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Started By
Message
re: LA Legis trying to increase tax on cigars, pipe tobacco
Posted on 6/4/15 at 10:36 am to Jcorye1
Posted on 6/4/15 at 10:36 am to Jcorye1
quote:
The States do, because they'll lose in court the next time the Master Settlement Agreement gets litigated.
Even in the case of NYC, the cost of policing these underground markets is probably more than the revenue they will recover from the tobacco tax.
0
Posted on 6/4/15 at 10:37 am to TheCaterpillar
quote:
Pretty tough for a tobacco company to get out of their 10 billion annual MSA payment because 5 hoodrats get ticketed per year selling cigarettes without a license. There isn't proof they even came from another state.
Not really, and it's not 5 hoodrats. The states have to prove that over ~97% of all cigarettes sold in that state were meant to be sold in that state. It gets crazy once you start involving sovereign Native American tribes.
Seeing as how New York received over 737 million dollars last year in MSA money alone, I'm relatively sure they want to do everything in their power to maintain that money.
Posted on 6/4/15 at 10:38 am to TheCaterpillar
quote:
I believe the savings from future healthcare costs would ease the pain. Imagine if you lived in a state where NO ONE smoked. Life expectancy would be 5 years more on average than other states
Not necessarily. Just think of the extra social security payments and Medicare costs that would be incurred over the course of those 5 years.
Posted on 6/4/15 at 10:44 am to TheCaterpillar
quote:
Legalize weed and tax the hell out of it
Why are people fine with taxing the hell out of anything? That has to be the most absurd statement someone can make. I don't even smoke, but I sure as hell don't think the government has the right to tax something like that.
Posted on 6/4/15 at 10:47 am to MrLarson
quote:
Why are people fine with taxing the hell out of anything? That has to be the most absurd statement someone can make. I don't even smoke, but I sure as hell don't think the government has the right to tax something like that.
This is an interesting argument when it comes to MJ. One reason why I don't have a huge problem with it is that weed is really easy to grow at home. It wouldn't take much to get around the tax and if it were legal there's no way we could enforce a "grow it yourself" type tax. It would be too widely spread to police.
This post was edited on 6/4/15 at 10:48 am
Posted on 6/4/15 at 10:50 am to upgrayedd
You'd be surprised how many people brew their own diesel fuel.
Posted on 6/4/15 at 10:53 am to Jcorye1
I guess I missed your point there.
Posted on 6/4/15 at 10:55 am to Cole Beer
quote:
Yet wealthy people and businesses should pay nothing, ever?
Thus the cigar tax. Mostly Richie Rich dudes smoke stogies.
well, except for those Swisher Sweets.
Posted on 6/4/15 at 11:20 am to MrLarson
quote:
Why are people fine with taxing the hell out of anything? That has to be the most absurd statement someone can make. I don't even smoke, but I sure as hell don't think the government has the right to tax something like that.
Well I didn’t get into the specifics, but there are different layers of marijuana tax. First off, I am a HUGE proponent of full-on legalization. However, I am not unrealistic in that I know it will take the promise of heavy tax revenue to do so. I believe that is the lesser of two evils and I’m willing to accept it. Secondly, I don’t think, if someone buys marijuana with a doctor’s prescription that it should be taxed heavily. Recreational marijuana though should be taxed like cigarettes IMO. People hate taxes, I understand that. But in our country, that pays for shite like better infrastructure and education for our children. I am ok with paying taxes for those things. It is all about proper allocation and accountability for politicians who promise to allocate it appropriately.
Additionally to your point, I don’t want to tax everything. In fact, I want to tax shite more that is bad for you and tax things less that are good for you. Produce/veggies, juices, brown rice, etc. should be tax free while Twinkies and soft drinks should have double the tax, especially if they are completely manufactured and produced out of state. Any food/drink that creates in-state jobs will have a bit less tax on it.
That’s just me though.
ETA:
And I totally think it should be legal and untaxable if someone grows weed at home for personal use. That's not as "easy" as people think it is, especially if you want high grade weed. That stuff requires around the clock care and is usually grown indoors which can be an expensive operation.
This post was edited on 6/4/15 at 11:29 am
Posted on 6/4/15 at 11:40 am to REG861
quote:
I wonder if this is related to our state's current budget crisis
Not at all. The radio commercial supporting it says it's to be supported because it will save 34000 lives and stop 21000 kids from smoking. Of course it has nothing to do with revenue. Your government just cares about you.
Posted on 6/4/15 at 11:59 am to upgrayedd
quote:
So they want to tax items that are much more likely to be consumed by the wealthy? They're not even trying to hide it anymore. What legislator drafted this bill?
Ritchie authored the cigarette tax bill, the cigar/other amendment was added by the Senate Finance committee with no objections.
And the biggest problem is, it won't affect the rich much as they probably don't care, but it will affect those that aren't rich but enjoy cigars, etc., AND local tobacconists who will see even more sales go to the internet.
I understand the cigarette tax but it's stupid as hell to lump in cigars with that.
Posted on 6/4/15 at 12:08 pm to USMCTiger03
quote:
I understand the cigarette tax but it's stupid as hell to lump in cigars with that.
I actually agree, which contradicts my earlier point. After further thought, the cigar and pipe tobacco seem like a niche market. That can't generate a ton of revenue and just hurts small, local specialty shops.
Cigarettes are super common and sold by every gas station, so that's different.
Posted on 6/4/15 at 12:18 pm to TheCaterpillar
So you selectively want to tax things that you don't like? Have you ever heard of social engineering?
Posted on 6/4/15 at 12:25 pm to Hammertime
Funny factoid -
The representative who introduced the bill smokes 2-3 packs/day.
The representative who introduced the bill smokes 2-3 packs/day.
Posted on 6/4/15 at 12:28 pm to 54BogTiger
Jesus Christ, I have been smoking for 15 years, and only smoke 1/2 to 1 pack every 24hrs. That's nuts
Posted on 6/4/15 at 12:35 pm to Upperdecker
quote:
think this tax should be on cigs
proposed 112% increase on cigs
This post was edited on 6/4/15 at 12:45 pm
Posted on 6/4/15 at 12:37 pm to Hammertime
quote:
So you selectively want to tax things that you don't like? Have you ever heard of social engineering?
Lol wut? How did you get that from what I wrote?
I love marijuana and want to tax it. I love alcohol and want to tax it. The potential revenue going towards infrastructure and education is worth it to me.
I don't want to tax local specialty shops that sell cigars because the revenue isn't worth the impact to local businesses. People will get cigars online. People aren't going to stop buying cigarettes and beer at stores. (or weed if legal)
Posted on 6/4/15 at 12:43 pm to TheCaterpillar
This
quote:
Additionally to your point, I don’t want to tax everything. In fact, I want to tax shite more that is bad for you and tax things less that are good for you
Posted on 6/4/15 at 12:43 pm to Hammertime
You don't drive on Highland Rd?
And that's not a good metaphor, roads are for everyone's benefit, they can increase property values and they're an investment that requires occasional maintenance. smokers getting their cigs does not benefit everyone, it actually hurts many people by secondhand smoke, littering with cig butts, and extreme healthcare costs
And that's not a good metaphor, roads are for everyone's benefit, they can increase property values and they're an investment that requires occasional maintenance. smokers getting their cigs does not benefit everyone, it actually hurts many people by secondhand smoke, littering with cig butts, and extreme healthcare costs
Posted on 6/4/15 at 12:44 pm to USMCTiger03
They're also trying to pass a tax on electronic cigarette liquid under the tobacco tax.
Not sure if it's under the same bill or not.
Not sure if it's under the same bill or not.
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