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Posted on 3/21/20 at 10:30 am to Pettifogger
quote:Is there any evidence "we're already strained"?
If we're already strained with PPE and ICU beds
I have a relative who works at OLOL in Baton Rouge and she says their patient room occupancy now is low because so many non-emergency surgeries have been canceled.
Posted on 3/21/20 at 10:31 am to Salmon
quote:
if they are wrong and they crush the economy, yeah, nobody will take them seriously next time
if they are wrong, and we don't see real numbers, it will unfortunately turn into a "boy who cried wolf" situation and will be disastrous if/when a real one hits
They will credit the overreaction for it though. When you assume the conclusion that the virus will kill 4.5 million Americans, you can justify any measures taken when the conclusion doesn’t happen.
Posted on 3/21/20 at 10:32 am to LSURussian
quote:
have a relative who works at OLOL in Baton Rouge and she says their patient room occupancy now is low because so many non-emergency surgeries have been canceled.
Regular patient beds and ICU beds are 2 different things though
Posted on 3/21/20 at 10:32 am to LSURussian
quote:
Is there any evidence "we're already strained"?
I mentioned that
It's all anecdotes and third party reporting, at least that I've seen. That nurse on here has discussed it, but I have no way of actually measuring how much is legit, how much is false and how much is exaggerated truth with good intentions (trying to scare people into taking it seriously)
Posted on 3/21/20 at 10:33 am to lsunurse
quote:Really?!? Wow! That's new information for me! Thanks!!!
Regular patient beds and ICU beds are 2 different things though
Okay, let me try again for the word parsers: she says patient load in the entire hospital is low now. She works in the infectious disease department.
Posted on 3/21/20 at 10:34 am to Pettifogger
quote:
This is the first real pandemic in American modernity.
HIV?
1968 flu?
Posted on 3/21/20 at 10:36 am to SabiDojo
quote:
They will credit the overreaction for it though. When you assume the conclusion that the virus will kill 4.5 million Americans, you can justify any measures taken when the conclusion doesn’t happen.
The issue will be that there won't be any credible comparisons where the math allows a serious assumption that lesser/no measures could have yielded a similar outcome. Well, I'll caveat that with whatever we may ultimately learn about the virus that we don't know now, like impacts of weather or whatever.
But from a pure statistical modeling perspective - I don't see any rational basis for concluding this wouldn't have resulted in tens of thousands (or really more) deaths. Yes, vulnerable populations mostly, but that's a large swath of people and most of them probably aren't on death's door.
Posted on 3/21/20 at 10:38 am to LSURussian
My point is.....what is she saying about the ICUs?
Are they also low occupancy?
That’s my point smart arse
(Btw....I work in infection control at my hospital as well so I’m also very aware of everything going on in my hospital right now)
Are they also low occupancy?
That’s my point smart arse
(Btw....I work in infection control at my hospital as well so I’m also very aware of everything going on in my hospital right now)
Posted on 3/21/20 at 10:46 am to SabiDojo
quote:
Are hospitals going to expand their critical care units after all of this? I doubt it.
They'd all go out of business. Very expensive overhead. Some have "pods" they can activate in periods of high traffic, but a mass increase of ICU beds in this country will never, ever happen unless they basically remove all red tape and regulation (which they won't, because it is there to protect patients).
Posted on 3/21/20 at 10:48 am to TheCaterpillar
quote:
They'd all go out of business. Very expensive overhead. Some have "pods" they can activate in periods of high traffic, but a mass increase of ICU beds in this country will never, ever happen unless they basically remove all red tape and regulation (which they won't, because it is there to protect patients).
And who is going out of business now?
Posted on 3/21/20 at 10:49 am to LSURussian
This post was edited on 3/21/20 at 11:43 am
Posted on 3/21/20 at 10:49 am to SabiDojo
quote:
They'd all go out of business. Very expensive overhead. Some have "pods" they can activate in periods of high traffic, but a mass increase of ICU beds in this country will never, ever happen unless they basically remove all red tape and regulation (which they won't, because it is there to protect patients).
And who is going out of business now?
I'm not arguing one way or the other about what we're doing to fight the virus, I'm just addressing that one comment you made.
Posted on 3/21/20 at 10:50 am to lsunurse
quote:Yes.
My point is.....what is she saying about the ICUs?
Are they also low occupancy?
quote:Your only point is you want to impress others that you know there's a difference between ICU and regular bed rooms in a hospital, which is common knowledge. Soon you'll tell us that most surgery is performed in surgery rooms.
That’s my point smart arse
quote:And you know nothing about what's going on in Baton Rouge hospitals.
I work in infection control at my hospital as well so I’m also very aware of everything going on in my hospital right now)
This post was edited on 3/21/20 at 10:56 am
Posted on 3/21/20 at 10:52 am to TheCaterpillar
quote:
I'm not arguing one way or the other about what we're doing to fight the virus, I'm just addressing that one comment you made.
My comment was to illustrate how we killed almost every industry in the United States to not over stress one.
Posted on 3/21/20 at 10:53 am to lsunurse
Right but maybe it helps to frees up enough staff to help? I’m assuming extra personnel can be moved around? I realize that functions are different but at least frees up bodies.
This post was edited on 3/21/20 at 10:55 am
Posted on 3/21/20 at 10:53 am to TheCaterpillar
quote:What % of the 150+ hospitals are "very strained"? Is it uncommon for some hospitals to be "very strained" while others are not?
150+ hospitals and yes, very strained in some markets
Posted on 3/21/20 at 10:54 am to SabiDojo
quote:
My comment was to illustrate how we killed almost every industry in the United States to not over stress one.
I think most share your doubts
But the overburdening argument obviously isn't economic when it comes to healthcare
Posted on 3/21/20 at 10:57 am to LSURussian
No I don’t know about BR hospitals and I never claimed to.
My point is that many of these patients being hospitalized for COVID-19 need ICU care.
Doesn’t matter if the hospital has low occupancy of regular beds. All that matters is the ICU bed availability.
I was merely asking if the ICU beds there are full.
And yes....cancelling the elective surgeries is a good thing because of what you said. I know at our hospital they are able to float PACU nurses to the ICUs to help out because of their certifications and experience.
My point is that many of these patients being hospitalized for COVID-19 need ICU care.
Doesn’t matter if the hospital has low occupancy of regular beds. All that matters is the ICU bed availability.
I was merely asking if the ICU beds there are full.
And yes....cancelling the elective surgeries is a good thing because of what you said. I know at our hospital they are able to float PACU nurses to the ICUs to help out because of their certifications and experience.
Posted on 3/21/20 at 11:01 am to SabiDojo
quote:
My comment was to illustrate how we killed almost every industry in the United States to not over stress one.
"Killed almost every industry" is extremely hyperbolic.
I personally think it'll rebound in a massive way. My day trading reflects that, as I've leaned into the market in a major way the last week.
And it wasn't to protect the healthcare industry, the real intention was to protect the patients that use the healthcare system.
The non-COVID patients that need ICUs and ventilators aren't going away. These people will die because of lack of capacity if we don't do something.
I am not an economist and I don't know what the right move to do was here. I won't pretend to know for sure.
I will say that this pandemic has impacted me professionally due to my job in healthcare operations and personally, as my aunt is in lockdown at Lambath House in New Orleans and has seen several of her friends die the last couple of weeks from this.
Also, I think once we have a decently successful antiviral and can get thousands more ventilators, this shite will be over quickly. I think we're pretty close to both.
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