re: Question for the OT lawyers about the Minneapolis cops charged with aiding and abetting

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All I'm saying is if you take the badge away and it was a group friends fighting an individual, doing the exact same actions, they would all be charged.

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Except that assault and battery is a crime; police arresting someone is not.

When you engage in a legal activity, it’s not accessory to a crime.

If you and friend enter a bank and you have no pretense that he is going to commit a crime and then he suddenly demands cash from the teller under threat, you aren’t an accessory. Accessory requires some level of intent to engage in criminal action.

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Yes, as he knelt on the guy's neck the other officers prevented the bystanders from stepping in. They didn't stop him and they also made sure nobody else stopped him.

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Again, I don’t see how that is a crime

There is also a significant power dynamic at play. Chauvin was the most senior and commanding officer at the scene. He was also a training officer and the two rookies were required to call him “sir” while under his authority.

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zero defense as to why he kept his knee on him for almost three minutes


Adrenaline, Fatigue, PTSD, Reaction to a drug he may have been taking. I am sure a Defense Attorney can present numerous mitigating circumstances or reasons to find his client innocent.

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Oh, I know a lawyer will come up with some kind of defense. But I'm talking about a reasonable, logical defense that that would seem believable to the average person to clear him from the charges. Adrenaline and fatigue won't fly because cops are expected to deal with those things. It's part of the job. If you're on a medication that could affect your work, you are supposed to report those things to your employer (my company has people sign forms stating that it's their responsibility to report any medication they may take that could hinder their performance while on the job). I suppose PTSD could be some kind of possibility, but that would have to be documented pretty well beforehand one way or the other.

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The answer per the Medical Examiners report is a no. George Floyd died from cardiopulmonary arrest.

Please explain to me how the knee to the neck resulted in George’s cardiopulmonary arrest.

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The ME's cause of death as of now is stated as "homicide."

It listed "cardiopulmonary arrest complicating law enforcement subdual, restraint and neck compression"
and it first said "cardiopulmonary arrest", but that is vague and in many states they won't even let them just list that. The report said "cardiopulmonary arrest complicating law enforcement subdual, restraint and neck compression."

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Please explain to me how the knee to the neck resulted in George’s cardiopulmonary arrest.

The ME's cause of death as of now is stated as "homicide."

It listed "cardiopulmonary arrest complicating law enforcement subdual, restraint and neck compression"
and it first said "cardiopulmonary arrest", but that is vague and in many states they won't even let them just list that. The report said "cardiopulmonary arrest complicating law enforcement subdual, restraint and neck compression."

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So did you answer the question in there that I asked? How did the knee cause the cardiopulmonary arrest?


Or is it more that

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If there aren't different laws in place for cops, the people filming it would be just as guilty

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I get what you are saying and think it's going to be a lot of gray area about the level to which the 3 other officers could have and should have intervened.


However, I don't see how that same logic applies to any other people around the scene in the least.

In fact, that Chauvine was being flanked by three other officers is actually some basis for the aiding and abetting charge against them.

That meant anyone doing more than telling Chauvin to get off --which it seems a lot of people were doing-- would have to physically fight four police officers to do anything beyond what they did: video document and tell the cop to get off.


To argue that an officer should "police" another officer who is breaking the law is a far different argument than that a regular civilian should physically "police" a police officer in the same situation.

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I wasn't trying to be controversial. I'm just genuinely curious. If one of the cops intervened he might have 4-5 other cops that didn't agree with his actions push him off. Particularly considering some of them were rookies. I do not think most of the cops outside of the neck kneeler will see much, if any jail time.

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Yeah, I don't think the prosecution will argue that it was a specifically a crime for the other officers to not step in as much as that not stopping him coupled with their supporting presence surrounding the scene "aided and abetted" Chauvin's actions.

Completely agree though that arguing all three of the other cops were intentionally "aiding and abetting" Chauvin is going to be difficult.


Seems right what others above that have said about the one officer who was not in training being on much shakier ground whereas the 2 training officers have a stronger defense.


It will be interesting to see how legislators try to address this if all three get off. I'm sure there will be a lot of calls to lower "complicity" requirements for police officers when witnessing another officer break the law/abuse power.

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So did you answer the question in there that I asked? How did the knee cause the cardiopulmonary arrest?

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Haha...well I added what you left out in the actual coroner's report which says that the coroner found the cause of death to rule it a homicide.

And the expert ruled that Floyd stopped breathing because of cardiopulmonary arrest caused by restraint and neck compression from the officers. That can be asphyxia from neck compression. The drugs and health conditions are contributing factors to his death which made his death more likely, but the coroner found that he stopped breathing and his heart stopped beating due to the restraint and neck compression's impact on his breathing.

As we can see in the main video, by the time the video started, Floyd was cuffed, face down and not resisting. The manual for that police department states that the technique Chauvin was using on Floyd's neck should only be used for people who are "actively aggressive." He held that position for over 8 minutes (close to 3 minutes after the man seemed to go unconscious and over a minute after the other officer said he found no pulse). Given the evidence and the coroner's findings, I'd say it's reasonable to conclude that Chauvin killed him due to the technique he was using on him (which he had no reason to use for that long).