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Started By
Message
re: Bieber's actions blamed on steroid use (Clenbuterol)
Posted on 1/25/14 at 6:26 pm to rocket31
Posted on 1/25/14 at 6:26 pm to rocket31
Testosterone decreases naturally in men starting in their late 30s early 40s. Low T is a natural part of life. There are people young and old with abnormally low levels, and yes testosterone therapy is often effective. Young people that abuse testosterone based steroids prior to reaching full maturity will actually cause premature fusing of growth plates.
1
Posted on 1/25/14 at 6:31 pm to Elephino
This post was edited on 1/26/14 at 7:12 pm
Posted on 1/25/14 at 6:35 pm to rocket31
Any use absent a valid medical condition is abuse. But keep justifying. I'm not judging. I drink beer; a lot. It's the nectar of the gods. It's not good for my liver. I've come to terms with the sacrifice of days from my life.
Posted on 1/25/14 at 6:37 pm to Elephino
quote:
I would love some anecdotal accounts from people who have used high dose HMB or tongkat ali (ingredient from some testojack varieties).
I might can help here...
Moderate does HMB is a waste of money. The science appears to be there, but in the real world, it doesn't work. High dose is purported to work, but is cost prohibitive for most. I used EAS's HMB product (which I trusted for bioavailability and quality) for extended periods. I was absolutely meticulous in my diet and lifting back then. I tracked every calorie I ate broken down by macro nutrient content as well using a glucometer to measure blood sugar responses to everything for weeks. Had a spreadsheet that was extremely accurate as to everything. I went weeks not eating anything I could not measure and know its exact contents.
I separately experimented with HMB as a stand alone and in EAS's Betagen product. Back then (90's) real world results from HMB use was universally terrible. MM and EAS still claimed it was effective but some of their writers (TC who left to form Biotest) later admitted higher doses were needed to be effective. I eventually tried triple what was recommended and believe it was only marginally more effective, but I did not do it for an extended period (cost prohibitive for a college kid) so can't say for sure. Hope that helps.
As for tongkat ali...
It definitely affects libido. I have used it ever since it was first mentioned in the mid-90s off and on. It IS a libido booster. I still take it off and on. As for muscle building, after many years of taking different versions of it from different companies, I have decided it is not effective in muscle building for whatever reason. I know it is supposed to lower SHGB (and therefore should increase free test levels) but I do not believe it helps to any significant degree in the anabolic processes. I think the primary action may be an increase in LH, but not enough to really be anabolic.
The entire hormonal system is complex. I have a theory (that I have never looked for scientific literary verification of) that androgenic properties are important in the equation as well when trying to really illicit an anabolic response when trying to tweak different hormones.
Posted on 1/25/14 at 6:40 pm to Tiger n Miami AU83
BTW, HMB reminds me of myostatin inhibitor manipulation. Can look like it shows promise on paper, but doesn't translate.
Posted on 1/25/14 at 6:44 pm to Tiger n Miami AU83
I'm always trying to keep relevant topics for my students; thanks. My big concern with HMB is the calcium. It comes as the calcium salt typically. Most articles report a minimum of 3 grams for efficacy with doses as high as 12-15 grams. That's a boatload of excess calcium, which is bad for the kidneys, GI, and heart.
Posted on 1/25/14 at 6:49 pm to Elephino
I probably got up to 9 grams of HMB for a day at times. Marginally effective at best even at that level. And cost prohibitive, at least back then, I haven't looked at prices for it in a decade.
I switched to just powdered leucine and glutamine supplementation immediately after workouts. Much cheaper. I swear I got the best pumps ever from creatine, leucine, and glutamine.
I switched to just powdered leucine and glutamine supplementation immediately after workouts. Much cheaper. I swear I got the best pumps ever from creatine, leucine, and glutamine.
Posted on 1/25/14 at 6:50 pm to Elephino
quote:what's your thoughts on cinnamon lowering blood sugar?
Elephino
Posted on 1/25/14 at 6:51 pm to Elephino
And yeah, boatload of excess minerals not good. Not like you can easily pee it out like excess water soluble vitamins.
If you are familiar with Biotest, you should check out their supplement "Superfood". I like it and it is the only vitamin supplement I have taken in forever now.
If you are familiar with Biotest, you should check out their supplement "Superfood". I like it and it is the only vitamin supplement I have taken in forever now.
Posted on 1/25/14 at 6:53 pm to jeff5891
quote:
what's your thoughts on cinnamon lowering blood sugar?
It does, but nothing that is going to overcome or really blunt something with a high glycemic load.
Adding some sort of healthy fat to a meal is gonna do a lot more.
Or obviously controlling the insulin response through the specific carb eaten.
Posted on 1/25/14 at 7:14 pm to jeff5891
Data has been sort of odd depending on the selected outcome. Some claim decreases in blood sugar due to increased insulin response. I recall one study that showed a decrease in postprandial blood glucose when consumed with a high carb meal. However, the glucose levels spiked after a couple hours. Postprandial blood glucose is important, especially in diabetics. I would be concerned with long term insulin resistance and high fasting glucose in disease development though.
Posted on 1/25/14 at 7:45 pm to Elephino
As i said earlier, using steroids correctly or incorrectly is a bad idea.
Posted on 1/25/14 at 7:49 pm to arseinclarse
Well shite.
It's a lung steroid in horses
It's a lung steroid in horses
Posted on 1/25/14 at 7:53 pm to Aspercel
quote:
Well shite.
It's a lung steroid in horses
Aww, its just Bieber's expensive asthma medication. No big deal.
Posted on 1/25/14 at 8:46 pm to PhiTiger1764
Posted on 1/26/14 at 8:20 am to Kcrad
quote:
Stick natural. I did two cycles of diabonal back in the early 80's, haven't pouched them since.
I can see why youd not do them again. Anyone who takes dbol without test is just wasting money and will do nothing but bloat up and mess with their natural test levels. Never understood why people do this.
Btw steroids arent horrible when they are actually done correctly and responsibly. This includes having regular blood panels done, using enough testosterone to more than replace your natural levels, taking the proper ancilliaries (to prevent gyno, hair loss, or maintaining great prostate health, etc), and completing a proper post cycle regimen to kick start your natural test production again. For those that abuse them, sure they will probably run into some problems but there are alot of benefits to your body when actually done correctly.
Posted on 1/26/14 at 8:41 am to Elephino
quote:
I actually teach an elective in vitamins, herbals, and neutriceuticals. I would love some anecdotal accounts from people who have used high dose HMB or tongkat ali (ingredient from some testojack varieties). Yes, I even lift bro. Usually I have my blood drawn in class and pick a supplement to test every year. Anecdotally, I can tell you that high dose raspberry ketone is shite (you will burp raspberries). TTA (tetradecylthioacetic acid) did lower my cholesterol. I will have the current results from this year's high dose beta-sitosterol around St. Patricks day.
I constantly see studies showing that HMB isn't that great. Correct if I'm wrong, isn't it just a fancy form of leucine? I've seem plenty of anecdotal evidence and a few research studies illustrating positive effects of tongkat ali on male hormones. TTA seems like a hit or miss with people, as far as fat loss. I know big pharm has been running trials with it. Fun fact, clen is anabolic, in animals, some think it's because of beta 3 receptors, which humans lack a large quantity.
Posted on 1/26/14 at 8:58 am to GEAUXT
We need to send this gif to the fark board and get Pitt's head replaced with Bieber's:
This post was edited on 1/26/14 at 9:00 am
Posted on 2/3/14 at 4:23 pm to Dire Wolf
quote:
do you even cycle?
please god tell me where i am wrong?
Posted on 2/3/14 at 4:24 pm to arseinclarse
I think the tv said he weighs 145lbs the other day
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