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re: Latest Updates: Russia-Ukraine Conflict
Posted on 5/17/25 at 8:02 am to AU86
Posted on 5/17/25 at 8:02 am to AU86
quote:
And doubleb continues to dodge my question: Who is going to stop them?
Well he can't answer a simple yes or no question even to this day about what his own beliefs are, so that isn't surprising
0
Posted on 5/17/25 at 8:10 am to crazy4lsu
quote:
Lol. Russia was supposed to be the near-peer to the US
This is completely irrelevant and a deflection from his actual point.
People with Ukraine Derangement Syndrome who care more about Ukraine than their own countries for whatever reason (maybe Ukraine is their country?) don't apply standards with any consistency. A western backed Ukranian army with an obvious technology advantage couldn't hold Kursk... Russia has successfully held a large swathe of land. Both are irrefutable facts, however you feel about it and however "bad" it looks on Russia.
Some of you are letting the fact that Ukraine has done pretty well delude you into thinking the outcome will change.
Posted on 5/17/25 at 8:14 am to crazy4lsu
quote:
Why haven't they forced their terms by conquest already? They've been bogged down for a few years now. If their victory requires the absence of Western arms, then that's not the flex you think it is.
Why are y'all so focused on the perceptions of each army from January or 2022? It's May 2025.
Do you think Ukraine gets out of this with all of their territory in tact? If not, why do you keep bringing up that "they put up a good fight!"? Only took the backing of the entire west, emptying of stockpiles, and who knows how many Ukrainian lives.
Posted on 5/17/25 at 8:26 am to VolSquatch
quote:
Why are y'all so focused on the perceptions of each army from January or 2022? It's May 2025.
Are they not bogged down?
quote:
Do you think Ukraine gets out of this with all of their territory in tact?
I think that this is going to be a major geopolitical conundrum for the rest of the century. The immediate territorial situation is less important to me than the geopolitical situation, which favors one conclusion.
quote:
If not, why do you keep bringing up that "they put up a good fight!"?
I'm confused. Where did I say this?
quote:
Only took the backing of the entire west, emptying of stockpiles, and who knows how many Ukrainian lives.
The support from the West has been slow-played and inconsistent. The idea that the support was unconditional from the beginning is not factual. Its been piecemeal and very slow and has had to deal with the reality of military procurement.
Posted on 5/17/25 at 8:35 am to VolSquatch
quote:
This is completely irrelevant and a deflection from his actual point.
No, it isn't. Why haven't they Russians been able to enforce their claims on the battlefield? They weren't able to enforce those claims well before the West was behind Ukraine.
quote:
A western backed Ukranian army with an obvious technology advantage couldn't hold Kursk... Russia has successfully held a large swathe of land.
An army in the middle of a massive transformation itself was able to invade and hold a portion of Russian territory with a massive manpower disadvantage.
quote:
Some of you are letting the fact that Ukraine has done pretty well delude you into thinking the outcome will change.
And some of you are completely deluded about the geopolitical consequences. Everything about this situation suggests that this current conflict is only a phase of a much longer conflict. If you think this is going to be the only conflict in the region, then you are deluded. It is going to be a terrible situation unless something massive changes.
Posted on 5/17/25 at 8:51 am to crazy4lsu
quote:
Russia's best way to win is to hope the alliance gets tired of supporting Ukraine. Their battlefield gains don't suggest they have the ability to take over another region of Ukraine, let alone four more.
There is also a serious cost for Russia holding regions with a large majority of Ukrainians in them. Partisans happen.
Posted on 5/17/25 at 9:27 am to AU86
quote:
You didn't answer my question. Who is going to stop them? If the answer is they can't be stopped what is the purpose of continuing the war? How can Ukraine reverse this?
Sorry, unlike JB and some others I don’t live on the message boards.
Ukraine with western help is stopping them right now and have for over three years.
The war continues because Ukraine believes they can continue to hold on.
As for Ukraine reversing things. They did once already maybe they can do it again.
Posted on 5/17/25 at 9:33 am to crazy4lsu
The Russian firehoses here get more and more upset every day because Ukraine won’t surrender.
Have you noticed that?
Have you noticed that?
Posted on 5/17/25 at 9:36 am to VolSquatch
quote:
Some of you are letting the fact that Ukraine has done pretty well delude you into thinking the outcome will change.
Are you that dense? The outcome has already changed because of Ukraine’s staunch defense. We are already seeing a weaker Russia.
The longer the war goes Russian weaknesses will become more pronounced.
Posted on 5/17/25 at 10:22 am to PoppedRiser
quote:
You were shocked that Russia gains 20 sq. km every day last several weeks up from 10-15 last several months because you don't actually follow any reliable military bloggers and mappers. If you just rely on pro-Ukrainan rosy updates on here(which are peak cope selectio) it will seem suprising to you that Russia is making increasing gains constantly and has been gaining daily 9:1 or 10:1 land gains relatively to Ukraine basically the last 2 years with a short exception of Ukrainian Kursk blitz, which Ukrainians now completely lost and got pushed out even further into their own territory.
Let it sink in that Ukraine couldn't hold 1,000sq km of Russian land for a year while Russia has been holding 112,000 sq. km for 3 years and constantly expanding it. In the meantime Ukraine and Zelensky and his pimps turned Ukraine into Worse Korea 2.0
Comrade, we measure in freedom units here in America.
Posted on 5/17/25 at 10:26 am to VolSquatch
Posted on 5/17/25 at 10:51 am to doubleb
Trump to talk to Putin on May 19 in push to end 'bloodbath'
by Olena Goncharova May 17, 2025 6:20 PM
U.S. President Donald Trump said he will be speaking, by telephone, to President Vladimir Putin of Russia on Monday, at 10 a.m.
Trump’s comments come as peace talks in Istanbul on May 16 ended with no breakthrough, and Russia once again issued sweeping demands, including Ukraine’s adoption of neutral status, dropping claims for war reparations from Moscow and the recognition of its loss of Crimea and four occupied regions none of which Russia fully controls.
"The subjects of the call will be stopping the 'bloodbath' that is killing, on average, more than 5,000 Russian and Ukrainian soldiers a week, and trade," he wrote on Truth Social.
"I will then be speaking to President Zelensky of Ukraine and then, with President Zelensky, various members of NATO," he added. "Hopefully it will be a productive day, a ceasefire will take place, and this very violent war — a war that should have never happened — will end. God bless us all!!!"
The Kyiv Independent
by Olena Goncharova May 17, 2025 6:20 PM
U.S. President Donald Trump said he will be speaking, by telephone, to President Vladimir Putin of Russia on Monday, at 10 a.m.
Trump’s comments come as peace talks in Istanbul on May 16 ended with no breakthrough, and Russia once again issued sweeping demands, including Ukraine’s adoption of neutral status, dropping claims for war reparations from Moscow and the recognition of its loss of Crimea and four occupied regions none of which Russia fully controls.
"The subjects of the call will be stopping the 'bloodbath' that is killing, on average, more than 5,000 Russian and Ukrainian soldiers a week, and trade," he wrote on Truth Social.
"I will then be speaking to President Zelensky of Ukraine and then, with President Zelensky, various members of NATO," he added. "Hopefully it will be a productive day, a ceasefire will take place, and this very violent war — a war that should have never happened — will end. God bless us all!!!"
The Kyiv Independent
This post was edited on 5/17/25 at 10:52 am
Posted on 5/17/25 at 11:00 am to doubleb
quote:
The outcome has already changed because of Ukraine’s staunch defense.
No, it hasn't
Posted on 5/17/25 at 11:03 am to crazy4lsu
quote:
The support from the West has been slow-played and inconsistent. The idea that the support was unconditional from the beginning is not factual. Its been piecemeal and very slow and has had to deal with the reality of military procurement.
They have been getting arms from the west since 2014. The idea that it just started after the war is not factual. They were very well equipped from the start.
quote:
Are they not bogged down?
Sure, but you related that to the perception in 2022, which isnt particularly relevant at all in 2025
Posted on 5/17/25 at 11:10 am to MoarKilometers
quote:
omrade, we measure in freedom units here in America.
You go into a trolling deflection so we can talk about your username?
Miliitary mappers use km because European metric and what not, and the war is in Eastern Europe afterall.
Posted on 5/17/25 at 11:15 am to VolSquatch
quote:
quote:The outcome has already changed because of Ukraine’s staunch defense.
No, it hasn't
Definitely has.
It’s not as simple as a win or a loss,
There are various outcomes depending on how this war plays out. We already know the outcome has changed dramatically when Russia was stopped and thrown back in 2022. We know the outcome changed when Ukraine’s first counteracted and again when their counter offense failed.
The end result certainly appears to be a Russian victory although the results of that victory have yet to be determined and probably won’t be for awhile.
Posted on 5/17/25 at 11:25 am to crazy4lsu
quote:
Lol. Russia was supposed to be the near-peer to the US. Instead they got bogged down by a country that is more than 100 million people smaller and in 3 years of fighting, haven't seen out any of their original war goals. Cope bitch.
Sounds like you've got that covered.
It's holding for 3 years because their government and economy is sponsored by US taxes and EUs, and they've been given all the leftover NATO stockpiles of artillery/howitzers/tanks/APCs and intel. I suspect most long range weapon systems are actually operated by US/NATO soldiers and US has since admitted it. To drive the point home how dependent Ukros are, they even outsource Ukrainian surgeries to EU because Ukrainians don't have the medical capacity to treat their wounded.
They're basically a meat puppet and all Zelensky supplies is Ukrianian meat that he keeps inside the borders so it doesn't flee. I always get a chuckle when Ukraine starts talking about returning migrants who fled b/c they need it for the war effort.
In a nutshell, this is Ukraine, except the sheep have no wool to shave:
As soon as US stops
Posted on 5/17/25 at 11:54 am to PoppedRiser
Didnt you say you were leaving?
Posted on 5/17/25 at 11:58 am to doubleb
quote:
Definitely has. It’s not as simple as a win or a loss, There are various outcomes depending on how this war plays out. We already know the outcome has changed dramatically when Russia was stopped and thrown back in 2022. We know the outcome changed when Ukraine’s first counteracted and again when their counter offense failed. The end result certainly appears to be a Russian victory although the results of that victory have yet to be determined and probably won’t be for awhile.
It's not just a "loss" for Ukraine, it's a death sentence for the Ukraine that existed in the last 30 some years. They went from 40 million people to around 25 million, with probably a million of crippled and disabled males from the war, and that's while the borders are still locked and back when USAID was flowing. It's probably closer to 20 million mark currently. Their infrastructure has been bombed to shite which Soviets took decades to put up sparing no costs. Ukrainian power grid and plants were extremely beefed up by USSR because in any conflict it would be the critical stop against an offensive. Now most of it is gone.
Once the war stops, there will inevitably be internal problems. I don't know if it'll spiral into another 2014, but I can safely say it won't be a place you want to visit as a tourist. More people will try to flee to EU, US and Russia for work and look for a safer place to live. It won't be a brain drain, because "brains" left Ukraine around 2014 when smart people saw that it was heading towards the suicide phase of a Ukrainian ex-SSR.
AS far as getting the W, Russia can and will claim it. They showed that they can outmatch all of NATO military production capacity with their own production, they can innovated during the war and learn from mistakes, and their society can accept large losses in stride while US public put the pressure on military to withdraw from Iraq after losing 5,000 soldiers. 5000 soldiers is about what Russia loses in 3-4 weeks in Ukraine on a good month(and Ukraine is facing a higher number than that, btw).
Russia has an intangible force multiplier in wars- their ability to grind and grit it out while their rear units innovate and make tangible progress. They've shown it in real time with fiber optic FPVs, FAB range extending glide kits, large suicide drones, and tank "cope" cages that now everyone uses.
quote:
Didnt you say you were leaving?
I might stick around to see anyone here actually changes their viewpoint. You specifically seem like you can change cause you're at least not denying the reality. Sure you have a murky understanding of that region and what Soviets were, but a few well narrated videos by Mark Felton and you'll be on the right track.
Let's get you started:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eozIOzO0P_0
This post was edited on 5/17/25 at 12:12 pm
Posted on 5/17/25 at 12:11 pm to PoppedRiser
You said you were leaving, but now it seems you are working with JB and the Russian chamber of commerce.
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