug 2004
112944 posts
Posted on 7/23/18 at 3:20 pm to
quote:

If you understand why the answer is 2/3 then solve that for me. Show your work.

There's a 67% chance you chose a gold ball from teh double gold box.

When you choose that gold ball, the next will be gold 100% of the time. When you choose from the other box, it'll be silver 100% of the time.

So the 67% of the time you choose the double gold box is essentially the answer to how often the next ball will be gold.
Posted by LordSaintly
Member since Dec 2005
43342 posts
Posted on 7/23/18 at 3:20 pm to
I think PearlJam truly understands the answer. We just have different definitions of what constitutes a outcome.
Posted by ell_13
Member since Apr 2013
88451 posts
Posted on 7/23/18 at 3:20 pm to
quote:

GGG, GGS, GSS, SSS

You've chosen a gold ball. How many possible outcomes are there for your next pull?
Here's my logic:

I know I'm going to pull a gold so, 50% chance for Box 1, 33% chance for box 2, 16.7% chance for box 3. Box 3 gets throw out since all outcomes are silver. 100% results from box one and 50% of results from box two. 1.00*0.5 + 0.5*0.33 = 0.67
Posted by CptRusty
Basket of Deplorables
Member since Aug 2011
11740 posts
Posted on 7/23/18 at 3:21 pm to
you're handwaving again
Posted by PearlJam
NotBeardEaves
Member since Aug 2014
13908 posts
Posted on 7/23/18 at 3:22 pm to
How am I hand waiving?
Posted by CptRusty
Basket of Deplorables
Member since Aug 2011
11740 posts
Posted on 7/23/18 at 3:23 pm to
quote:

How am I hand waiving?



You're not explaining how you arrived at the answer.

"Handwaving"
Posted by PearlJam
NotBeardEaves
Member since Aug 2014
13908 posts
Posted on 7/23/18 at 3:26 pm to
1 box has 3 gold balls the other has 1. If I picked a gold ball, it's a 3 out of 4 chance it came from the box with 3 gold balls. Now, when I pick my second ball, there are only 2 outcomes. It will either be gold (75% of the time) or silver (25% of the time).
This post was edited on 7/23/18 at 3:26 pm
Posted by CptRusty
Basket of Deplorables
Member since Aug 2011
11740 posts
Posted on 7/23/18 at 3:27 pm to
quote:

There's a 67% chance you chose a gold ball from teh double gold box.



Correct. The opening move defines the outcome.

There are 2/3 unique opening moves which result in a unique gold ball being pulled as the outcome.
Posted by slackster
Houston
Member since Mar 2009
91873 posts
Posted on 7/23/18 at 3:27 pm to
quote:

Here's my logic:

I know I'm going to pull a gold so, 50% chance for Box 1, 33% chance for box 2, 16.7% chance for box 3. Box 3 gets throw out since all outcomes are silver. 100% results from box one and 50% of results from box two. 1.00*0.5 + 0.5*0.33 = 0.67





The math is sound.

Your question and the OP are basically if/then statements. If we've chosen gold, then what are the odds the next ball is gold. Well, first we need to figure out how many ways we can choose gold (3 in the OP, 6 in your example). Then we need to assign the probability of the next ball being gold for each of the possible ways we can start with a gold ball. In the OP, G1 and G2 have a 100% chance EACH of having a gold ball come next. G3 has a 0% chance. Those are 3 possible outcomes, and 67% of them result in a gold ball coming next.

In your example, G1, G2, and G3 have a 100% chance each of having a gold ball come next. G4 and G5 have a 50% chance each, and G6 has a 0% chance. 4 of the 6 possible outcomes result in a gold ball being picked again, ergo, 67% chance of pulling another gold on the next pull.
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