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Started By
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re: In general, why aren't utilities underground to avoid loss of power?
Posted on 7/8/24 at 5:40 pm to HubbaBubba
Posted on 7/8/24 at 5:40 pm to HubbaBubba
It's the lineman industrial complex.
Posted on 7/8/24 at 5:47 pm to tgrgrd00
quote:Seems like that's likely due to poor materials or workmanship. I've lived in my home for 23 years and only lost power ever during the rolling blackouts in Texas from the big freeze a few years back.
Entergy is out here literally digging up people's yards to repair broken lines once a month. My neighbor's yard in front of their house has been dug up twice in the last 6 months.
Posted on 7/8/24 at 5:50 pm to HubbaBubba
We have some areas here with overhead and some with underground.
I don’t know of any that started overground and it’s all newer developments with underground. I can’t imagine trying to bury lines at this point downtown, in areas like the Highlands or Old Louisville where you have a lot of historical properties and so on.
ETA: I’m guessing we’d also have issues here in the state with the limestone we sit on top of. I know how quick cost skyrockets when you’re putting in a pool and hit a limestone slab. Can’t imagine for lines.
I don’t know of any that started overground and it’s all newer developments with underground. I can’t imagine trying to bury lines at this point downtown, in areas like the Highlands or Old Louisville where you have a lot of historical properties and so on.
ETA: I’m guessing we’d also have issues here in the state with the limestone we sit on top of. I know how quick cost skyrockets when you’re putting in a pool and hit a limestone slab. Can’t imagine for lines.
This post was edited on 7/8/24 at 5:52 pm
Posted on 7/8/24 at 5:58 pm to HubbaBubba
quote:
Seems like that's likely due to poor materials or workmanship.
Maybe. Or maybe it’s due to soil conditions, water, the age of the infrastructure, or any number of other factors that are unique in a given location.

quote:
I've lived in my home for 23 years and only lost power ever during the rolling blackouts in Texas from the big freeze a few years back.
Where in Texas? I’m willing to bet it’s an apples-to-oranges comparison.
Posted on 7/8/24 at 6:01 pm to Bucktail1
quote:
People on here say heat, but it has nothing to do with that. 90% of utilities in Austin are underground and it’s a hell of a lot hotter there than it is here. I’ve lived in both areas. It’s all about doing things the easy cheap way in LA
Simply not true
Posted on 7/8/24 at 6:45 pm to TU Rob
quote:
Higher costs to bury them, but certain areas are willing to do so for better looks and less loss of power.
Entergy finally broke down and finally buried its lines between Grand Isle and Fourchon.
Fourchon still needs its aerial High Voltage Main Lines from the Transmission Network, but once you get to Grand Isle it is much simpler to run the lines underground for a few miles till you get to Elmers Island.
The Main Transmission lines were wooden and some of them were in the middle of the marsh, about a decade ago Entergy moved those lines to steel poles near LA - 1, and replaced the wooden poles between Larose and Golden Meadow. After Ida, I don't think many of those lines had issues, but the last miles to residences had major issues and in some areas had to be completely rebuilt from the ground up. Also, the main roadside distribution lines between Golden Meadow and Grand Isle were replaced with thicker poles that are closer spaced, and have sections the cancelled Keystone pipeline that were repurposed as caissons to better secure the poles in the ground that were filled with aggregates.
Before Ida

After Ida

Posted on 7/8/24 at 6:55 pm to lostinbr
quote:
lostinbr
Good answer. The only thing I’d dispute in your post is “oil-filled conduit”. Can you elaborate?
And to back up your statements, almost all transmission lines run above ground and that’s where all the power begins. It eventually drops to distribution voltage but is still likely above ground. Then once the power gets to residences it may be buried but it still begins above ground on poles.
As an example, my neighborhood is single-ended (one incoming feeder) and power begins above ground and is buried underground once it gets to my street. Even if my street has cables underground, those above ground cables are more likely to get knocked down by trees before they’re even in my neighborhood.
All electricity begins somewhere and it likely is above ground most of its journey to your home.
This post was edited on 7/8/24 at 7:01 pm
Posted on 7/8/24 at 7:00 pm to HubbaBubba
In our hood many are under ground.
Mostly from pole to house is buried.
Doesn’t help much when the power poles coming into the hood fall.
Mostly from pole to house is buried.
Doesn’t help much when the power poles coming into the hood fall.
Posted on 7/8/24 at 7:08 pm to HubbaBubba
My company does line maintenance for all major power companies, been working around power lines for 30 years . Always thought I might be out of a job once all power lines were buried, but I've talked to linemen and they all tell me it's too expensive to bury them all. They say it's a bitch to find problems and a real bitch to work on underground.
Most rich neighborhoods I work around have them but there's always an above powerline feeding them so when trees hit them they're out anyway.
Most rich neighborhoods I work around have them but there's always an above powerline feeding them so when trees hit them they're out anyway.
Posted on 7/8/24 at 7:13 pm to Bamadog75
quote:
they all tell me it's too expensive to bury them all.
Roughly 5x more expensive. O&M expense is a tough one but there is traditionally some ROI recapture from underground but it’s doesn’t even come close to offsetting it the initial expense.
It’s an easy one really for anyone who wants it, are you willing to double or more your electrical bill to pay for it? The utilities would love it because they would make more money, but the reality is most places can’t afford it.
This post was edited on 7/8/24 at 7:14 pm
Posted on 7/8/24 at 7:18 pm to Bucktail1
quote:If you ever laid eyes on the distribution line power grid maps of this country, you'd understand how ignorant this comment is.
People on here say heat, but it has nothing to do with that. 90% of utilities in Austin are underground and it’s a hell of a lot hotter there than it is here. I’ve lived in both areas. It’s all about doing things the easy cheap way in LA
If, say, Entergy Louisiana wanted to bury all - hell let's just go with half- of their distribution line network, the power bill for their customers, in order to offset the costs, would cause a revolt with heads on spikes outside the Entergy LA main office.
You've no idea what you're talking about, on several fronts.
Posted on 7/8/24 at 7:20 pm to billjamin
80% of ours are underground and we pay about 2.5x for electricity than our family in LA. Thankfully our heat is NG and our summers are mild.
Posted on 7/8/24 at 7:28 pm to Cuz413
quote:
If the service is a 13.8kv or 19.2 kv system, you don't just tap into it. Stress cones and modular splices are required and are a pain to deal with since the magnetic properties of voltage that high are constantly degrading the semicon areas of the cones.
You gonna do 220?
Posted on 7/8/24 at 7:34 pm to LSUBoo
"Maintenance cost" is fat less considering you are less likely to have a hurricane topple over a tree and destroy your underground wiring.
Yes, cost is expensive. It's easier for new developments to build their utilities underground vs. retrofitting existing communities with above ground cables established. Having to build around existing utilities is why retrofitting is super costly.
With the amount that Entergy execs make, you would think they could ease the burden and help the little man out.
Yes, cost is expensive. It's easier for new developments to build their utilities underground vs. retrofitting existing communities with above ground cables established. Having to build around existing utilities is why retrofitting is super costly.
With the amount that Entergy execs make, you would think they could ease the burden and help the little man out.
Posted on 7/8/24 at 7:43 pm to bapple
quote:
The only thing I’d dispute in your post is “oil-filled conduit”. Can you elaborate?
My understanding is that medium-high voltage underground power lines often (usually?) utilize a dielectric oil fill that acts as an additional insulator, helps remove heat, and helps prevent water ingress.
If I’m mistaken, someone feel free to correct me. Admittedly it’s not my field.
Posted on 7/8/24 at 7:48 pm to HubbaBubba
You rarely see overhead utilities in new neighborhoods. The cost of replacing overhead utilities is a bit prohibitive, I think. And overhead is (or at leas it once was) cheaper for initial installations in rural areas.
Posted on 7/8/24 at 7:51 pm to HubbaBubba
if the Fed Gov won't spend money to improve the infrastructure we have now, they sure as shite wont pay to essentially redo what is already out there.
Posted on 7/8/24 at 7:56 pm to HubbaBubba
It's very expensive. Like A LOT.
Posted on 7/8/24 at 8:15 pm to tgrgrd00
It always amuses me when people put this expensive landscaping in their front servitudes in these newer neighborhoods and then get all upset when they have to dig it up to repair the utilities
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