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Started By
Message
re: Running a generator through a dryer outlet
Posted on 9/10/24 at 12:17 pm to lsu777
Posted on 9/10/24 at 12:17 pm to lsu777
quote:
that depends on the size of the AC, how many circuits, what you have running, what you want to run etc
5 ton AC
2600sqft of house that I would want energized. Gas stove, gas tankless water heater, standard fridge and deep freezer, 4 bedrooms 3 bath all pretty standard with lights appliances, etc
1
Posted on 9/10/24 at 12:19 pm to lsu777
quote:Back at ya
jesus christ
quote:Thanks for acknowledging.
we cant make things completely risk free
Backfeeding through an outlet is inherently unsafe. Just having a suicide cord on the premises is unsafe. If you want to compare it to a car wreck, at least acknowledge that there are added precautions as if you are pulling a load or something like that.
Just don't tell people that following your simple steps eliminates all risk, especially since you've had to come back multiple times to add more safety steps to your original list.
Posted on 9/10/24 at 12:21 pm to NatalbanyTigerFan
Not an issue as long as you shut off main breaker so you don't send electricity backdown the power lines outside your home. I have done this plenty of times before having a natural gas generator.
Posted on 9/10/24 at 12:21 pm to lsu777
quote:
not if you flip the main and pull the meter which was explained over and over and over in this thread
If you turn the main breaker off, there is 0 need to pull the meter.
Posted on 9/10/24 at 12:25 pm to loopback
quote:
5 ton AC
2600sqft of house that I would want energized. Gas stove, gas tankless water heater, standard fridge and deep freezer, 4 bedrooms 3 bath all pretty standard with lights appliances, etc
based on that, the calculator says about 17.5KW is max draw so a 20kw or 22kw would be fine
just understand most of those are going to be air cooled. During an extended outage, oil needs to be checked daily, changed every 2-3 days and filter changed every other oil change. also needs to be shut down 1-2 hours every day
kohler makes a liquid cooled 24kw but its going to be 2x as much as a 20kw air cooled and be around 14grand before install
if you are looking for basic standby and lose electricity rarely unless its a storm....just get a 20 or 22kw air cooled and save the money
Posted on 9/10/24 at 12:25 pm to kengel2
quote:
If you turn the main breaker off, there is 0 need to pull the meter.
i agree, its just an extra precaution
Posted on 9/10/24 at 12:27 pm to NatalbanyTigerFan
6 UP VOTES 66 DOWN VOTES frick U SATAN
Posted on 9/10/24 at 12:27 pm to lsu777
quote:
no, turning main breaker does same thing but still should pull meter anyways
So you’re in here giving advice and you’re just spouting out unnecessary advice? Got it.
Posted on 9/10/24 at 12:30 pm to Motorboat
quote:
So you’re in here giving advice and you’re just spouting out unnecessary advice? Got it
umm that was in response that some were saying people could come behind and flip the breaker back on with no interconnect so i said just pull the meter too. i have said multiple times in the thread, dont have too but its an extra precaution but it has its own set of risk etc.
Posted on 9/10/24 at 12:32 pm to NatalbanyTigerFan
quote:
I just listened to a plant baw explain how to run your generator through your dryer outlet to power your house during an outage to a helper.
I have a 30A backfeed system on my house. It's basically an outside dryer outlet with its own breaker.
This post was edited on 9/10/24 at 12:33 pm
Posted on 9/10/24 at 12:36 pm to lsu777
quote:
just understand most of those are going to be air cooled.
Buddy of mine just put in a 23kw water cooled Generac on his house. He's a lawyer and usually buys way more than he needs...
I'm very jealous..
This post was edited on 9/10/24 at 12:39 pm
Posted on 9/10/24 at 12:38 pm to Korkstand
quote:
Just having a suicide cord on the premises is unsafe.
I converted mine to a female end so my wife can hook it up if she wants to...
Posted on 9/10/24 at 12:50 pm to lsu777
quote:
so can a lot of other things
jesus, maybe its because im comfortable with wiring and have wired houses and work as an engineer but yall over complicate things
1) flip main breaker and pull meter
2) flip off all breakers(you can flip back on as needed later)
3) hook up cord to dryer plug
4) start generator
5) plug cord into generator
6) flip back on breakers that are needed
there are reasons not to do this that i have mentioned plus insurance as others have mentioned. but its not some crazy wild arse idea either that means certain death like some of you like to think
I think you are kind of missing the point. Can it be done safely? Absolutely (although the suicide cord is generally problematic). But as the old saying goes: think about how intelligent the average person is, and then remember that 50% of the population is dumber.
I have the knowledge to safely backfeed a generator through a dryer outlet. I don’t do it (my dryer is gas so it’s a bit of a moot point) but I certainly could do it safely. I don’t doubt that you, along with many others, can do it safely.
That being said, I wouldn’t really advocate for people with no electrical knowledge to attempt it. People are shockingly (no pun intended) stupid when it comes to electricity.
Forget to open the main breaker or accidentally open it before disconnecting generator? You could kill somebody, damage your equipment, or start a fire. Accidentally wire a suicide cord incorrectly? You could kill somebody, damage your equipment, or start a fire. Forget to plug in the generator last, or fail to secure the end plugged into the dryer outlet? Same story.
There are tons of folks out there who can barely wire a light switch. These people shouldn’t even think about trying to backfeed 220V. Does that mean it’s inherently stupid for everyone? No, but I do think it’s a little irresponsible to make it out to be a cakewalk for folks with no electrical background when there are, in fact, multiple ways they can screw up and create a major hazard.
Posted on 9/10/24 at 12:52 pm to NatalbanyTigerFan
quote:
I just listened to a plant baw explain how to run your generator through your dryer outlet to power your house during an outage to a helper.
I can't believe people still do this. I'm sure there will be a GoFundMe soon to help replace all of that guy's belongings after the house fire.
It can be done, if you kill or even cause a lineman to encounter an energized circuit you will have violated a pretty serious law. Any method that does not include isolating the grounded conductor (neutral) can expose power company employees to lethal current which is not supposed to be present. It is illegal in most states, may be all, not certain. Lifting phase conductors will not isolate the grounded conductor, it will carry the unbalanced load between any phase conductors a load is connected to back to the power companies' transformer.
It doesn't matter if the drier has a neutral (30 amp 240 volt 4 wire) or not (30 amp 240 Volt 3 wire) either way any unbalanced load must go to ground somehow and that somehow is going to be through the neutral to the utility companies transformers center tap. That unbalanced load can be substantial, is not fused and is not supposed to be present at the transformer if the power is out.
Its also possible to feed that load back to soil that is wet/flooded and highly conductive and it can electrocute people who are not at all involved in the transformer. At times the utility will intentionally disconnect power for that very reason. Any source of power attached to the utility companies system belongs to the utility company....one of the reasons is because their employees need to control the power when they are working on the system. An unbalanced load derived from a generator is not controlled by those employees.
Posted on 9/10/24 at 12:54 pm to CaptainsWafer
quote:
ETA we shut off the main breaker. My BIL was also there and he’s an electrician. We were safe as were anyone working in any lines nearby.
So you isolated the grounded conductor? If you simply back fed an outlet you did not, you created a dangerous condition for anyone working on the system and possible anyone walking or standing in the vicinity of the utility companies transformer.
Posted on 9/10/24 at 12:57 pm to lsu777
quote:
i mean its not really that big of a deal so long as you flip main breaker and pull meter.
would prefer people dont do this though
Pulling a meter is illegal in every jurisdiction in the US. Doing so will not isolate the grounded conductor in most meter cans. Most meter cans are built with the grounded conductor feeding through the can directly from the panel / disconnect to the center tap of the utility companies transformer.
Posted on 9/10/24 at 12:59 pm to lsu777
quote:
i mean its not really that big of a deal so long as you flip main breaker and pull meter. would prefer people dont do this though
That’s if you just want to ignore that they now have a cord with hot prongs
Posted on 9/10/24 at 12:59 pm to Sao
quote:
I can't picture how using that outlet and breaker powers additional runs.
It will back feed the entire panel. As long as the drier breaker is on. It will do it with the main turned on as well....which is a seriously bad situation. If the grounded conductor is not isolated it will create a dangerous situation for anyone working on the system and possibly anyone near the utility company's transformer.
Posted on 9/10/24 at 1:01 pm to redstick13
quote:
Not really the issue. The issue is that you are backfeeding your neighborhood unless you pull your meter.
Pulling the meter does not isolate the grounded conductor in most cases. Its also illegal. Cutting the tag off a meter base for ANY reason without notification to the utility and the county if they have an electrical inspector is a violation of the law.
Posted on 9/10/24 at 1:01 pm to Dawgfanman
quote:
That’s why you turn off the main breaker to the house if you do this…
Turning off the main breaker does not isolate the grounded conductor.
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