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re: Short video showing the daily frontlines and boundaries during the War Between the States

Posted on 5/25/19 at 4:20 pm to
Posted by northshorebamaman
Mackinac Island
Member since Jul 2009
38562 posts
Posted on 5/25/19 at 4:20 pm to
quote:

Yeah, but he had a big dong.
He nicknamed it Jumbo.
Posted by TigersFan64
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Oct 2014
4755 posts
Posted on 5/25/19 at 4:23 pm to
quote:

But when the North invaded the South, Americans in the South stood up and fought for their home, neighbors and their state.


The South started the American Civil War by firing on Fort Sumter, a Federal installation. President Lincoln bent over backwards to avoid war, but he was not going to allow the South to break up the Union. Read the declarations of secession promulgated by the seceding Southern states. They as much as said that they were seceding to protect the institution of slavery, "their way of life." The planter class, who ruled in the South at the time, led the South into secession from the Union. And a large portion of the white population that did not own slaves, were nevertheless thoroughly propagandized by the time of the Civil War against freeing the slaves. The pro-slavery propaganda in the South warned whites about "what would happen" if the 4 million slaves in the South were freed at once, alleging that the freed slaves would take revenge on whites, rape their women, etc. etc. etc. So it's a mistake to assume that non-slave-owning southerners fighting in the Confederate armed forces were neutral on the issue of slavery. They certainly were not. Also, a lot of whites who did not then own slaves, ASPIRED to own them, and thus were in favor keeping slavery legal.
This post was edited on 5/25/19 at 4:25 pm
Posted by TigersFan64
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Oct 2014
4755 posts
Posted on 5/25/19 at 4:34 pm to
quote:

So were the colonialists evil traitors when they opposed King George and had slavery in all of the colonies themselves? Or are you just trying to virtue signal and have an internet fight because you are too lazy to understand history?




I will say that slavery was America's "original sin," as some historians so aptly put it. Imo, slavery should have been abolished during the writing of the Constitution. The FF who did not want slavery abolished at that time were moral hypocrites, really. The sad thing is that since they didn't tackle the issue of slavery then, they condemned a later generation to be slaughtered in the hundreds of thousands 80+ years later. The fact of the matter is that had slavery not been around by the 1850's, 1860's, there would have been no American Civil War.

This post was edited on 5/25/19 at 4:36 pm
Posted by lepdagod
Baton Rouge
Member since Jan 2015
6268 posts
Posted on 5/25/19 at 4:38 pm to
quote:

assume if the Federal government invaded Louisiana and started shooting at your family and friends you would help the Feds?


Wait... what... thats really your comparison
Posted by BuckyCheese
Member since Jan 2015
57778 posts
Posted on 5/25/19 at 4:41 pm to
quote:

He was a man of his times and he overcame his personal prejudices that had been ingrained in him at an early age to ultimately sign the Civil Rights Act (which was necessary, sadly, because of the racists in the Deep South who were running things then).


hahahahaha

He did it purely for political reasons.
Posted by Volvagia
Fort Worth
Member since Mar 2006
53590 posts
Posted on 5/25/19 at 4:41 pm to
quote:

The South started the American Civil War by firing on Fort Sumter, a Federal installation.


Serious question: are you deliberately ignoring that the shot happened months after succession?

That it was after months of talks and peace delegations to pay for federal properties and allow for peaceful removal of federal units and their gear?

That the timing of the shot was literally the day before the arrival of a full battle fleet being sent to allow for the landing of cargo vessels to resupply and reinforce the fort for full war, the removal of which would spill much more blood on both sides (no one died in the “battle”)

You are either ignorant of these facts, or you are choosing to ignore them in a factually accurate but untruthful condensed statement.
Posted by beerJeep
Louisiana
Member since Nov 2016
39216 posts
Posted on 5/25/19 at 4:43 pm to
quote:

Slavery was legal in the so-called "border" states, who chose to remain in the Union due to Lincoln's very pragmatic approach.


Awww look who is trying to play semantics.
quote:

Slavery was NOT legal in the true northern states, contrary to what you alleged above. They had abolished slavery long before the American Civil War.

“They weren’t the “true” north”

quote:

Lincoln was a man of his times, like all of us born into a certain period, with all the prejudices that come with that, but for his time, he was pretty enlightened compared to your slavery-loving distant relatives in the South who you seem to be so proud of.


What a round about way of saying “yeah, he was a white supremacist, but like, he was against slavery so let’s ignore the fact that he didn’t think whites and blacks were equal and never would be”

Go to bed, grandpa.
Posted by jimbeam
University of LSU
Member since Oct 2011
75703 posts
Posted on 5/25/19 at 4:46 pm to
Chenier Plain bawwww. Neva got taken
Posted by BuckyCheese
Member since Jan 2015
57778 posts
Posted on 5/25/19 at 4:49 pm to
quote:

Serious question: are you deliberately ignoring that the shot happened months after succession?


Are you deliberately ignoring the fact that firing on Sumpter started the actual war?
Posted by TigersFan64
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Oct 2014
4755 posts
Posted on 5/25/19 at 4:52 pm to
Secession was not constitutional. The pro-slavery people that you are so vigorously defending tried to break up the United States over their precious "right" to own human beings (just so you know the figures you seem to be so proud of). And many, many people at the time felt that had they allowed the South to secede, that would just be the beginning of the end of the Union. The American Republic then was still very young and was still considered a radical experiment by most of the world, which was still largely ruled by monarchies and aristocracies. The breakup of the Union was a very real possibility, and is why many men in the North forth so vigorously to defend it against the secessionist traitors in the South.

And just FYI, Lincoln and the Republican Party had a plan to end slavery that was very generous to the slave-holding states. Ironically, the decision by the Southern ruling planter class to go to war to defend the institution of slavery very likely actually hastened its demise long before it would have ended had there been no American Civil War. The plan to end slavery that the Republican Party had at the time would have ended it gradually and with compensation to slave owners. Bruce Levin makes a good case in his book, The Fall of the House of Dixie that slavery would have lasted in the U.S. much longer than it did had the war not happened, possibly even into the early 20th Century.
This post was edited on 5/25/19 at 4:53 pm
Posted by beerJeep
Louisiana
Member since Nov 2016
39216 posts
Posted on 5/25/19 at 5:05 pm to
quote:

Secession was not constitutional.


Not until after the civil war. Texas v white is what decided secession is unconstitutional. You, of course, know this.
Posted by TigersFan64
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Oct 2014
4755 posts
Posted on 5/25/19 at 5:07 pm to
The fact remains that there was no "right to secede" written into the U.S. Constitution.
You, of course, know this.

It's just sad that it took a bloody war started by the pro-slavery men you seem to be so proud of to put the issue to rest.
This post was edited on 5/25/19 at 5:10 pm
Posted by beerJeep
Louisiana
Member since Nov 2016
39216 posts
Posted on 5/25/19 at 5:09 pm to
quote:

The fact remains that there was no "right to secede" written into the U.S. Constitution.


And the facts remain there was nothing in the constitution saying you CANT secede. You, of course, know this as well.

You wanna play semantics, I’m down, grandpa.
This post was edited on 5/25/19 at 5:10 pm
Posted by TigersFan64
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Oct 2014
4755 posts
Posted on 5/25/19 at 5:12 pm to
quote:

And the facts remain there was nothing in the constitution saying you CANT secede.


The American Civil War put that issue to rest. Unfortunately, it took a bloody war started by treasonous pro-slavery men, who put their precious right to own people over the nation's greater good, to put it to rest. I know you are so sad that your precious South lost it's right to own human beings, but try to move on.
This post was edited on 5/25/19 at 5:14 pm
Posted by beerJeep
Louisiana
Member since Nov 2016
39216 posts
Posted on 5/25/19 at 5:15 pm to
quote:

know you are so sad that your precious South lost it's right to own human beings, but try to move on.


Link?

I think slavery is horrible. I’ve always thought this. The north had the right to own slaves longer than the racist south. I know, that horrible fact is a tough pill to swallow. But “they weren’t the real north”

The civil war was a pointless war. The split could have, and should have, been a peaceful one. Slavery was on its way out and would have been phased out naturally within the coming decades with the absolutely near vertical technological advancement that was underway.

I’m just throwing wrenches all up in your arguments

It’s okay, grandpa.
Posted by TigerstuckinMS
Member since Nov 2005
33687 posts
Posted on 5/25/19 at 6:09 pm to
quote:

The fact remains that there was no "right to secede" written into the U.S. Constitution.

"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."

Tell us what part of the Constitution prohibits secession or which one delegates it to the United States. Clown.
Posted by deeprig9
Unincorporated Ozora
Member since Sep 2012
76084 posts
Posted on 5/25/19 at 6:19 pm to
quote:

"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."


That sounds alot like the the 10th amendment.... included in the Bill of Rights... signed by Thomas Jefferson, among others.

Posted by antibarner
Member since Oct 2009
26924 posts
Posted on 5/25/19 at 6:22 pm to
I will always contend the war was not lost at Gettysburg, but Vicksburg. There were two schools of thought in 1863, to invade the North, or to send Longstreet west.

Davis had the wrong man in charge at Vicksburg to start with. Pemberton should have filled his warehouses and been ready for a long siege..Perhaps even evacuated his civilians, fewer mouths to feed. Grant and Sherman's troops never broke through the defenses, they starved the defenders out.

Had Lee sent Longstreet west with First Corps, Pickett, Hood and Mc Laws in Grants' rear along with 35, 000 that Johnston had mustered, along with some 30, 000 troops holding the defenses of Vicksburg, that's a lot of Rebels. More troops were across the river, and bring down Forrest to make things worse, Grant is in a world of hurt. He might have had to abandon the siege.

Outnumbered, tenuous supply lines with a master cavalryman in the area, he could risk being cut off. I think he has to back off.
This post was edited on 5/25/19 at 6:24 pm
Posted by deeprig9
Unincorporated Ozora
Member since Sep 2012
76084 posts
Posted on 5/25/19 at 6:27 pm to
I will always contend the war was lost in Atlanta.
Posted by BuckyCheese
Member since Jan 2015
57778 posts
Posted on 5/25/19 at 6:29 pm to
Was lost when the secesh fired on Sumter.
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