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re: Laws proposed that bar interviewers from asking job applicants salary history
Posted on 4/16/17 at 8:36 am to East Coast Band
Posted on 4/16/17 at 8:36 am to East Coast Band
Because the government has a compelling interest in protecting individuals from invidious questions.
Salary history isn't one of those.
Salary history isn't one of those.
Posted on 4/16/17 at 8:38 am to East Coast Band
There really is no reason for an employer to ask for your salary history other than to gain personal research in how to pay you as little as possible.
The company already knows how much to pay that position, starting with the knowledge and history of the previous holder of that position. The company also knows the hard upper limit of salary that they are going to pay. What the applicant has made in the past is actually irrelevant, unless the company seeks a person who has been underpaid, that they can continue to underpay.
The company already knows how much to pay that position, starting with the knowledge and history of the previous holder of that position. The company also knows the hard upper limit of salary that they are going to pay. What the applicant has made in the past is actually irrelevant, unless the company seeks a person who has been underpaid, that they can continue to underpay.
Posted on 4/16/17 at 8:50 am to East Coast Band
quote:
There are a lot of things an interviewer can't ask.
An interviewer can ask anything he or she wants. First amendment and all that. You can pass a law making it illegal to ask certain questions. But it wouldn't pass a group of 6 year olds with a copy of the Bill of Rights
Posted on 4/16/17 at 8:52 am to SpqrTiger
quote:
The company already knows how much to pay that position, starting with the knowledge and history of the previous holder of that position. The company also knows the hard upper limit of salary that they are going to pay. What the applicant has made in the past is actually irrelevant, unless the company seeks a person who has been underpaid, that they can continue to underpay.
If you're making good money and want to switch, they can still lowball you. It means you don't like your current job and might be willing to take a pay cut to get away.
ETA: If you're not making a lot it probably means you're leaving the old job for better pay.
This post was edited on 4/16/17 at 8:53 am
Posted on 4/16/17 at 9:01 am to SpqrTiger
SpqrTiger, you cannot be more wrong. I ask about starting wage/salary, and ending (or current) wage/salary in every single interview i do. I do not do this for the purpose of low balling anyone.
I want to know that this person did something worthwhile while at that job. My position offers are set. They have never decreased for anyone. In a few situations, the offer did increase.
If you really have to hide stuff like this, you will never work for me.
I want to know that this person did something worthwhile while at that job. My position offers are set. They have never decreased for anyone. In a few situations, the offer did increase.
If you really have to hide stuff like this, you will never work for me.
Posted on 4/16/17 at 9:25 am to SpqrTiger
quote:
There really is no reason for an employer to ask for your salary history other than to gain personal research in how to pay you as little as possible.
IMO prices should be banned from being displayed on products in stores.
When you go to check out, the cashier can ask you how much you're willing to pay and if it's above the price threshold you can buy the product. Otherwise, you have to shelve it.
There really is no reason for a consumer to ask for a product's price other than to gain personal research in how to pay as little as possible for that product.
Posted on 4/16/17 at 9:31 am to baytiger
quote:
A nonzero percentage of companies have online applications with salary as a mandatory field.
Experienced this in college when asked how much i wanted. I put n/a or 0.
Still got offers
Posted on 4/16/17 at 9:39 am to Screaming Viking
quote:
I want to know that this person did something worthwhile while at that job. My position offers are set. They have never decreased for anyone. In a few situations, the offer did increase.
The information given is still for your benefit and not the benefit of the applicant. You say your offers are set. Do you tell the applicant what that salary is before the interview takes place? Because that's the information you're getting on the applicant before he walks through the door. The applicant is at an inherent disadvantage right off the bat. Thankfully, someone like you takes a more enlightened approach, but how could the applicant know that going in? Why should the applicant have to provide full disclosure beforehand, while the employer does not?
I just don't see how an applicant should be required to provide a lengthy salary history while the employer is not required to disclose the salary of everyone who held the position prior.
You say you want to know if the person accomplished something worthwhile. Can't you tell from the resume and the interview if he/she did or not? Why does salary history play a role in that? The bottom line is that salary history creates a bias on the interviewee before the interview even starts.
Posted on 4/16/17 at 9:42 am to efrad
quote:
When you go to check out, the cashier can ask you how much you're willing to pay and if it's above the price threshold you can buy the product. Otherwise, you have to shelve it
You know what? I would be okay with this system, as long as I had a full history of how much previous consumers paid for the item. Then we could start haggling with you at a disadvantage. Which is exactly what happens in a hiring situation when full salary history is disclosed.
Posted on 4/16/17 at 9:53 am to SpqrTiger
Spqr......holy crap a ton of questions there.
I never talk money on the first interview. Period. Either way. If money is brought up too quickly, i do not want them.
We spend time going over details of experiences, lessons, goals, why they are looking for different employment, why my company is of interest to them. My employees that will work directly with that person start the very first interview. I come in later and ask lots of "why's?"
I do not see the interview process as advantageous, or disadvantageous. If that person fits with us, and has a willingness to work, the money will work itself out.
If you are worried about advantages, and who has them, you must be a defensive/miserable interview. Go work for a union, where "seniority" gets you paid.
I never talk money on the first interview. Period. Either way. If money is brought up too quickly, i do not want them.
We spend time going over details of experiences, lessons, goals, why they are looking for different employment, why my company is of interest to them. My employees that will work directly with that person start the very first interview. I come in later and ask lots of "why's?"
I do not see the interview process as advantageous, or disadvantageous. If that person fits with us, and has a willingness to work, the money will work itself out.
If you are worried about advantages, and who has them, you must be a defensive/miserable interview. Go work for a union, where "seniority" gets you paid.
Posted on 4/16/17 at 10:07 am to SpqrTiger
quote:
You know what? I would be okay with this system, as long as I had a full history of how much previous consumers paid for the item. Then we could start haggling with you at a disadvantage. Which is exactly what happens in a hiring situation when full salary history is disclosed.
That's essentially what we do in the consumer marketplace now, being able to access competitors' prices easily on a smartphone, not to mention price comparison websites and services... On most products, no, you can't haggle in the store, but you can take your dollar to the lowest priced competitor. Thanks for proving my point ;)
Posted on 4/16/17 at 10:11 am to East Coast Band
That's bullshite.
Past salary history is a decent if not perfect barometer of the level of past responsibilities.
Past salary history is a decent if not perfect barometer of the level of past responsibilities.
Posted on 4/16/17 at 10:25 am to Screaming Viking
quote:
I never talk money on the first interview. Period. Either way. If money is brought up too quickly, i do not want them.
Of course you wouldn't bring it up in the first interview. You already have most of the information you need. Meanwhile, the interviewee has gone through an interview with you and doesn't have the same benefit. You don't see how this is unfair? He doesn't have the full view of what's possible for him. But you do.
You might not see the job interview as advantageous or disadvantageous, but you're not the one competing with potentially hundreds of applicants for the job. Why would you? Think about it.
As for your second ad hominem attack on me today... no, I'm actually a pleasant interview, and I would enjoy talking with you, even if a job was not on the line. But you seem to be a career employer, and I've never been anything but an employee. Your experience and mine are intrinsically different. If you think that my point of view is out of the ordinary for a person you interview, then you may not have as full an understanding of your candidates as you think. Just as every employer is not out to screw you, not every job candidate is carefree about his salary history and potential.
Posted on 4/16/17 at 10:31 am to efrad
quote:
That's essentially what we do in the consumer marketplace now, being able to access competitors' prices easily on a smartphone, not to mention price comparison websites and services... On most products, no, you can't haggle in the store, but you can take your dollar to the lowest priced competitor. Thanks for proving my point ;)
No, not quite. In the case of a job interview, the employer gets exclusive access to the employee's salary information. It's not made public, and the employee doesn't get to compete with others, having knowledge of their salaries, unlike the prices in a store.
Posted on 4/16/17 at 10:34 am to Dont_Call_Me_RAY
quote:
What's next, telling employers that they can't ask about previous work experience? or how long they worked on other jobs? Are employers supposed to just sit there and get a general feeling about an applicant?
As an employer, you HAVE to weigh in salary when making a choice. Sometimes I take a chance on a lessor experienced applicant if he/she will take less salary. This is because the job will require training anyway. As the employee progresses they become more valuable and therefor worth a higher salary.
I own/run a construction company that does civil concrete work and i can't ask about previous health issues until after someone is hired. I hired a guy and then had him fill out a med sheet and he put that he couldn't lift over 20 pounds, when I asked him if this was true or an error, he said he had a bad back and couldn't. What the frick am I supposed to do with a guy that can't lift 20 pounds in a construction setting?
Pertinent information should always be available during interviewing processes.
Posted on 4/16/17 at 10:39 am to Dont_Call_Me_RAY
quote:
Sometimes I take a chance on a lessor experienced applicant if he/she will take less salary. This is because the job will require training anyway. As the employee progresses they become more valuable and therefor worth a higher salary.
Hire lesser experienced applicant. They finish the training in half the expected time, and are worth more to the company than the more experienced applicant. Next, when they ask for a raise you give them the "not enough experience" line. After which the employee bails when another company will pay them more.
Posted on 4/16/17 at 10:43 am to East Coast Band
Over reach. Also, I don't see how this will help with gender equality for pay. Is it because women tell the truth and men lie?
Posted on 4/16/17 at 10:50 am to Bjorn Cyborg
quote:
I assumed everyone just lied anyway
Some of the ask for tax returns from serious candidates. Not kidding. One of the big 4 specifically.
This post was edited on 4/16/17 at 10:55 am
Posted on 4/16/17 at 10:51 am to East Coast Band
Overreach.
If you want to make that a policy for gov't job interviews fine.
But Private companies should be allowed to ask what they want.
If you want to make that a policy for gov't job interviews fine.
But Private companies should be allowed to ask what they want.
Posted on 4/16/17 at 10:58 am to Bjorn Cyborg
In my limited experience because of the threat of lawsuits many previous employers respond to prospective employers by answering only three questions regarding employment history: start date, leave date, and final salary. No recommendations, no critique of work habits, etc. Its not worth it.
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